# Council Services Committee - April 6, 2010 > Auto-transcribed civic record · Council · April 6, 2010 - **Permalink**: https://meetings.lexingtonky.news/meeting/1322 - **Source video**: https://lfucg.granicus.com/player/clip/1322?view_id=14&redirect=true - **Date**: 2010-04-06 - **Body**: Council - **Last revised**: June 18, 2026 - **Length**: 14,704 words > ⚠️ **Auto-generated content.** Audio from the official Granicus video was auto-transcribed by OpenAI Whisper-1. Structured facts were extracted with GPT-4o; the narrative summary was written by Anthropic Claude Sonnet. Speaker labels and verbatim wording may contain errors. See [methodology](https://meetings.lexingtonky.news/about/methodology) or [report a correction](mailto:editor@lexingtonky.news). --- ## Meeting Overview The Services Committee of the Lexington-Fayette Urban County Government convened on April 6, 2010, at 1:00 P.M. The meeting covered four agenda items, all of which were informational in nature, addressing topics including the Peddler Ordinance, Mobile Food Vendors, the Emergency Snow Plan, and Yard Sale Regulations. A total of 2 votes were taken during the session, and no public comments were heard. No presiding officer is recorded for this meeting. ## Attendance All members were present at the April 6, 2010 Council meeting. The following ten members were in attendance: - Ellinger - Myers - Lawless - Beard - Feigel - Crosbie - McChord - Martin - Henson - Lane No members were recorded as absent or late. ## Votes and Decisions Two motions were brought before the Council at this meeting, both passing by voice vote. - **Remove yard sale regulations from committee** [timestamp: 1:36:23]: A motion by Henson to remove the yard sale regulations from committee passed by voice vote. No roll call was recorded, so individual member votes are not available. - **Remove the multi-way stop at Glendover and Valley from committee** [timestamp: 1:35:20]: A motion to remove the multi-way stop proposal at Glendover and Valley from committee also passed by voice vote. No mover or seconder was recorded, and no individual member votes are available. Both items were decided by voice vote, so no breakdown of ayes, nays, or abstentions by member is available for either motion. ## Contested Items **Peddler Ordinance Amendments** The proposed amendments to the peddler ordinance generated heated discussion among council members. Concerns were raised about the ordinance's potential impact on special events, as well as questions surrounding the exemption of certain zones from its provisions. The debate reflected disagreement over how broadly the ordinance should apply and whether its current language adequately accounted for the unique circumstances of community events. The council did not finalize the amendments at this meeting; instead, members decided to revisit the ordinance to allow for further review and refinement of its terms. [timestamp: not available] **Snow Emergency Towing** The towing of vehicles during a recent snow emergency drew significant concern from the community and prompted discussion among council members. Residents expressed frustration over the handling of the towing process, suggesting that affected vehicle owners had not received adequate warning or information before their vehicles were towed. The discussion centered on how the city communicates snow emergency declarations to the public and what steps could be taken to improve notification procedures going forward. Council members acknowledged the community's concerns and engaged in conversation about strengthening outreach and communication efforts to ensure residents are better informed during future snow emergencies. No immediate policy change was finalized at the meeting, but the discussion indicated a shared interest in improving the process. [timestamp: not available] ## Peddler Ordinance Blues [timestamp: 08:53] The Council took up a discussion on proposed amendments to the peddler ordinance, with the stated goal of making the ordinance more enforceable by police. Key speakers on this item included Mike Sanner, Ms. James, and Mr. Lane. The discussion centered on several proposed changes to the existing ordinance, including: - **Amendments to fines** associated with peddler violations - **Exemptions for certain zones**, which would carve out areas where peddler regulations would apply differently or not at all - **Enforceability concerns**, with attention given to how police could more effectively apply the ordinance in practice The item was treated as informational, meaning no final vote or binding action was taken at this meeting. The discussion appears to have served as a forum for Council members and speakers to raise questions, present considerations, and debate the scope of the proposed changes before any formal action would be pursued. This agenda item was the first item taken up during the meeting, beginning at approximately the 8-minute and 53-second mark of the session. ## Mobile Food Vendors [timestamp: 32:37] The Council took up a discussion on proposed regulations for mobile food vendors, covering registration requirements and operational limits. Key speakers on this item included Ms. Henson, Dr. Rowe, and Jessica Cobb. The discussion was informational in nature, with no formal vote or binding decision reached at this meeting. The agenda item addressed two primary regulatory areas: - **Registration requirements** for mobile food vendors operating within the jurisdiction - **Operational limits** governing how and where mobile food vendors may conduct business No additional detail on the specific positions taken by individual speakers, the precise regulatory thresholds proposed, or any concerns raised during debate is available from the provided record. The item was treated as a discussion and appears to have been intended to inform the Council rather than to produce an immediate policy outcome. ## Emergency Snow Plan [timestamp: 51:46] The Council took up Agenda Item 3, a discussion of the city's Emergency Snow Plan, covering communication strategies and towing policies during snow emergencies. The item was informational in nature, with no vote or formal action taken. Key participants in the discussion included Ms. James, Commissioner Webb, and Lieutenant Willoughby, who collectively presented and reviewed the components of the snow emergency plan. - **Communication strategies** were addressed as part of the review, examining how the city notifies residents and coordinates response efforts when a snow emergency is declared. - **Towing policies** during snow emergencies were also discussed, covering the procedures and protocols in place for vehicles that obstruct snow removal operations. The outcome of the agenda item was informational, meaning the discussion was intended to brief the Council on the existing plan rather than to propose amendments or seek approval of new measures. No specific concerns, amendments, or directives were recorded in the available data beyond the scope of the general review. ## Yard Sale Regulations [timestamp: 1:23:21] The Council took up a discussion on the current policy governing yard sales, focusing on the practical difficulties associated with enforcing existing regulations. This item was informational in nature, with no formal vote or action taken. Key speakers on this topic included Ms. Henson and Dewey Crow, who participated in the discussion surrounding how yard sale rules are currently structured and the challenges that arise in applying them consistently. The discussion centered on: - **Current policy framework:** The existing regulations governing yard sales within the jurisdiction were reviewed as the basis for the conversation. - **Enforcement challenges:** Concerns were raised regarding the difficulties in enforcing the rules as written, suggesting that the current policy may present practical obstacles for staff or officials responsible for compliance. The item concluded as informational, meaning no specific policy changes, amendments, or directives were approved at this meeting. The discussion appears to have served as an opportunity for the Council to examine whether the existing yard sale regulations are functioning as intended and to surface concerns that may warrant further review or action at a future meeting. --- ## Decisions - **Motion** — passed (0-0): Remove the yard sale regulations from committee - **Motion** — passed (0-0): Remove the multi-way stop at Glendover and Valley from committee --- ## Full transcript Waiting for a man to come home Yes, the TV on, radio blasting the news Somebody down the hall playing the low-down dirty blues My ghetto woman, she's all alone She's just a ghetto woman Waiting for a man to come home Oh, she's a ghetto woman Said she's a ghetto woman Oh, ghetto woman, what's on your mind? Sometimes I look in your face, can't help but cry Oh-oh-oh-oh-oh-oh-oh-oh Oh-oh, oh-oh-oh-oh Oh-oh-oh-oh-oh-oh-oh-oh Oh-oh-oh-oh-oh-oh-oh-oh Oh-oh, oh-oh-oh-oh-oh-oh-oh Oh-oh, oh-oh-oh-oh-oh-oh-oh-oh Oh-oh, oh-oh-oh-oh-oh-oh-oh-oh-oh A few stolen moments is all that you share You've got your family and they need you there Though I try to resist being last on your list But no other man's gonna do So I'm saving all my love for you It's not very easy living all alone My friends try and tell me to find a man of my own But each time I try, I just break down and cry Cause I'd rather be home feeling blue So I'm saving all my love for you You used to tell me we'd run away together Love gives you the right to be free You said be patient, just wait a little longer But that's just an old fantasy I've got to get ready, just a few minutes more Gonna get that old feeling when you walk through that door Cause tonight is the night for feeling alright We'll be making love the whole night through So I'm saving all my love Yes, I'm saving all my love Yes, I'm saving all my love for you No other woman is gonna love you more Cause tonight is the night for feeling alright We'll be making love the whole night through So I'm saving all my love Yes, I'm saving all my love Yes, I'm saving all my love for you For you For you I'm not scared of dying And I don't really care I'm not scared of dying And I don't really care I'm not scared of dying And I don't really care If it's peace you find in dying Well then, let the time be near If it's peace you find in dying And if dying time is near Just bundle up my coffin Cause it's cold way down there I hear that it's cold way down there Yeah, crazy cold way down there And when I die And when I'm gone There'll be one child born In this world to carry on, to carry on Now troubles are many They're as deep as the well I can swear there ain't no heaven But I pray there ain't no hell Swear there ain't no heaven And I pray there ain't no hell But I'll never know by living Only my dying will tell It's only my dying will tell Yeah, only