You worked with us and you helped us and you were real good about calling us if something came up we weren't aware of it. I do appreciate that. Well, we were glad to be part of the process. And I'm glad everybody was able to work together, the city and the contractors, the DLC and the merchants. And it was a real team effort. We've wanted to see a project like this for years because I've thought that Limestone Street really needed improvement. And so when it finally happened, it was all of a sudden, wow, it's going to happen, but let's make sure we do this right and do it as quickly as we can because it definitely was going to be disruptive for all the businesses. And you were lucky you had Jersey Street behind you so people could still kind of get in and out. Right. We still had some access and we have a little parking lot behind the building. So, you know, customers who understood that even though the road was closed, they could still get to the businesses, you know, they came down. And fortunately we had a lot of loyal customers who made it a point to try to patronize us and the other businesses up and down the street because they knew that it was a little difficult for us this past year. And I think those are the people who really, you know, kept us going and, you know, enabled us to get over this year because, you know, business was definitely down over the year and hopefully we're going to bounce back soon. Well, it's one of those things, I'm really amazed how all you merchants stuck together, you know, you worked together, you helped each other. And I think Saturday is going to be a great event for the whole street. Right, right. What are you doing on Saturday? Well, we're kind of taking it a little bit easy. We're going to be taking the grill out front and cooking hot dogs. It's the kind of thing we like doing on special events. In fact, we cooked hot dogs the day that they started the construction. So we figured, well, we'll have a little weenie roast here. And we're also going to do some sales stuff and we'll probably do some giveaways and things like that. A lot of times we get bands here at the store, but our neighbors next door at Sketchel, they have a great lineup of music. So we figure, well, they'll take care of the music and we'll just kind of help out. So we're looking forward to the whole event. I think it's going to be fun. I think, I know Christmas is always a busy time for you, so hopefully this Christmas it's not like the economy is starting to turn around as well. I'm optimistic it's going to be a good Christmas. And I think, you know, hopefully a lot of the folks who don't normally come downtown, you know, they're going to hear about Limestone's been redone and it's a nice place to walk around and spend some time and hopefully they'll come down and discover what's on the block that they didn't know about. So, you know, hopefully this will be our best Christmas ever. We'll see. But I think it's so important that this work was done and, you know, to make this corridor more of a community resource, not just for people who live right around here, but for the entire city. And to encourage a lot of the folks who don't normally shop downtown to check it out and maybe change their shopping habits. Well, it's great. It's going to be a great gateway to UK, a great way to downtown, and you're on the corridor. So I think it's going to be great for you. We're very happy that it was done. I'm very optimistic. Well, Steve, once again, I appreciate all your patience. I appreciate your help and your input. And without your help, this wouldn't have been possible. So appreciate it. Everybody come down, check out the new vinyls that are out. It's really, really unbelievable. And you've got a great store here. Thank you very much. Thank you. I'm Harold Tate, and we're walking up and down Limestone, talking to various merchants in terms of the last 12 months for the sidewalk and street improvements that we did here on Limestone. And I have Mary Morgan here with Squishable Media. Mary, how are you today? I'm good today. You've got a very colorful store here, don't you? Thank you. I hope so. Why don't you tell us a little bit about your store? What have you got here? You've got a little bit of everything, don't you? A little bit of everything. Books, lanterns, candles, cards, magazines, jewelry, incense. Yes, you can smell the incense. Yes, it's very strong. Some people can't handle it. They have to leave. And you all have been around for a long time. Since 1972. Yes, when I was in college. I can remember coming here then. All right. I started here in 1977, so I've been here a long time. And always on South Limestone. Initially, we were down across from Bank of the Bluegrass, and then we moved up this way. And you're next to McDonald's, so people kind of know you're pretty much in the middle of the block between Avenue Champion and Pine Street. Right, yes. On the second floor. Right. Well, we appreciate your patience and your help during the last 12 months. We had some mostly bad times, but we had good times as well. And right now is a good time. Right now is a very, very good time. The street looks lovely. It's very nice. And I have to say that I found the workers always very helpful and pleasant. They went out of their way. We got a lot of dirt in here, and it was hard to keep it cleaned up. But it wasn't anything that they could really control that much. And you know what I found really amazing about the contractors and the workers is they discovered a street they didn't know exists before. Because as I'd walk up and down, you could hear them talking about the food, that they'd never traveled before, your store that they had never been in before. And if they hadn't had the project, they wouldn't have discovered you. Right, yeah. Well, they almost lived here for years. Yeah, they did. But I think one thing I've noticed already is with the street just being open a few days, we're seeing a lot of people walking up and down the street just seeing construction. That's true. A lot of people are coming to see how it looks after it's finished. And Saturday we have a party. A big party. Yes, and you're having entertainment. We're having entertainment. We're going to have a stage out front, five bands, some fire dancers, henna tattooing, tarot card reading. Oh, tarot card reading. Tarot card reading. Oh, great. And everybody inside the building, all the different businesses, will be having sales. Good. We hope to have a big turnout. Yes. Are you going to be open late that night? We're going to stay open until 10 o'clock. Okay. Yeah. Not until midnight. I can't handle that. I hear you on that one. But until 10, and if it's really busy, we'll stay open later. And what are your normal hours, though? Normal hours are 10 to 8 Monday through Saturday and 12 to 6 on Sundays. Great. Like I said, we really appreciate all you've done. And we're hoping now, from now on, you'll have a great business that will provide a lot of people. I hope that all this comes back in a good way. Yes, it will. And I know there are people walking all the way down toward 3rd Street now, so it's lovely. Good old path. Yeah. She's already calling to know when North Street is going to be done. Right, right. And hopefully we will continue on up to 4th Street. So it's an exciting project, and it's going to be a good evening on Saturday. And I think everybody really needs to come down and check out your place. It's very, very colorful. You've got things that I don't think anybody else in town may not have. I think that you're right. Well, Mary, once again, I do appreciate all your help and information. Thank you for everything you've done and all the help you've been when I've called about problems and stuff. Thank you. Thank you. We're walking up and down Limestone from Avenue of Champions to Maxwell, interviewing some of the merchants who have been working with us over the last 12 months during construction. And I've got a team with me right now that's unbelievable. Tim Given and Wes Stevens, two guys who keep Tin Roof going. No doubt about it. No doubt about it. And I'm going to start with Tim. All right. Tim, why don't you tell us a little bit about what you do here? Pretty much trying to run the restaurant during the day, booking music, trying to get as many people as we can in here while the street was closed, which was fun. Trying to keep Wes in check. Our job. Yeah, exactly, as you know. So, yeah, that's about it. So you have music every night or what? Every night but Tuesday. Every night but Tuesday. Yeah. And local bands or mixed or what? Yeah, all of our weekday bands are local bands. And Friday, Saturday, we try and book most of our bands out of Nashville. And they all play at all four of the Tin Roofs, kind of travel around, do a little circuit. All right. I noticed you get a lot of local bands because friends of mine, their sons are usually here playing during the week as well. Yeah, we do. And that's really good. And we appreciate all you've done. And the last 12 months have been hard, but you guys have stuck it out. If we can make it through that, I think we can make it through anything. Well, you got a good location. You're a corner, no doubt about it. Now we do. Now you do. And Wes. You keep everybody under control, right? No, everybody keeps themselves under control here. It's pretty laid back here. Well, you've done well. You all have been open how long now? A year and four months now. So almost a year and a half. March 5th last year we opened up. Right. It's been good. And you do lunch and dinner. Do you do late evening too? We do lunch and we open up every day at 11 o'clock. Full menu, big quesadillas, big salads, fresh food, all of our produce is local. We buy all local Kentucky products. Right. Serve until late in the night. Kitchen's open late. And after that, live music. We keep going all day. It was entertaining on the weekends how the construction guys sometimes had to clean up a little bit before they could start, right? You know, we made them clean up a little bit more. The city was paying them. Good point. Well, you know, I really don't think a lot of people are aware of the great food that you have here. Hopefully the street will be what brings them back to try that out. So now they know they can get here. Yeah, right. Yeah. Well, you know, you've got those, what, four garage doors, and when you open them, it's great walking down the street. You can hear people talking. You can hear the music. It's very festive. And I know one thing, the construction guys, they ate here a lot. Hopefully they'll come back. Yeah, hopefully. I want the construction part to go away, but I want them to come back. And stay and eat, buy