my dying will tell And when I die And when I'm gone There'll be one child born In this world to carry on, to carry on Yeah, yeah Give me my freedom For as long as I be All I ask of living Is to have no chains on me All I ask of living Chairman, let me just say that the premise of these changes in the ordinance, as you have it here, is to make it more readily and efficiently enforceable by the division of police. Under the current wording of the ordinance, a police officer who sees a street vendor, let's say, parked at the curbside and selling food and merchandise from that place without stopping just long enough to make the transaction, will first ask the vendor to move on. And then later, if that is not done, can cite the offender. In this case, now, as revised, the enforcement officer has the option to cite or to arrest the vendor who is not complying with the law on stopping only long enough to make a transaction. Also, the wording of the ordinance has been clarified to make it quite explicit that we're talking about vendors of fruit, candy, food products, or any other article. And in addition, the fine for the offense, if cited, has been raised to a realistic level from, I think, what was the original, the $5 to $25, or not more than $100. One other addition, since we last discussed this issue, and that is Paragraph C, that public property within the B2, B2A, and B2B zones are exempt from the provisions of this section. And that is because of concerns on the part of the Downtown Development Authority, which wants to encourage food vendors parked at curbside in the downtown area. And also maybe wanting to encourage vendors of food products sort of at the push cart level, rather than at the, you know, at the large vans that are often now used for street vending. So that's the reason for that exemption. The main purpose, as I say, is to make enforcement of the ordinance, more efficient. And Mike Sanner has, as you know, worked on this. And perhaps, Mike, you have something to add, or other council members, committee members have questions. I think that covered it all. Could you just go over those, if you would, just the major changes, just reiterate that, please. In Section A, we added food products to make it clear that all sale of any merchandise, including food products, is a violation of the ordinance. Everything was covered. In Section B, a vendor could stay on the street and then be asked to move along and then move ten feet. And he's not in violation of the ordinance. This takes out that loophole and gives the officer the discretion to arrest or cite someone when he happens upon somebody violating the ordinance. Previously, the fine was $5 to $25, and the fine range has been ranged to $25 to $100. And there is an exemption from this ordinance in the downtown zones B2, B2A, and B2B, as was questioned here, I think, a month or two ago at this committee meeting. Thank you. We have some questions from committee members. Ms. James? Chair, I am not a committee member, but I have a question, so I will defer to the committee members. It's fine. Go ahead. Does this have any effect on events in our public parks where food vendors sell in our public parks for events? I don't know if this has an effect. I'm thinking specifically the dirt ball, that's a huge event that occurs out on Georgetown Street at the Douglas Park area. I think it's called Howard Street, vendors set up there for the ball games and such. If it's in the parks, it wouldn't be a problem, but stopping on any street, sidewalk or alley, is it a special event that the Special Events Commission doesn't make a zone? I don't think it's a special event, but there are times when the vendors are actually on the street and not inside the park. They're actually on the street of Howard Street, and you would walk if you were going to purchase from them. You'd be walking across the grass at the park, walking to the side of the curb and purchasing things from the street. Maybe I need more specific. I'm wondering if you thought about that when creating the ordinance. I did not, because I assume that for such special events as dirt ball, just as for Fourth of July, that you would get a permit to operate on the public street. But I appreciate the question, because I am not quite clear on that. I don't think this would affect operations within, say, within the park, but you may well have a question about that. I do have a point about the street, setting up on the street for a special occasion. And as I say, I'm not certain of whether that needs to be looked into. So maybe we could check, and I'd be happy to do that, check with the organizers of that event and check with parks to see how that's actually classified, if it is considered a special event and what dates they have assigned for that. Right. If it's a designated special event like the Fourth of July and some other things, then the Special Events Commission gives a boundary and food vendors are allowed in the boundary. Yeah, see, I don't think it falls under that. It's kind of a month-long thing that goes on. And the last question I have is does the officer have to witness the actual violation, or can pictures and videos be used? Generally they have to witness it. Similar to a misdemeanor, they have to witness it for an arrest. Now they can cite based on other stuff, but they can't arrest anybody. Okay. Thank you. Thanks, Joe. Even under the current wording of this ordinance, those vendors would be in violation. So I think the problem is not with this ordinance, these changes, it's a related issue, and that is whether there needs to be some kind of provision so that given the, like the example of the dirt bowl, special permitting is allowed. And that's what I'm not certain about. But I don't think that it affects the purpose and intent of this ordinance, either in its current form or in the form that I'm proposing. Thank you. Mr. Lane. Could you tell me how this ordinance was, the reason for the ordinance? Was the police department asked for this, or how did this, the revision? You mean the changes? Just on the changes, yes. Yes. I've gotten complaints about this, particularly from the Windburn neighborhood where vendors have set up, I won't say a permanent location, but a stationary location and are selling food from, you know, from the curbside. So they're using the public street as a vending site. Can you tell me what area of town this has been occurring and how many problems we've had with that? Well, within my district, it is just in the one neighborhood, and those are the complaints that I have received. And it simply makes enforcement easier. It doesn't change the intent of the ordinance at all, or the purpose of the ordinance, which is to see to it that street vendors stop on the public right-of-way only long enough to make the sale and then move on. So that the, well, we're all familiar with the ice cream vendors in the summertime, that sort of thing. Ring the bell, stop, sell the product, and move on. And not set up, in this case in a residential neighborhood, you know, on curbside, taking up public space for, you know, for a private sales purpose. I don't know, do we have an ordinance for these vendors, since they're selling food, do they have a business card? Do they have a business license and a health permit, too, or what's the regulation on that? Yes, they do have to be permitted by the Board of Health. Okay. All right. And Council Member Henson knows and probably add to this as well. Okay. Thank you. We don't have that problem in my neighborhood, so I'm a little bit in the dark. Thank you for your answers. I'm concerned about why B2A and B2B zones are exempt. If I understand this correctly, which I may not, first of all, those zones, that's a huge area. But if we're, so someone, say, has a stationary hot dog stand, they can put it anywhere on the public street that they want and leave it there for as long as they want. You want to address that, Mr. Shainer? Yes, in those zones, this ordinance does not apply in those zones. So why are we exempting those zones? I had received from the downtown development authority some concerns about how this would affect those. Well, your example is a pretty good one, like the hot dog stand. And I think there are a couple of other vendors that wanted to set up in the summer months, curbside, with some of those zones. With smaller kind of push cart venues as part of the downtown, what shall I say, ambience. You know, the purpose being to bring people downtown. And my assumption here has been that the downtown area would be a good place to do that. And the downtown development authority would itself bring forward some legislative proposal on how those vendors would be permitted, regulated and so on. And I've asked for that, I've asked that of Director Tate, but I haven't heard back from him. Well, I'm very concerned about exempting these. And I feel like, you know, as a council member that has most of the downtown and a huge part of these zones, I'd like to remove that at this point, we can always add it, but I don't think this is business friendly for our business owners downtown. I mean, they pay property tax, they pay payroll tax, they, you know, and then somebody can pay almost nothing and set up a hot dog stand right in front of their business. They already do it for special events and they really lose a lot of money during special events. So I'm very concerned about exempting this area. And I don't know why Mr. Tate had not spoken to me about it and I'm not sure that any of the business owners know about it. So. I'm not a member of the services committee, so, but I'm certainly open to, you know, to your point. And as I say, my concern is, is with, you know, is with the enforcement issue and it's really not so much with paragraph C. So I take your point and I'd certainly be amenable to attacking it. I think you have a motion in mind. Yeah, at this point we don't have a motion. And he is not part of the committee, so he won't be able to bring the motion forward. So we'll have to have a committee member bring this forward. So if they want to bring it forward without C, that would be okay. Ms. Henson. Thank you, Chair. I have been working on this for quite some time and everyone's addressed issues that I had previously been faced with. But what the problems in my district are not with the little hot dog carts, but mine are with the mobile food vendors where there's actually a trailer or a truck that pulls up to sell food products. I know it's regulated by building inspection. It's regulated with Department of Revenue. It's regulated with the health department. The truck that was brought up earlier was a mobile food vendor, which is different from this. Is that correct? It says any peddler or vendor. Pardon? The ordinance says any peddler or vendor. And they move to public streets. So then they move to private property and they become a fixed fixture there. So we'll get into that with our next item in committee. But I think it's much more complex than it appears. So thank you. I'm going to ask questions about where these areas were. And this is kind of funny, but in the areas where they are is where there's very little retail. So when I talked about having retail and commercial establishments as part of our economic development plan, that's what's happening. So these folks are setting up in places where there's not a lot of other places to go get food. So they have their market. They have their food. They have their water. They have their food. Maybe think about supporting some kind of retail component. Everything is economic development. They're not in places where they should be. They have moved to private property, so I am interested in hearing about that as well. But I would ask, I'm not on the committee, but I would ask that you would consider putting in something that talks about except for in the case where there is a permit. Because I think what we'll find in certain areas when we want to have, I keep thinking about the dirt bowl. There's one side street, the tradition has been that they set up. We just need to clarify whether it's a special event or not. So if we could put something in the language that says except for in the case where there's a special event. I don't see that in this section. Maybe it's in another part of the ordinance that's more lengthy, that's attached to this. In the case where there's a special permit for a special event that goes to the group or whatever. But I think this could be really confusing if someone just took this out of context and didn't see the relevance to the special event thing, unless the special event permit refers back to this ordinance somehow. The Special Event Commission has the authority to designate certain boundaries as a special event festival area. And when they do that, they have control of all food vendors and everything in that area. Even on the streets? Especially on the streets. Like the Fourth of July is the biggest example of that. Again, when I'm looking at this, it's not real clear when I'm looking at it. I do not have the reference back to the special event. Well, generally the city police is aware when there's a special event designated and when there's an area blocked off. And that's why I'm bringing it up, because there has been confusion about that particular event that occurs at Douglas Park, of whether or not at what point is something a special event and at what point is someone just coming to set up. So it, you know, it would be. Well, if you use the term special event, that's through the Special Events Commission in the mayor's office. If you want to designate something else that doesn't go through the Special Events Commission in the mayor's office, we need to use a different term, because that would really confuse people. Would it be confusing to have a part of this that says, except for in the case where the special event, where it's been designated as a special event area? You're talking about by the Special Events Commission, because they're the only ones who can designate a special events area. Yeah. And that's what I'm saying, is would it be confusing to have that included in the ordinance language so that we would know that they're not subject to this if it falls under the special event? The same, yeah, similar to the exemption you have for C. Same kind of thing. Okay. Thank you. In the light of Councilmember James's concerns and Councilmember Hanson's concerns, let me take their concerns back and consult with Mr. Sander and get more information on the street vendor special event issue and also the downtown issue. And perhaps beg the indulgence of the Services Committee to come back one more time. So you want to be on the agenda for next month then? To deal with it and finish it. Thank you, sir. Okay, thank you. I see no more questions on that, so we'll move to the next item. Ms. Henson, the mobile food vendors. Thank you, Chair. This is very, very similar to what we just discussed as far as the peddler's ordinance. We do have changes to their regulations and also have Dewey Crow with building inspection here. What I was hoping, and I'll just enlighten you a little more on the complaints. When Councilmember James referred to retail, that's not necessarily the case in the situations that I've received complaints. There are establishments around where these vendors are set up that sell food. There are places that have bought their space or leased their space, and they have complained that they just don't see how it's fair. Just the same that Councilmember Lawless was talking about with the downtown area. I'm not opposed to competition in any way of vendors. I think it's a good thing, but then it does present traffic concerns, pedestrian and automobile traffic, neighbors complaining about the late hours that the vendors are staying open. So I was hoping to come to some sort of solution. And I would like for, I guess, if Dr. Rowe would come up and explain their recent changes. Welcome, Dr. Rowe. Thank you, all. We just wanted to give you all a heads up. It was proposed sometime during 2009 to go with the 2005 FDA Food and Drug Administration Food Code. So it went through the legislature. They've been doing the Kentucky, the regulations in addition to the KRS and all that kind of stuff. Well, that comes out to the counties. It comes out to the locals. They wanted to make sure that the different food service operations were aware of the changes. And what they tried to do with the 2005 FDA, because before that we were like 1976, it's like the 1976 Food Code. So we've kind of come a little way from 76 to 2005, even though it's 2010, but there you go. So in this Food Code they're trying to look more at the things that actually cause disease. So your temperature of your food, hot food is supposed to be hot, cold food, cold. You're supposed to be washing your hands. They tried to look at more of those sorts of things. You have to be, when the state comes up with something and they've got it out there, you have to be at least as strict as the state. Now you as a locality, your board of health, your council can look at it and be more strict. And Luke will come up and they can just kind of get, we didn't want you all to get caught off guard and start getting a bunch of complaints from the food establishments that are in your districts. But we obviously do an educational campaign with them to let them know that these are the new changes and so that this is what's coming. Good afternoon. I'm Jessica Cobb. And you may have some of these handouts in your packet for today. I'm going to talk a little bit about the changes in the FDA code on the factors that were found most to cause foodborne illness. And that was improper holding temperatures, inadequate cooking, contaminated equipment and food from unsafe forces as well as poor personal hygiene. As Dr. O mentioned, this has been adopted and will go into effect May 1st. So in turn, we here locally adapted our regulation 19, which is the local board of health regulation to cover these changes in the FDA code. Along with what Council Member Henson has been speaking about regarding mobile food vendors. We did put in a provision into our local board of health regulation 19 that all mobile food vendors will have to register with the health department prior to setting up. And this was not required before they were supposed to let us know where they were setting up. But this type of permit allows them to get the permit in any county in Kentucky and then set up anywhere. So there just doesn't leave much control for that. So that's one thing that we chose to address locally since we've been having these issues. One thing it will not address is if people switch out the mobile units as Council Member Henson has been having trouble with in her area in terms of location being kind of held by one unit and then another unit moving in after the 14 day operational period is exceeded. So that's just one thing that we've done that hopefully will maybe help with that problem. And going forward, we'll see how the registry system works for us. In addition, we've also included the temporary food operations may only operate for a period of 14 days. And that's just something that was not previously stated in our regulation, but it was a practice that we had followed. So we're really looking to keep them to that two week window and do a better job of enforcing that. In addition, as Dr. O mentioned, we are going to be beginning to enforce the new food code starting in May. And we have sent out to all local businesses that it applies to the changes that will be made regarding that. So if you get any questions from your constituents, you know, please direct them to us. But they have been sent by mail information regarding those changes. Oh, yes. And one big significant change with the 2005 FDA code is the knowledge requirement. And here locally through our local regulation, we have adopted the food manager training. And that's going to be through the Fayette County Health Department and also a food manager registry system. So each food establishment is going to have to register yearly what food managers that they have. They always have to have a certified food manager on duty at all times their establishment is in operation. So that just will help us better to enforce that knowledge requirement with the new code. Thank you. I think there's some questions. Ms. Henson. Thank you, Jessica. The new regulations, do you see it as affecting the mobile food vendors? Are they adequately supplied with the ability to wash your hands and keep the food at the temperatures needed? I think it's going to help us as assist us in knowing where those units are going to be setting up beforehand. And hopefully keeping them to that two week window. But they are all required as a state mobile unit, they're required to have that plumbing requirement there. So they all have hand washing. And along with food manager certification, correct? They have to have their food handlers card, which is a little bit less in depth training. But they do have to have some type of food safety education. Plus inspection of the unit, correct? Just like any restaurant or whatever. So there's a 14 day permit and it stays with the unit, correct? Yes. And they may not, after that 14 days is exceeded, they may not operate at that same location for another 30 days. That unit. But if they have multiple units, they can bring in another unit and let the other one maybe go to another location? Or that unit can only be used for 14 days? They can only be used for one location after that 14 days. So theoretically, yes, they could get a network of two to three units where they're