more food. So, but, well, you know, like I said, appreciate all you've done. Thank you. And you're from Nashville, right? Born and raised in Nashville, Tennessee. And you had an interesting past. What did you do before you started this? I played professional football in the Arena Football League for six years. I retired five years ago now, so I'm getting up there. I'm getting a little bit older. I think I got you beat. What, two or three years? Yeah, about two or three years. But, no, guys, I do appreciate all your hard work. And I think it looks great out there. I think you all are going to add to the festivities of the street. Hopefully. You know, it's been great. We picked South Limestone for a reason. There's a bunch of great businesses around us. You know, a few businesses had to go out because of construction. But, you know, hopefully they're doing well. But there's really a lot of good businesses here on South Limestone. We do. And I appreciate, I know you all helped Sav across the street. I appreciate that. That was very important. It really was. Yeah, Sav's a great guy. I'm glad he made it through it too. Well, as I've been saying, we've got some great merchants along here. Hopefully everybody will come down, check it out. We've got great food, great music, got great prices, and then you have Wes. What can I say? Thanks, guys. I appreciate it. Come see us. All right. Woo! Perhaps summer night will feel like an inch. I've gotta find my baby. Yeah. I need you. Soothe my head. Turn my blue heart to red. Doctor, doctor, give me the news. I got a bad case of loving you. No pills gonna cure my ill. I got a bad case of loving you. When the music plays, And when the words are touched with sorrow, When the music plays, And when the music plays, I hear the sound I had to follow, Once upon a time, Once upon a time, Once when you were mine. Once upon a time, Once when you were mine. Once upon a time, Once when you were mine. Once upon a time, Once when you were mine. Once upon a time, Once when you were mine. Once upon a time, Once when you were mine. Once when you were mine. Once upon a time, Once when you were mine. Once upon a time, Once when you were mine. Once when you were mine. Once when you were mine. Once when you were mine. Once when you were mine. Once when you were mine. Once when you were mine. Once when you were mine. Once when you were mine. Once when you were mine. Once when you were mine. Once when you were mine. Once when you were mine. Once when you were mine. Once when you were mine. Once when you were mine. Once when you were mine. Once when you were mine. Once when you were mine. Once when you were mine. Once when you were mine. Once when you were mine. Once when you were mine. Once when you were mine. Once when you were mine. Once when you were mine. Once when you were mine. Once when you were mine. Once when you were mine. Once when you were mine. Okay. I assume we don't have any minutes. We don't have any of today's postponements and withdrawals. I guess we'll, this is planning commission light. I guess we'll move right on to the development plan. Mr. Salih. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, members of the commission, good afternoon. The only subdivision development plan item on your agenda today appears on the first page, item number A-1, DP-2008-137, an amended final development plan for Mohamed Seraji property. This is property located at 432 South Broadway. Mr. Emmons is home ill with, I should say not ill, but with an ill wife and child, so it's my pleasure to present this development plan to you today and also the staff's revised recommendation on it. Before commencing, though, the staff did receive a written communication from the applicant who is not able to be here today dealing with the possibility of a shared parking arrangement for the subject property. I had prepared my remarks to address that with you, but I would like to circulate this to you at this time so you can review it during my remarks. I'd like to take just a moment to orient you to the location of this development plan. This property is on the western edge of the South Hill Historic District, and it is located specifically at the corner of South Broadway and Pine Street. This intersection is not one of the signalized intersections on South Broadway. The subject property also has about 50 feet of frontage to the rear along Plunkett Street, parallel street to South Broadway one block removed. This is a property that's been before the Planning Commission a couple of times over the last 10 years, and this particular plan was filed in 2008. And at that time the purpose of this amendment was to add one dwelling unit and 86 square feet of floor area. The property has an existing structure, small amount of green space, and an off-street parking lot that accesses both Pine Street and Plunkett Street. There is a wraparound porch along the front and the side of this property, and there is a covered stairwell at the rear of this property. The property is a mixed-use office and residential property. I would like to show you just a few photographs to get you a little more oriented to the property so I can describe to you the amendment that's proposed today. This is South Broadway at its intersection with Pine Street, so we're looking at the front corner of the subject property. It's a two-story structure. It