switching them out. Maintaining a presence at a certain location if they chose to do that. And it is not tied to the address where they're setting? That's correct. We have some constituents contacting us. Thank you. Anything further, Ms. Henson, on this issue? Oh, Mr. Beard? Yes. So they can be back in business or is it a 14 day and they have to reapply? The 14 day they would have to reapply for a different location. For a different location? Yes. So that's kind of a gray area where it's not really defined a different location. I would also choose, but we haven't seen the problem mainly on residential property. It's more on public property that people are leasing the spots to other small business owners. Thank you. The next item on the agenda is the emergency snow plan. I would like to move to the next item quickly to have Dewey come up from building inspection and talk about the mobile food vendors and the permit requirements and the enforcement. Welcome, Mr. Crow. Good afternoon. We do have a 14 day limitation for a mobile food vendor. We limit that to match the health department's 14 day limitation. We do that by address and that has to be appropriately zoned for retail sales. So they're looking at B1, B3 zones, something that will allow retail sales already. We would not approve a location in a residential zone or some other zone that does not allow retail sales of food products. And we do limit those to the 14 day limit that the health department is adhering to. That, again, doesn't prevent them from changing units out. You could have a unit stay in for 14 days, a different unit comes in, they have to come to us, get another certificate to operate again for another 14 days. They can trade those out and maintain a presence at that location basically continually if they have at least three units. Are there any questions? Ms. James. Thank you. Dewey, is this enforced on the weekends too? They're under no limitations. No, no, I'm sorry. For building inspection, for someone to find out if someone is permitted, is that somebody available on the weekend? No, our office is not staffed on the weekends. Okay, thanks. If we know that there's a vendor at a location that is illegal or whatever, then should we take a picture? What should we do? Are you talking about if this comes to light over the weekend or something when our office is not? Right, nights and weekends. Is there a time limit on complaints that they're operating? Well, as I said, there's no time limitation on the approval. They're not limited to any specific hours of operation or any specific days. We just merely approve that site as appropriate for retail sales of food items at that location. We don't limit, there is no limitation on hours of operation or days of operation. The vendors that we're concerned about certainly contact us during our normal business hours and we will investigate and see what's going on and require them to cease operations or get the appropriate approval from our office if they can be. I'm not certain as to how the health department handles complaints in that regard. But you would, if you received a complaint, then you would investigate it, have someone go on at night or on weekends, correct? We can arrange to do that. We do have limited capability due to overtime issues. But, yes, we can arrange in various specific situations to do a weekend or after hours check. And when you give the permits, do you look at, like, if you've given mobile food vendors permits out, do you look at, like, locations in proximity, you know, close proximity to each? There's no restriction on that, just as long as the particular location that they're at is appropriately zoned. They have the permission of that property owner for them to be there. You could have them next door. One location and another one at the next door to that location. There's no limitation. Is this by ordinance? The zoning ordinance doesn't restrict what type of operations occur within B-1 other than that they are a business that's allowed there. If a mobile food vending or food sales, retail sales is allowed in a particular zone, the zoning ordinance doesn't restrict how many restaurants you have in close proximity to one another or how many retail sales businesses you could have there. There's no limitations on it. The zoning ordinance doesn't restrict that. Could we put language in there regarding mobile units or temporary as I see them? Possibly hours of operation, days of operation, and possibly numbers. I'll defer to the law department for comment on that. Okay. That might be something that I will work on. Thank you. And I think Dr. Rowe had something else. And they'll be checking the food service vendors again to make sure that they're washing their hands, that they've got their permit, that the temperature of the food is appropriate, that sort of thing. And then some of you may remember when we started the smoking ordinance enforcement, some of those places it was best for them to be out after hours to see what was going on. I have one quick question and then we'll move on, I guess. With the permit from the health department, you don't look at building inspections permits or anything like that to make sure that they have? We do try to work interagency. We do try to work together. When someone comes in to apply for a permit, we do require that we see a copy of building inspections forms. Okay. Prior to giving the permit. Okay. So you will not give them a permit unless they show you that paperwork, correct? Correct. I was just curious with regard to compliance, if most people have permits and then if they do have permits, if they're in violation of any of your regulations, how frequently that comes up? I don't think it's frequently now as it was years ago. We're pretty sharp. We catch them pretty quickly. If we find either a mobile, well, now if we find a mobile unit that hasn't registered with us or if we find a temporary food operation, then we'll make them close down and come to the office and apply for a permit. Can you give any percentages like 2%, 10%, 15%? Do you have any ballpark numbers? All right. I find that very interesting. And part of the regulation, the mobile food units, once Jessica kind of covered this, the mobile food unit's different from a temporary food service operation. Before, if a mobile food unit, we would go and it's a state permit, so it could be issued in Garrett County, but it would still be valid in Fayette County. If the permit's still good, they can still operate, but they have to register with us prior to setting up at a Fayette County location. Thank you very much. Any more on this issue? Seeing none, we will move on to the third issue, which is the emergency snow plan. It was put in committee by Councilmember James. And Ms. James, if you can go ahead and begin. Thank you, Chair. I'd also like to commend Paul. Paul Schonegger staff did lots of work on this issue. What I did was to just propose a few of the areas that needed to be addressed based on resident complaints following the snow emergency that was declared on February 15th. And I asked for Paul to address several issues. This is in your packet on page 15. His response to my issues, and he's got the issues bulleted there. I wanted to be sure that we reviewed the actual ordinance, which is included in pages 21 through 23 of your packet. Signage was an issue or was raised as an issue from some of the residents or those that were towed. So I wanted to get a location of all the signage and to actually have a picture of what the signage looked like. Full listing of streets along snow, emergency routes. There were some folks that didn't realize or said that they didn't realize there were snow emergency routes. I wanted to be clear what those were. There were some differences in whether a person got sighted and towed or just towed. So I wanted to clarify that. And I asked Paul to do a little bit of research on comparable cities, as comparable as it could be. I mean, how do you find someone that gets exactly the same amount of snow that we get? You can't really do that. But he tried to help with some comp cities so we could figure out their process. And then to outline the process that occurred during the February 15th through 16th snow emergency. What we came out with, which I hope the committee will delve into it a little bit more. There were several things that we could address moving forward. And with the help of the administration, which we've had a meeting with the administration, Paul and I met, a very productive meeting. There are some things they're already working on. One of them came up that you'll find in your packet. There could be some maybe discussion on the communication of the emergency, how that information gets out to our citizens and to us, to UK. The second one was kind of an examination or understanding of the snow emergency route. There is a process of determining what the snow emergency route is. I wasn't aware of that until we had our meeting. So it was nice to hear that from the administration. Route signage, clarifying where it needs to be. For example, if it's a one-way street, there are some folks that have an understanding that signage is only needed on one side of the street if it's one way versus both sides, even when parking is on both sides. So we need to clarify whether or not that is the case and make sure that that's well known throughout the administration and to our citizens. Also towing and sighting policy. This is another one of the areas where the police have the discretion as far as sighting. And some, we just needed to clarify what that police discretion is and come to a common understanding of what type of judgment the officers will use in that case. And then maybe an improvement on internal communication so that there's not a discrepancy between the administration, other divisions of government and council when it comes to the declaration of the snow emergency and how can we work better together. So overall, what I found from Paul's research and from our conversation is that there were justifiable reasons why snow emergency needed to be called. The process was followed as it was known, but there didn't seem to be a lot of coordination of the process. And it just wasn't extremely clear of what the process was, probably because we don't do it very often. And it's just not scripted enough. There are some things that the administration that I hope will come forward today that they talked about making some changes to or considering, so I do look forward to the conversation on it. And I hope in the end we're able to educate our citizens a little bit better and make it very clear where the snow emergency routes are. And maybe next time if we have to do it, we have, you're always going to get complaints, but maybe we'll get, maybe we'll have a way to target those citizens at the time the emergency is declared to reduce the number of complaints that we would have on a constituent level. Thanks, Chair. Thank you. I think we have also in here some recommendations that were provided for Mr. Schoeniger, too, on page 32. Would you like to go through or would you like to have the administration come and talk? I think we can hear from the administration on the issues that were raised, and then we can look at the recommendations. I think we have the Commissioner Webb here, and also I think we have Mr. Williams here, too. And also we have, is the law department here? Is Ed Gardner here? Yep, there he is. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I think one of the things that we talked about yesterday after the snow emergency was called was E911 has the ability to make a reverse call, a call out, and we, Kevin has done some preliminary work about utilizing their system. If you have a hard line, telephone line, and you were on an emergency route, that system could generate a call to you letting you know that a snow emergency has been called. Also looking at, I believe the police department attempted to use the University of Kentucky notification system, but getting that contact in place for snow emergencies, since it does affect so many students, they have a really good system where it sends out emails and makes calls. So looking at that for notification. We will be looking at the signage. During our snow emergency review, it's typically in August where we review the plan, update the plan. At that time, that's the time of the year that traffic engineering reviews the signs that are out there. We're going to take a look at where we're missing signs, but they are reviewed each year. We did find that we think it was part of the Newtown Pike extension construction where a couple were removed that were identified as being there in August, but were removed during that construction on Main Street. But looking at the issue of signs on both sides of the street, we may need to amend the ordinance. If you only have parking on one side of the street, then it would make, and it's a one-way street, it would not make sense to sign both sides of the street when you only park on one side. So just in an effort to save money to make sure that we're not putting out signs where you can't park. We also are considering a lesser snow emergency that would not impact the entire network of snow emergency routes. Our biggest issues are in downtown where it's more congested parking, that there are flooding issues in the downtown area. If you get snow and then you get rain and we can't get to those catch basins, we did have two years ago, we did have flooding issues down there and had to have a snow emergency almost specifically for that reason to get those cleared out. So we are considering that also. We'll continue to discuss it and we'll bring that back. it and we'll bring that back whenever we do our annual review and amend that if necessary. As it comes to the the ticketing of people and the towing of vehicles, I'd rather have the police department step up and discuss any communications or any discussions they've had about that. If anyone has any specific questions about what we may have done or considered or what went on that day, I'd be glad to try to answer that. Any questions, Ms. James? Well, thank you, Chair. One thing, Commissioner, that I thought was a really good point that I hadn't thought about until I was in the meeting with you, I think it was Rob from Urban Forestry that talked about how one of the most important things was that snow gets packed in those inlets and that when the expectation of higher snow or more snow that will add up on that already packed snow, that it's very important that we get vehicles removed so that we can clear the inlets for stormwater issues. I think that's something that moving forward as we try to educate our citizens of why this is important. There is a couple reasons, and if you go back to February 15th, we were in a period of really below normal day and night temperatures where we had had a frost line go down and the ground had frozen down pretty far. We were below where salt is effective, so we're mixing with calcium chloride. That particular morning, we had been out and cleared roads and laid down salt and calcium chloride, had heavy winds, and the streets and roads that we've been on would just get recovered. So based on the forecast, we did decide that a snow emergency was appropriate. It looked like we were going to get quite a bit more snow. And there's also an issue with clearing roads when you have parked cars. There's two issues. Number one is whenever your roads aren't clearing and you have those trucks go back and forth and you're getting into the evening hours, you have a much greater risk of damage to a city vehicle and any parked vehicle there. In addition to that, if you build up quite a bit of snow when you're clearing and you push that over in front of parked vehicles, you start to have problems for those vehicles getting out of their parking spaces. Now they have to be dug out. And we were, with the forecast we were looking at, we were looking at that potential also in addition to the drainage issues that we have. Thank you. Are there any other questions? Any other questions for Commissioner? I think at this point we'd like to hear from Public Safety if we could, and I think police is here. And I think this is kind of what precipitated this issue was some of the towing and issues. Welcome. Hello, I'm Lieutenant Willoughby with the traffic section. After reviewing the situation that we found through the snow emergency, there was not a requirement that the vehicles had to necessarily be ticketed before they were towed. So obviously we had some people that received citations and some that did not, even though the vehicle was towed. Looking at that, I think what the policy is going to be, and we're in the process of reviewing our towing and citation policies regarding this issue, if there is a snow emergency declared, then we will strictly tow the vehicle only. Any other time that we will tow a vehicle, then there will be a citation issue to go along with that to justify it. It has predominantly been left up to officer discretion whether they ticketed and towed as well. So that's what came up with this, is we had some officers that thought they had to issue a ticket before they towed the vehicle, so they did. Some felt that they were justified in towing, which they were by ordinance. And that's being corrected? Yes, sir. We're looking at, we're going to adjust those policies that address that so that we implement for a snow emergency, there will not be a citation issue, but the towing will still take place so that we can help streets and roads get these roads cleared. Then if it's some other type of situation where we're going to tow a vehicle, there will be a citation issue as well, such as a fire lane or some other violation. One of the issues I think was people were making sure they were being notified, and I think we're going to try to do a better job of that. I think that was the E911 division was trying to work that out with their reverse 911 capabilities. I know that the clear unit, which was assigned to the division of police, tried to work with UK, trying to get their notification system activated. And I think because of the holiday and some things like that, that it hampered those efforts. So we're trying to review those situations as well. We're also trying to look at working a little closer with streets and roads so that we clear specific routes that they're clearing, that we're going to get the vehicles removed as they clear those roads. I think when they issued the snow emergency, it was across the city and the entire city wide. And obviously we were towing vehicles a long time ahead of streets and roads getting those roads plowed. Thank you. I think we have some questions from council members. Ms. Lawless? Who did the towing? Bluegrass towing. And my understanding from a lot of people in the downtown area and my constituents is that they just, they had the authority or it seems they had the authority to tow cars without being dispatched to do so by the police. Who had the authority to tow? Bluegrass towing. No, ma'am. They had to have a police officer go there and tow. It was not, they cannot tow on their own. It has to be requested by the police. Okay. Because I think, and the other issue was people's cars got towed and then they never did go down the street and shovel snow. So. And I think that's one of the issues that we said we towed ahead of streets and roads, obviously, but that we got so far ahead of them that I think they didn't catch up by the time they went to the next day because there were a few issues like that. Okay. And I'll try to get some more information on the towing. Sure. Because yeah, the reason we use bluegrass is the contracted towing service and the police officer has to make that request. So one more just quick question about that. Does the, so do we pay bluegrass towing to do it? No. The person that is towed ends up paying the tow bill. Okay. We have a contract with them and that's our towing service for the city. Right. Do we pay? We have to contact them to tow. We contact them because they have the city contract and then the person that is towed pays the tow bill. And I think in this case it was about $90. Paul, you have it. And what are the breakdowns on the cost? The tow itself is $60 and then there's a storage fee of $30 per day and that storage fee starts the minute the vehicle gets to the lot. So it's a minimum of $90. Any other questions, Mr. Lawless? Mr. Lane? My question is if somebody has private property, they can enter into an agreement with the towing company to take cars off private property without the police being involved in that. That's correct. So that may be where there's confusion. Council Member Lawless? It's like an apartment complex or something like that. That could have been. But we're talking about city streets. And then just for the record, bluegrass towing, they have to competitively bid for the contract on an annualized basis of every couple of years or so in order to get our contract. Is that correct? I believe that's correct. Okay. Thank you. Ms. James? And I think Commissioner Webb, did you want to add anything into that? Just wanted to add that there's a map in your packet that shows where the vehicles were towed. Right. You can see most of them are around the downtown area. Ms. James? Well, yeah. I was going to refer to the map, and I was also going to say that one of the recommendations that I think can come from this is looking at the areas. There's some clustered areas from where folks were towed. You know, maybe that there's some type of, from the council perspective, some type of educational efforts