does have a basement, and in this photo you can see very clearly the existing parking lot that is there. This is the current pictometry for the rear of the property, and most of the development plan issues with this site over the years have regarded the rear of the subject property. The property was undergoing renovation, as is clearly evident in the photo, and this is a good view of the wraparound parking lot and the open space area that's oriented closer to the intersection of Plunkett and Pine Streets. Also of note in this photo is the availability of on-street parking along Pine Street on both sides in this particular block. Finally, this is a view of the property from three years ago in 2007. This is 2007 pictometry, and you see about five cars in this parking lot. Renovation was not ongoing at the time. This parking arrangement is not very different from the currently approved development plan for the property. There is room for two or three pull-in spaces and then two or three parallel parking spaces here. This development plan, as I mentioned, was to add a dwelling unit. Adding a dwelling unit increases the required off-street parking by one space, and as you can see, the parking is already very tight on the rear of this property. That is in part why it was postponed about 18 months ago. The applicant did ask for this plan to be redocketed, and since then we have received a revised submission. We've actually received two, the most recent late yesterday afternoon. In looking at the site statistics, it appears that the floor area increase proposed is about 280 square feet to the floor area. That alone does not require an increase in off-street parking for the subject property or for the combination of office and residential use proposed. However, the additional dwelling unit that is sought for the upper floor, that does require one additional parking space. By the staff's calculation, there are eight off-street parking spaces required for the property. Both the current development plan and this proposed development plan have six allocated on site. The plan we received late yesterday did propose a redesign of the parking area so that all of the parking would be accessed from Pine Street with head-in parking, including room for one handicapped parking space. This would require that an additional area of the green space in the back be converted to concrete or pavement to allow a 22-foot maneuvering pile for those cars to leave the site. Part of the staff's preparation for the hearing today was to see if that amount of pavement could be reduced in any way, knowing that this is in a historic district and that may be an issue in the review of the plan. We did come up with one possible alternative. That alternative would require that the one-way movement go the opposite direction, off Plunkett and out Pine, where 60-degree angled parking could be used. There could still be one handicapped space. It would slightly impact a planned handicapped ramp into the building at this location. But other than that, it looks like it will not affect the required landscape buffers for the vehiculous area, would allow for a slightly different and increased area of open space and landscape buffering here, and would save a few feet of pavement or concrete in this area. The staff would offer that as a possible alternative. It's important to note that both the design of the parking will be required to be approved by the Division of Traffic Engineering. We utilize their standards in coming up with this alternative with aisle width, parking space width, and so forth. And it also will require the approval of the Board of Architectural Review. That's why we wanted to take just a little bit of time to offer you both alternatives. That said, that is six spaces, and as I mentioned earlier, eight are required. The staff, that has been the problem with reviewing this amended plan all along. The staff has prepared a revised recommendation for you to consider that would allow the commission to approve this plan subject to one of two things happening. The difference in two parking spaces could be resolved either through approval of a variance, which is brand new under our zoning ordinance, for the required parking, or secondly, that has been discussed since this plan was first in 18 months ago, the use of a joint parking arrangement wherein two parking spaces could be shared in this general area or perhaps even between the residents of this structure and the office use on the structure. The staff will have to review both of those requirements to see which one the applicant would choose, and the staff would not certify this plan until one or the other was completely met, and if a joint parking arrangement were met, that that also would meet the approval of the Department of Law. If that is done, there are a couple of other issues with the plan that the staff would suggest. One, some of the site statistics are slightly off from the approved plan to that proposed. Those are cleanup type of conditions in the staff's opinion. The open space statistic is very close. That's why we've spent a little bit of time highlighting the amount of open space. This plan does appear to meet the minimum requirement, but by less than 12 square feet. We are very tight on open space, and again, that may be a key issue with the Board of Architectural Review as well. Also of note, the porch that wraps around the property, ironically under the zoning ordinance, the portion of the porch that is in front of the building line does not technically qualify as usable open space. The portion of the porch behind that building line does qualify. So the site statistics can also break those square footages out, again, to demonstrate compliance with the open space. The other issue on this particular plan, the revision we received last night, has a very large apron proposed to Plunkett Street in the neighborhood of about 30 feet, 35 feet. The staff would recommend that that apron be reduced to a more standard size in the neighborhood of 12 to 20 feet. So we are making that a recommendation of the plan that's before you today as one of the things that should change on the plan. Let's see if I have covered the other conditions that are listed on your agenda, have been from the previous reviews of this plan, both through your recent subdivision committee reviews and the review 18 months ago. With the understanding that either a parking variance or a shared parking arrangement is necessary, the staff is prepared to recommend approval of this plan, knowing that one of those two things will have to happen before this plan can be certified. Again, the square footage increase is less than 300 square feet, and there is one additional dwelling unit proposed. So the staff is comfortable recommending approval of this plan with the 19 conditions that are listed on our revised recommendation. At this time, I'd be glad to answer any questions from the commission about our revised recommendation or about the development plan amendment that's before you this afternoon. Any questions, Mr. Salley? Ms. Copeland? Mr. Salley, there's no garbage pickup inside the property lines. You're right. That plan does not show a dumpster location. I am not sure whether it is served currently by Herbie's or by a dumpster. The photograph we showed earlier was during the renovation, and, of course, there was a yard dumpster on the site, probably related to the renovation more than the office use of the building. Because if we need a dumpster on site, there's no room. Exactly. That will further impact the parking. That's two parking spaces gone. And the memorandum that was passed around about that's a two-year plan, I don't find that acceptable to say that that meets the two parking space requirement. I mean, it's a step in the right direction, but we need a permanent arrangement if we're going to share parking spaces. I think the commission could require a longer term than that. Two years, as my understanding, is the standard. That's another reason I pointed out the availability of the on-street parking in this area, given either the variance approach or that. But in the Pine South Broadway corner, there's low use there between the car wash and this property. So as the property intensifies, those Pine Street places are going to be more in demand. You're exactly right. And, in fact, there is an approved development plan across the street on Pine, and that development plan does identify two access points across Pine Street from this property. So some of that off-street parking you saw in the photo, once that property develops, if it develops under that plan, will no longer be available. So we're sort of grabbing at straws for the parking. The parking is very tight and has been from the start at this point. Mr. Owens? Phil, you were talking about two options, the variance through the Board of Adjustments or shared parking agreement. Can you walk through that shared parking agreement one more time? There has longstanding been a provision of the ordinance that allows shared parking or joint use of the same parking. And the key in the ordinance to being able to do that is documenting that the time demands for that parking are not the same, so that it's logical that if an office use was during the day, a residential use would be at night. The best example in the ordinance is a church parking lot. Currently, residence or office space either occupied? I do not know. I'm not sure. Thanks. Mr. Holmes? Yes, I just had a question. I guess this agreement, when it talks about the hours of operation from 7 to 6, that's for the office. I just find that to be difficult to enforce in some ways. I mean, who's going to know if they're working after 6 or getting to 4, 7? I think if it were a situation where all of the off-street parking were being shared, it would certainly be a tremendous concern. The fact that only two of the spaces are going to be required for the residential, even if someone would have to work late, let's say, in a busy, hectic week, probably there would still be a couple of spaces available. The ordinance was changed last year to allow a one-hour overlap in the uses. That did not exist until last year. Any other questions? Bill, the only question I have on this is the open space with the 30-foot apron on the plunket street, and I can ask the applicant this, but what I'm wondering is if we reduce the 30-foot apron, wouldn't that increase the open space? It would, except that the apron is actually in the right-of-way. Oh, okay. And so they do not get to count that grass area to their open space requirement. Okay. All right. And I guess the only other thing that would be possible is to tear the porch down on the