that we can make with them. Because just as Council Member Lane said, what some cities do, or they find, not the cities, but the individual neighborhoods or folks in the areas will find places where they can go and park in the case of an emergency so that they're not towed. So if we had the type of notification system like the reverse 9-1-1, we could then inform the folks, and they could take it upon themselves that if they have a plan worked out, like I'm looking around that Maxwell Street area, Diane, I think that's your district. If there was some designated place where as soon as they got notification, they could go and move their vehicles to that place, and that way they could avoid the tow. But the officers, once they get that call, the state of emergency, then they're going to have to go out and start towing. But maybe that advanced notification could help a little bit. Diane, go ahead. The big issue was I think that when the announcement was made was at a time at 6 p.m., and that part of the policy needs to look at, I mean, it could have been made earlier, and more people would have had an opportunity to be notified. Yeah, I think, and Commissioner Webb mentioned this at our meeting, we talked about the process that you get to before it can actually occur, and I know that that is, there's something that deals with the Commissioner of Highways out of Frankfort. There's something that is a process they're going to try to streamline to where they would be able to do something maybe more efficiently from that level. And also just talking about like one of the things I think we need to do as a council is we need to be on that list. If it's a reverse 911, maybe we automatically get it. If it hits any part of our district, that way we're aware, so we could try to connect with some of the neighborhood associations and get the information out. Moving forward, maybe that's something we can think about. It's more, I don't know, preemptive, I don't know what the word is, where folks know as much in advance as possible, but I know that you want to make that effort. I'm just not sure how we can make that happen at this point. We just need to talk about it more. We were looking at how we could get a letter of approval. Actually the ordinance calls for an approval from the Secretary of Transportation to have a snow emergency. That was not a huge holdup. It did take some time, but it was not a huge holdup. I think what everyone is extremely conservative before we ask for a snow emergency to make sure that we need it. Because once you get it started, you can't just stop it. So whenever you talk about the time of day, part of that really rolled into the fact that it was a holiday issue. But I don't think anybody wants us to try to make a decision well ahead of time because of the way the forecasts change. Making early decisions may mean people get towed that would not really need to be towed. Not that I don't like doing everything at the last minute, but before we get out there and tow people, I'd like to give us as much time as we can to make sure we need a snow emergency. I guess that's what I would like to say. If we have one year because we need it, I'd rather do that than I would have three a year because we might need it, if you understand what I'm saying. We'll be impacting people three times more if we try to call one eight hours before we think we need it or four hours before we think we need it. I believe it would make us have more. The data that changes so fast in this area. I think what I was referring to was not the declaration earlier, but kind of a warning that a declaration may, that there's 18 inches of snow that are being called for. If you have a place to move your vehicle, you may want to start looking at moving it at this point. Even though the state of emergency has not been declared yet, just an advance notice because here's what will happen if we come around to your street and your vehicle is still there. I understand that from our meeting, but that probably is a very good idea and really a little bit more information as we get public information when we first move into snow season about snow emergencies. Right, that's true. Thank you. Mr. Lane and then Ms. Lawless. Commissioner Webb, I think to your last appearance here, there was a request made to check and see if the snow routes are on our website and the list of the streets so that somebody that's new in the community, the snow plan had a list of streets and roads that were part of the snow emergency routes. However, we found it to be and our citizens found it to be somewhat confusing because of Main Street, Richmond Road, Lee's Town Road type situation, where it started, where it ended on each of those. So what we did is we put it in a map that was color coded. I believe it's in red. So if you live on Main Street and you pull it up and you look, you don't have to look for the name. You can see the red line going through there. And I believe that was put on there. I'm sorry, Kevin's gone. But I think we got that on there pretty quick after that snow emergency. Do you know how to get to that on the website? They did have it right on the, during the rest of the snow season or for most of the snow season, the plan was on the front page and you could just go click on it. Whether it's been removed since the weather's warmed up or not. So I can get a note out to you about, some of those things are kind of difficult for me to find once it's not on that front page. Okay. Thank you. That was all I had. Ms. Lawless. I agree with Council Member James that it would help a lot if early in the day, I mean, that day there was a ton of snow because I was out in it, to let folks know that there might be a snow emergency and what that means. And so we can also alert our constituents because a lot of the snow emergency routes are in my district. And the other thing is that the thing that was unsettling for me was that there was a press release that went out saying the mayor was going to have a press conference. And that went out at like five. But I didn't find out what it was about until I turned on the news at six. So that would have been another hour that people could have been notified and given information. So thank you. Thank you. One more question. We talked about the towing. And I think I read in the paper about the discretion. The police were trying to knock on doors and try to find whose cars were whose, weren't they, before they tried to tow? That's correct. They tried to go up in the immediate area and knock on doors. They ran license plates and that type of thing to try and determine who the vehicle belonged to. And if they couldn't make any contact, then obviously they had no other choice except to go ahead and tow it. Thank you. And now we have on page 32 the recommendations. I guess I want to know where do we go from here? Do you want to come back to us with the information that's been provided in trying to look at some of these issues? Or I know Mr. Schoeninger had put these recommendations in here and things to look at. And I just want to know how we're going to address that. Ms. James, you might want to. Well, I had, yeah, Paul's recommendations are good. And that's based off of where the flaws, and Paul can nod, I guess, where the flaws were basically found or where things could have maybe been improved or where the administration has already said they want to make improvements. But one of the things that I would like to see is for, and maybe it already happens but I miss it, but for the snow emergency plan, like after the sign, the sign review that Commissioner talked about, I'd like to see that come back to or come to services committee or come to council or something so that as we put it up on, you know, a screen, that citizens can see visually where those streets are and then we can take that information back. I usually share information from my work sessions or committees with my neighborhood. So we could take that back and say, you know, you all have this for your review. Right now I think it's an administrative policy, but I don't know if it's, you wouldn't know to go there unless you knew that's what you were looking for. Like, you know, I don't know unless we're saying everyone's been, you know, this is national look at the snow emergency plan online going there. You don't really refer to it until you've been towed really to kind of clarify that. So I think I'm just looking for a way, a policy that gets, or procedure that gets council a little bit more involved in where the streets are so that we can then come and spread that wealth back to our citizens. And I guess I'm wondering, are they going to be coming back to us then? Because there were some recommendations in here that I thought were good suggestions when we're looking at communicating. Are we going to be working on the communication and the reverse 9-1-1 and looking at the snow emergency plan in general that maybe there are more streets on there that need to be on there? I think that was one that was addressed in here. The towing and the signage and internal communication, are those things that you're going to be looking at, Commissioner, and will you be coming back to us and saying what you've addressed, haven't addressed, or? I'd be glad to come back at intervals. Like the sign review, that's something we'll have to work in because that will have to go out in the field and verify. So that would be what we'd probably like to try to get that done by our August review. Some of the other things that we already have in place, some of the things we're working on, like with the E9-1-1 reverse call, we can report back to this committee. However, I had not discussed that with Councilmember James on how that needed to be done. I guess you're going to be meeting in August preparing for the next winter. That's whenever we try to. Actually, the work on this plan goes on, some work goes on all through the years. We usually do a review with several different groups, including Fayette County schools, in August. We're trying to move their meeting up right now so that we can get some of their issues dealt with early. But I think August, or the end of August, would be an appropriate time for us to come back here. Obviously, I know if we don't meet the sign every thousand feet, there's something we need to be addressing. So as we identify it, you know, unless you all just want to know the issues as we find them. I think coming back before the next August, after that August meeting, and giving us an update where we stand and what's been addressed, and if there's something that we need to look at. These things that we have been able to get done. Well, and one of the things was the signs. If we have one-way streets, like this is something we can do right now. If we have one-way streets that only have signs on one side but