front side to be able to use that as open space. Believe it or not, the porch is an allowable projection across the building line. The area between the required building line and the street, however, is required. Right. And, again, does not count toward their open space requirement for the remainder of the lawn. This is just a classic 11-pounder flyer and 10-pound sack. The extra dwelling unit has been complicating this plan for 18 months. Any other questions of Mr. Salih? All right. Thank you, Bill. Thank you. Applicant? My name is Bob Cornett. I'm with the Roberts Group. Mr. Siragi, I apologize for not being that familiar with this plan. He called me last night at 5.15 and said, I'm emailing you a plan. I have to be in fiscal court in Shelbyville tomorrow. Would you represent me at the Planning Commission meeting? So it was a scramble to try to get the statistics down, try to figure out what the issues were, calling Tom and stuff this morning, trying to get up to speed on it. Just a bit of history, Mr. Siragi is a structural engineer here in town, and he and his wife bought the house several years ago, and his office has always been downstairs, and there was one residential unit over top. The renovations are the result of a fire. So most of the demolition work, the dumpster and stuff that you saw, was to get the damaged fire out, make an assessment of what has to be done to rebuild the building and restore it. To help make it financially work, Mr. Siragi wanted to take the third floor, which had never been used, and make it a second residential unit. There has never been a handicapped parking space, and there had never been a handicapped ramp on this building because there had never been a handicapped occupant. And Mr. Siragi usually leaves his office and goes to his client's office. Not many people are knocking on the door of the structural engineer's office. So he didn't even realize that was an issue. There are provisions that would allow you to not have handicap, but building inspection also looks at it as you could sell this property. Well, we're also in a classification along with banks, art studios, other professions that have walk-in traffic, which requires one space per 200 square feet. If it was in an office complex or an office development, which in the definition of the zoning ordinance would be 10 acres or greater, it would be one per 400 square feet. Technically, we would not even need these extra two parking spaces under that calculation. So it's kind of a fine line here. He's trying to make things work, and he is not real familiar with development ordinances, zoning ordinances, and may not understand the importance of a speedy response, like waiting until last night to get somebody to present it. So anyway, he wants to make it work. The staff has been gracious and has worked with him and tried to guide him and help him. And I think he realized he did need a little bit of help, someone that understands how to read a zoning ordinance, and that's why he got me involved. So we're trying to make everything correct, clean it up, and get the plan so that everybody can sign off. We've got 17, maybe 19 provisions there that we have to comply with, and we understand and we'll immediately start to knock those off. I know there are some of those approvals that have been signed off on plan tracker, such as the street address. I'm not sure about any of the others, but we understand the concerns. It is the I use six pounds of something else in a four-pound box instead of the 11 pounds of flour. But it's a lot, and in these old historical developments, there's a lot of restrictions and you have to kind of make things work. And we would, I don't think Mr. Siragi would hesitate to consider the plan that staff has come up with as well. Any questions for the applicant? Ms. Copeland? Do you know if you have to have a dumpster on site? In this type of environment, the Herbie's would work. In our office, they only empty our trash cans once a week, and we're engineers and architects. The majority of our stuff ends up in a recycle bin to start with, paper products do. The two residents, normally a residential unit would have Herbie pick up anyway. So I would imagine that three or four Herbie's would serve this property, this particular use, without the need of a dumpster. So if I understand your argument, you're saying under these conditions, maybe you don't need a handicap parking place. Mr. Siragi does not necessarily need one, but building inspection has guidelines that they go by, and they're looking into the future. If Mr. Siragi were to sell it and say a beauty shop or an art studio were to go in downstairs, then they should provide a handicap access. So it's kind of like you're caught with what if. Well, it hasn't happened. Like Mr. Sally stated, it's real close on open space. We're 12 square feet. Well, you know, the ordinance has a particular number that we're supposed to meet, and technically as long as you meet it, you comply, whether you're one square foot over or 100 square foot over. So. Well, if we waive the handicap parking space and the ramp, how would it benefit parking? Well, without the ramp, and I don't think it's built as a bill, I drove by, Without the ramp, we would have more open space. Okay. Without the handicap space, we would have another parking space because we've got an 8-foot striped out area. These spaces are currently dimensioned as 9 feet wide, and by the parking design guidelines, they could be 8.5. Okay. We have them 18 feet deep with about 2 feet of overhang or a foot and a half of overhang. They could go down to 17 and a half with overhang. So we could get another half a foot of green space in there possibly. Well, the handicap parking space is there. Why? Because we have so many units or because it's a business. Because it's a business. Because the people on the third floor aren't going to use it. Probably not the second either. There's no elevator. Right. So we're just putting it in. All this handicap. Handicap ramp is only to serve the first floor. To serve the first floor. Yes. Or, and we need how many parking spaces for the first floor? Six. Six. And one of those six is a handicap? No. Well, one of the six is a handicap, and the seventh is the striped out 8-foot van accessible area. So you've got 16 feet for one handicap space, which if we restripe to 8-and-a-half-foot spaces, you could take those two 8-foots, add a foot and a half to it, and still make the dimensions work out. Now, run that by me again because I think there could be, to me, this is just my personal opinion, that we could fudge a little bit on the handicap parking space because the handicap person could get out not on a regular basis but on a one-time, once-a-week basis, and the other people back out. They could just pull up there and. . . Well, if you're going to comply with ADA guidelines, you have to provide one handicap parking space, and that handicap parking space has to be a van accessible, which means you have to provide 16 feet. And nobody else parking that striped-out access area. So if you comply with ADA, you should comply fully. If you can get a variance or a waiver of the ADA compliant, then don't even make an attempt because you don't want to. . . You don't even attempt to. Any other questions? Let me try something on you a minute. Yes, sir. Sometimes when they refit these buildings just where they have to go up one floor, they'd use what's called an outdoor elevator, like on a back porch. You just would do it. How much space would that save you to get rid of that ramp, and would that let us make this thing fit? It won't solve the parking problem. It just solves the green space problem. Well, and we're really not short of green space, are we? We're not short. We're close, but we're not short. And typically that would add somewhere between $18,000 and $25,000 to the cost of the renovations for an exterior headless elevator. Well, but the ramp's going to add something to it too. Yeah, but you can build that out of wood. That's true. I'm having to drill a hole and case it. There's quite a bit, too, that's pitless. We looked at it for our office. I'm just trying to stretch the sack. I understand. Let's not stitch it up real tight. Any other questions? Ms. Richardson? How many people work in the office? Typically four. Mr. Siragi, he is a draftsperson. He is a bookkeeper. And his wife is a part-time employee. So it would be four people. All right. Any other questions? Mr. Cornett, do you foresee more tenants coming into this building? I've been in his office before the fire, and there wasn't a place to put anybody else. There is so much paper that as architects and engineers, we're scared to death to throw anything away. There won't be now. Thank goodness he doesn't smoke in his office. I can't imagine that. One question for Bill Salley kind of goes to the fact of giving me a little bit of knowledge can be dangerous. If I remember right, with the Board of Adjustment, there's been a couple of situations where variances or maybe there's more uses were allowed for an owner or an applicant that would end if ownership changed. Would this parking variance fall under those same guidelines? I know that the Board of Adjustment can place conditions on the approval of a variance. However, a variance usually runs with the land. And these would tend to conflict. So I'm not sure I have an answer for you. That's where I was thinking there's more uses instead of variances. Okay. Any other questions? At what point do you need two handicap parking spaces? More than 25 parking spaces. The ADA code recommends one per 25 up to 100. Then it kicks in from 101 to about 350. It goes one per 50. Then it goes into a percentage after you get past 351 spaces. At 26, that 26 space would have to be a second handicap space. So it seems to me that I'm very much handicapped oriented. But at the same time, this may be penalizing the use of historic property. If we want to reuse and keep our old buildings, maybe we need to be a little relaxed if we've only got four people working in the building, or at the most six. If 25 parking spaces requires two, then maybe it would take 12 parking spaces to really require one. That's just... Well, I had another customer several years back that had bought an old house with the intention of moving her seamstress shop into it. She had always been on the second floor of a building that did not have an elevator. So any time a person with difficulties going up a flight of stairs had something to do, she would go down to their car and pick it up. Well, when she bought this building and started all these renovations, that's when she realized she had to have a handicap space. And then she had to