parking is on both sides, that's actually a budget issue. Because we need to make sure we have in the budget for Brad Fraser's group to have the money to put those signs up if we're going to include them on the snow emergency route. Otherwise, there needs to be coordination. So whatever's identified needs to have signage appropriately. So I think that's something that probably needs to happen within this budget session so that we know how many signs we need. I guess if you get that information to pass that along to us so we can put that into the budget for the fiscal year 11. I will do my best, but we have a lot of space to cover before I can get you that information. Well, we may have an intern or someone that would be willing to walk the street. I mean, if it's manpower to do that and identify using the information we have. How many streets, though, fall within that category? I wouldn't think it would be too many. There's 80 miles of snow emergency routes. Some of those are two-way streets and should be signed. And if they have parking on both sides, they should be signed on both sides. Some of those streets are one-way streets that have parking on both sides. They should have signs on both sides. Some of those streets are one-way streets with parking on one side. They only would need signs on one side. Now, in order to clarify that within the ordinance, we may need to make some changes to the ordinance about what gets signed on both sides. That's something that we need to address then. Right. And once we know what's out there for sure, then we can bring that back. Sounds good. Anything else for the commissioner? Thank you all. Thank you, Lieutenant. The last item on the agenda was put in by Ms. Henson, the yard sale regulations. And I think we have Mr. Barbary here from the law department also here. He's shaking his head no. He is here. Ms. Henson. Thank you, Chair. I put this in committee in hopes of after receiving numerous complaints throughout the district of individuals pretty much operating a business out of their front yard or garage, but having numerous yard sales every weekend and so on. And I thought it would be easy enough to regulate just by permitting it and only allowing two permits in a year. But as it turns out, it's not that simple. Currently building inspection does not have the technology to do permitting online, making it inconvenient for individuals having a yard sale. And if you were to do it by phone and mail, it would be too labor intense and too costly. So what I decided, rather than pull it from committee, to just go ahead and have Dewey come from building inspection and talk about the current policy. It's not an ordinance. It's a building inspection policy that regulates yard sales. Welcome, Dewey. Good afternoon again. As Council Member Henson said, this is not an ordinance. We operate under a policy that basically says you can have a yard sale, two yard sales a year of three days duration each. There's no permit required for that. This policy has been, predates me. This policy was in effect when I came here 20-some years ago. Apparently it was created out of a need to address the issue of yard sales or garage sales occurring in residential zones. If you look at strictly what the zoning ordinance says, that's a retail sales business and it's basically prohibited in a residential zone. Without this policy, we would be, our only recourse would be to cite individuals having yard sales for violation of the zoning ordinance operating a retail business. So this policy serves a purpose to basically give us guidelines as to what point you are operating a business. So if you're exceeding the two a year of three days duration each, then at that point we proceed to pursue you on the basis of operating a retail business in a residential zone. Ms. Henson, do you have any questions for him? I would just like for you to explain how the enforcement part of that will work when a complaint is received. Well, we don't do any of this proactively. We don't have that capability. We strictly respond by complaint basis. If we receive a complaint that a garage or yard sale has been operating continuously or they were doing more than two a year, we send an inspector out to and talk to the individual having the yard sale. If they are having it at the time, then that's documented. In lack of anything else, we document that as their first yard sale because we don't know what occurred. Even though the complaint may state they've been doing it for two or three weekends or every day for a week, our first evidence that they're having one is the site visit by an inspector. So that's then on a go forward. We have documented that you have had the yard sale. They're informed of what the limitations are, and we start tracking it from that point. If we get the next complaint that they've had it again, we respond again to that. And we create a tracking. We track it by the complaints. What do you do on the third one then? Pardon? What do you do when you go out for the third time within that year? The third time they are cited to district court would be our criminal citation. We have not, I couldn't find any records in recent years where we have cited anybody. Our inspectors are telling us they generally get fair compliance. Again, it's a problem of documentation of when it occurred. Sometimes they will move over to the next house. Then that starts the tracking over again. Apartment complexes are a tough issue. You don't know exactly what tenant is doing it in the apartment complex. They may be having a yard sale in the apartment parking area. We don't know. It's hard to determine what tenant is actually doing that because theoretically you could say that each tenant is allowed to do two a year, three days duration. So there are some problems with enforcing the policy as is. But without the policy, again, if you are having a yard sale or a garage sale anywhere you are in violation of the zoning ordinance and subject to immediate enforcement action for operating a retail business. As I said, the policy just serves as a guideline to us to allow what at some point was deemed to be a reasonable number of yard sales without technically falling into violation of operating a retail business. Thank you. I think we have some questions from Councilmembers. Mr. Lane? Yes, I don't have a question for Mr. Crowe. But I just was going to say I did have several neighborhood associations contact me and tell me that the permitting for yard sale was over bureaucracy and they were totally against it. So I sort of stick with that position also. Thank you. Mr. Beard? Thank you, Chair. This is probably going to be more Mr. Barber's answer that I'm looking for. It involves in these regulations about the yard sign. Now, I can put five yard signs in my yard if they're political, just so long as one of them or two of them aren't mine. Actually, currently under the way we enforce political signs, you probably put as many as you want in your yard. Well, that's kind of what I thought, too. But I wasn't real sure how you were functioning. There is a First Amendment issue about all that, is there not, Dave? I haven't looked specifically at the signage, but generally speaking, there's less of a concern for this type of regulating this type of sign because this type of sign is directed towards a commercial activity. I think that's why there's the limit on it. It would be similar to if they actually had a legitimate business operation in a business zone, similar to how you all regulate the number of signs now. If it was a non-commercial type sign, political or other type of free speech like the one you see on Main Street as you drive in, those types of signs we really cannot restrict in the same manner that we could a commercial one. So I think the idea is it's being similarly treated to a business type sign, which is why there's that restriction. I guess I wouldn't say that a yard sale would be a business in and of itself anyway. It's generally a family situation or two families put together or whatever. Thank you all. Any other questions for Mr. Crow? Mr. Crow, how do you feel about the way that the policy is right now? Do you think there needs to be anything, any changes, or do you think it works as it is presently? Well, there's been some issues, obviously, and I think Councilman Henson has had some problems in her district with some garage sales that have attempted to operate on kind of a continuous basis. I know we did address one last year that was a problem. We got that resolved. I think there has been some instances of where some individuals have attempted to operate basically selling out of a vehicle parked on the public street. That's a different issue, and that's something that we don't have the authority to go after them for selling off the public street. That's a different issue, only if they were selling on private property. I look back at our total complaints, I think in 2009, I believe we had something on the order of 14, if memory serves me correctly, that we received about garage sales that were either continuously operating or they've had more than two in a given year. I did not find any criminal complaints that we filed against those and the inspectors and investigators said generally one visit. Most people aren't aware of the limitation of what the policy says and most people then adhered by that. Again, we will pursue them criminally if they do not voluntarily comply. I see the herald leader in the back, so I'm sure they might have a little article to apprise people of what the policy is that will help the two times in a year to let people know what we require of them. So that should help. Is there any other questions for Mr. Crow? The last item on the agenda are items in committee. Mr. Schoeniger, could you kind of go through where we stand on all these? Sure. The first four in bold type motions we dealt with today, the graffiti removal, and again, if a council member is involved in the issue and I'm saying something incorrectly, feel free to correct me. The graffiti removal issue, the graffiti issue, I believe there's been a task force or a subcommittee formed. The snow plan, they've asked for some additional, the committee has asked for some additional information to come back, I think, before the next snow, which would be probably the same time the emergency snow ordinance comes back. The leaf collection program put in by Council Member Henson, that will be ready for the next month's meeting. Similar to Council Member Meyers' issue about the Mortgage Lending Practices Commission, that will be the presentation made next month unless you folks object. The solid waste ordinances, and this is basically, as I understand, giving a little more teeth to the roll carts staying on the street, that will be ready for the next month. And to be honest with you, after that, I can punt and peck and try to figure out, but I'm not familiar with what's going on with the rest of the items. Council Member Lalas has an issue about West Main and Vine Street, pedestrian safety. The loading and unloading issue was in committee. You've asked for some more information, and the administration is supposed to come back to you folks. The private solid waste providers, there's, I believe, a task force or a subcommittee working on that. Horse cruelty, again, Council Member Beard could probably better address that. The multi-way stop at Glendover and Valley, the neighborhood was directed to put a petition together. Hold on just a second. Mr. Beard on that one, where do we stand on that? Because I've not received back the petition form, so it's length of time. I think we can take this off until we hear maybe. We have a motion to take this off. We have a motion and a second. All those in favor say aye. Aye. I suppose that one will take off. The last item, I think you folks have asked for an annual report from General Services, the difference between gasoline use and how much we're reimbursing employees. That should be ready whenever the committee so desires. Mr. Lane. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. We had had a report from David Lucas on numbering of streets, residential and commercial locations, and I was under the impression that we were going to try to ramp up enforcement of that before the World Games come in. And I'd like to put that back on, if I may, as an item. I think it would be probably appropriate at the work session today if you want to make that motion and put it in services and we'll put that in here. All right. That's what I'll do then. Thank you. Anything else? Ms. Henson. I want to make a motion to remove the yard sale regulations. We have a motion to second. Any discussion? All those in favor say aye. Aye. I suppose we'll remove that. Anything else? I will entertain a motion to adjourn. Second. We have a motion to second. All those in favor say aye. Aye. I suppose we are adjourned. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Maybe we'll never be seen together at night on a crowded street. I may never reach across your body to kill the light in your sleep. Maybe I'll never watch you dressing. I won't sound too familiar on the phone. But I can touch your hand accidentally and take that moment home. That's as close as I'll get to loving you. Even though there's nothing else I'd rather do. I can dream. I can hope. I can escape. But still I know. That's as close as I'll get to loving you. I won't be there when you need holding. But I'm sure that he can pull you through. I can sing this song to everybody and pretend it's not about you. That's as close as I'll get to loving you. Even though there's nothing else I'd rather do. I can dream. I can hope. I can escape. But still I know. That's as close as I'll get to loving you. That's as close as I'll get to loving you. Even though there's nothing else I'd rather do. I can dream. I can hope. I can escape. But still I know. That's as close as I'll get to. Yeah, that's as close as I'll get to. That's as close as I'll get to loving you. That's as close as I'll get to loving you. That's as close as I'll get to loving you. Like they always say, it's good for the gaze, it's always good for the gander, our sailor. Oh, baby, love me right, let me love you to get around. Can't you let the others be, cause with you is where I get to be. Oh, sugar, well you've been hanging out with the male friends. Listen, somebody's gonna hurt you, so will you love to keep hurting me? We're saying, oh, oh, Sheila, let me love you till the morning comes. Oh, oh, Sheila, you know I want to be the only one. Oh, baby, understand that I want to be the only man. But it seems someone's getting too hard, and I think I'll start to have my own fun. Oh, baby, it's plain to see that you're qualified to fulfill your needs. You think you're doing over on me, well honey, baby, just wait and see. And we're saying, oh, oh, Sheila, let me love you till the morning comes. Just wanna say, oh, oh, Sheila, you know I want to be the only one for her. Oh, baby, one, two, three, I love you, baby, honestly. Oh, I want to dee-da-dee-da-dee, dee-da-dee-da-dee. Oh, oh, Sheila, oh, oh, Sheila, oh, oh, Sheila, oh, oh, Sheila. Oh, baby, love me right and let me love you till the day I die. Can't you let the others be, cause with you is where I got to be. Yeah, oh, baby, understand that I want to be the only man. You think you're doing over on me, well honey, baby, just wait and see. And we're saying, oh. She's so lucky. Oh, oh, Sheila, let me love you till the morning comes. Oh, oh, Sheila, you know I want to be the only one. Oh, oh, Sheila, let me love you till the morning comes. Oh, oh, Sheila, you know I want to be the only one. Here we go. Don't you feel it growing day by day? People getting ready for the move. Some are happy, some are sad. Oh, we gotta let the music play. What the people need is a way to make them smile. It ain't so hard to do it, you know how. Gotta get them messy, get it all through. You know that mama's gonna do anyway. Oh, oh, listen to the music. Oh, oh, listen to the music. Oh, oh, listen to the music. All the time. Well, I know you know better than everything I say. Meet me in the country for a day. We'll be happy and we'll dance. Oh, we're gonna dance the blues away. But if I'm feeling good to you and you're feeling good to me. If I'm feeling good to you and you're feeling good to me. There ain't nothing we can't do or say. Feeling good, feeling fine. Oh, baby, let the music play. Oh, oh, listen to the music. Oh, oh, listen to the music. Oh, oh, listen to the music. All the time. Like a lazy falling river. Surrounding castles in the skies. And the crowd is growing bigger. Got more power than I ever was. Oh, oh, listen to the music. Oh, oh, listen to the music. Oh, oh, listen to the music. All the time. Oh, oh, listen to the music. Oh, oh, listen to the music. Oh, oh, listen to the music. All the time. I spent 20 years trying to get out of this place. I was looking for something I couldn't replace. I was running away from the only thing I've ever known. Like a blind dog without a bone. I was a gypsy lost in the twilight zone. I hijacked a rainbow and crashed into a pot of gold. I've been there, done that. I ain't looking back on the seeds I've sown. Seven times, spending too much time on the telephone. Who says you can't go home? Who says you can't go home? There's only one place they call their one and only home. Just a hometown boy born and rolled in the stone. Who says you can't go home? Who says you can't go back? Been all around the world and now it's a matter of fact. There's only one place left I want to go. Who says you can't go home? It's alright, it's alright, it's alright, it's alright, it's alright. I went as far as I could. I tried to find a new face. You're missing one of these lines. And I won't rest. I've lived a million miles of memories on that road. And every step I take, I know that I'm not alone. You took the home from the boy, but not the boy from his home. These are my streets, the only life I've ever known. Who says you can't go home? Who says you can't go home? There's only one place they call their one and only home. Just a hometown boy born and rolled in the stone. Who says you can't go home? Who says you can't go back? Been all around the world and now it's a matter of fact. There's only one place left I want to go. Who says you can't go home? It's alright, it's alright, it's alright, it's alright, it's alright. Who says you can't go home? Who says you can't go home? It's alright, it's alright, it's alright, it's alright, it's alright. Who says you can't go home? I've been there, done that. I ain't looking back. It's a long, long road. Feels like I never left. That's how the story goes. It doesn't matter where you are. Doesn't matter where you go. If it's a million miles away or just a mile to roll. Take it in. Take it with you when you go. Who says you can't go home? Who says you can't go home? There's only one place. They call me one of their own. Just a hometown boy. Born and raised in the stone. Who says you can't go home? Who says you can't go back? Been all around the world and now it's a matter of fact. There's only one place left I want to go. Who says you can't go home? It's alright. It's alright. Who says you can't go home? It's alright. Who says you can't go home? It's alright. Who says you can't go home? It's alright. Give me a ticket for an airplane Ain't got time to take a fast train Lonely days are gone, I'm a-goin' home My baby used to wrote me a letter I don't care how much money I gotta spend Got to get back to my baby Lonely days are gone, I'm a-goin' home My baby used to wrote me a letter When she wrote me a letter Said she couldn't live without me no more Listen mister, can't you see I got to get back to my baby once more Anyway, yeah Give me a ticket for an airplane Ain't got time to take a fast train Lonely days are gone, I'm a-goin' home My baby used to wrote me a letter When she wrote me a letter Said she couldn't live without me no more Listen mister, can't you see I got to get back to my baby once more Anyway, yeah Give me a ticket for an airplane Ain't got time to take a fast train Lonely days are gone, I'm a-goin' home My baby used to wrote me a letter My baby used to wrote me a letter My baby used to wrote me a letter My baby used to wrote me a letter My baby used to wrote me a letter Oh, play me some mountain music Like grandma and grandpa used to play Then I'll float on down the river To Cajun Hideaway Drift away like Tom Sawyer Ride a raft with old Huck Finn Take a nap like Rip Van Winkle Daydreaming again Oh, play me some mountain music Like grandma and grandpa used to play Then I'll float on down the river To Cajun Hideaway Swim across the river Just to prove that I'm a man Spend the day bein' lazy Just bein' nature's friend Climb a long tall hickory Bendin' over skin and cans Playin' baseball with turd rocks Usin' sawmill slabs for beds Play some back home come on music That comes from the heart Play somethin' with lots of feelin' Cause that's where music has to start Oh, play me some mountain music Like grandma and grandpa used to play Then I'll float on down the river To Cajun Hideaway Hey, hey Hey, hey Oh, play me mountain music Oh, play me mountain music Oh, play Yeah! Whisper to me softly Three words upon my skin No one's near and listenin' So please don't say goodbye Just hold me close and love me Press your lips to mine Feels so right Feels so right Lying here beside you I hear the echoes of your sighs Promise me you'll stay with me And keep me warm tonight So hold me close and love me Give my heart a smile Mm, mm Feels so right Feels so right Mm, mm Your body feels so gentle And my passion rises