have a ramp. Then she had to have railings. And next thing you know, it just was almost blown out of the air, and they were sitting there going, we need to convert this back to a residential unit again. So it's a challenge when you do take an existing building, particularly one that was not planned to be an accessible building. So I don't know. The code is the code, and we have to support it. If there is a particular situation where you can grant a variance or a waiver of a requirement, that's fine. But I'm like you. I want to support ADA. I've gone to their classes. Even DOT is attempting to be compliant. Any further questions? Thank you, sir. Thank you. Mr. Salley, do you have any rebuttal? No rebuttal, Mr. Chairman. Thank you. Mr. Martin, though, did make me aware of one item that I'd like to share with the Commission before you close discussion. The Department of Solid Waste is not a sign-off approval on this plan under the recommendation that's before you. Mr. Martin tells me the reason for that is they've reviewed this plan and determined that no dumpster service is necessary and that furbies can serve the uses that are proposed here. Thank you. I assume there's nobody in the audience that wants to respond to this. Pretty safe assumption. If not, I guess, applicant, do you have anything else you want to add to this discussion? If not, then we'll close the hearing and turn it back over to the Commission for any discussion and or motions. Mr. Chairman, I move for approval of DP 2008-137 with the 19 conditions. Is that your final motion? That's my final motion. Is there a second? Second by Ms. Richardson. Any discussion on the motion? If not, then vote when you see this on the screen. Motion passes. Thank you, sir. So it's subject to the Board of Adjustment? Either or. Certainly the Board of Architecture review. And if they ask for a parking variance, then it would go before the Board of Adjustment. Fine, thank you. All right. If there's no one. Yeah. That's all we have on our agenda other than our election of officers. And at this time, I'll turn it over to Mr. Ed Holmes to make a recommendation from the nominating committee. Mr. Chairman, you'd ask us, the nominating committee, to get together and meet, and we've come up with a slate of recommendations to the Commission. For chairperson, we have Carolyn Richardson. Vice chairperson, Mike Cravens. Secretary, Mike Owens. And at every important parliamentarian slot, Ed Holmes. I'm voting against that. All right. You could definitely have it. You've heard the report of the nominating committee. Are there any nominations from the floor? Mr. Chairman. Mr. Cravens. Move the nomination cease and the slate be elected by activation. I think we need a parliamentarian to rule on that. I'm not a parliamentarian, so that's okay. You are. If there's no not for the nominations from the floor, then the chair will entertain a motion to accept the slate. I guess we're all voting now. Congratulations. Ben, this is Ms. Whitman and I's last meeting. Joan, have you got anything you'd like to say to them before we adjourn? Do I ever? No, no. I would like to say that it's been a really great eight years, and I think the one thing that I have learned is that the one of many things that I've learned is that our staff is absolutely one of the best in the country. I am always amazed at the amount of information that comes to us for these meetings. We kind of have a simple task when it gets here, and when I look at what's done behind the scenes, it's amazing to me that they can do this week after week. And so I really applaud you all, and thank you for making it a great eight years. Thank you, Ms. Whitman. I'd have to say that for my fellow commissioners, too. It's been good and it's been great to meet new people, learn to agree to disagree, and it's just amazing what has happened in this community over the last eight years. And I feel so good about it. I think we made some great decisions, and I think we can all be proud of that. I, too, echo what Ms. Whitman has said. I would only add to that that eight years ago my learning curve was extremely steep. You don't take a man off a tractor and throw this kind of nomenclature at him and expect him to understand it, especially one that can't even work the Internet. But that's a challenge in the future. I feel really good about the quality of our commission at this time, Mr. King and Mr. Sally. I think we're leaving with the staff obviously goes with Joan. I won't reiterate that. I feel obviously the same way. I'm excited for your challenge that's ahead of you. The comp plan situation is a situation that you work on the comp plan and then you spend the next four years defending it. And you take some ownership to it. And when you get through with it, you absolutely have an ownership in it, and it becomes something that you can proudly defend. I hope it will for you. I certainly did for us. But the one thing that I would like to say is that as a citizen who had the unique and special honor to be able to serve on this for eight years, I leave here a very humble person. And the reason for that is that we get the kind of government we deserve. And with deserving people, we absolutely can make good decisions and will. And I, too, thank the staff and thank you all. It's been a real honor and privilege. And we'll declare this meeting adjourned.