gives us that opportunity to really focus our attention on beautifying Lexington and making it a cleaner community. The Great American Cleanup in Lexington is coordinated by the Keep Lexington Beautiful Commission. We're a 13-member group that was created by ordinance a couple years ago and we are an official affiliate of Keep America Beautiful and so we work with these local groups that I mentioned to schedule activities primarily between March 1 and May 31st and April is the time of year when a lot of people think about getting outside and doing things. So April is a really, really busy month for us, especially for Great American Cleanup. And Joanna's going to talk about an event here in just a second, but I want to mention some events we have coming up in April as part of the Great American Cleanup. The Keep Lexington Beautiful Commission itself will be doing a cleanup effort on Saturday, April 7th, on the Legacy Trail as part of a pre-cleanup event to the Reforest the Bluegrass event, which is also a Great American Cleanup event. And Reforest of Woodgrass this year will be on Saturday, April the 14th, on the Legacy Trail, close to the Ironworks Pike end of it. You'll enter by Spindletop Hall and park there, and you'll have a chance to come out and plant some tree seedlings again on Saturday, April the 14th. That's just one event that we have. If you want more information about the Great American Cleanup, about the Keep Lakes and Beautiful Commission and our work, I can direct you to our website, which is KeepLexingtonBeautiful.com. And we have a lot of information about not just the Great American Cleanup, but you'll see a schedule of all the events we have during the Great American Cleanup time period, plus more information about KLB and who we are and what we do. Thank you, Mark. And I appreciate the work so much of Keep Lexington Beautiful. I think they are really getting the word out. And I can see differences in our community. And we still have work to do, but I think our streams and roadways are looking better as far as litter. And let me point out to the viewers that Council Member Henson is one of our commissioners on the Keep Lakes and Beautiful Commission. and Peggy has been very much engaged on the commission and really has a desire to help us make our community a much cleaner community. Again, we're fortunate to live in just a beautiful area, a lot of natural beauty in Fayette County and Lexington, but again, from time to time we do have issues. But Peggy, we appreciate all the work that you do, not just on the council but also on the Keep Lexington Beautiful Commission to get people engaged in improving our community. Thank you. And, you know, I just can't emphasize enough, I feel this the same as many of the LFUCG water quality folks. They really are dedicated to making our city environmentally the best it can be. So I appreciate you guys as much. It's important for us because from a water quality standpoint, we always tell people if it's on the ground, it's in the water. and we're here at the park right above Wolf Run. And so any trash or litter that gets thrown out of a vehicle or someone just walking by, the next time it rains or the wind blows, it's going to end up in this particular creek, and that affects water quality. And, of course, Peggy, as you are well aware of, we do have water quality issues in Lexington and Fayette County. We're under a federal consent decree to improve our water quality. And so even a little bit of someone throwing a cigarette butt out a window, that's litter, And that affects water quality. It's fast food containers and cups and plastic bottles. All those things contribute to water quality issues in Lexington. And again, from the city standpoint, we're working, but we can do it all. We have to have citizens and other people engaged to help us accomplish that goal of improving water quality. And I guess then Joanna is going to have an event. Can you tell us about your Great American Cleanup event? Absolutely. We have been fortunate enough to partner with Coca-Cola. They're going to be sponsoring a cleanup over at Masterson Station Park. It's going to be April 21st from 9 to noon. We're going to be meeting up at the playground parking lot. That's where the registration will take place. We'll have everything provided thanks to the Great American Cleanup and partnership with Mark York and the Department of Environmental Quality. We'll have bags and litter grabbers and gloves, so all we need are volunteers to come and show up and to actually do the work to pick up the litter that will be in the Masters in Station Park, especially down by the creek at the entrance to the park. That's an area that gets a lot of traffic, especially the litter coming from the road there leading up to the park. We'll also have activities. We feel like it's a great opportunity to educate anybody coming about stormwater quality issues here in Lexington. So we'll have some adult education booths there as well as children activities. So it's a great opportunity to bring out the whole family, spend a few hours there. Coke is a great sponsor. They're going to be providing some breakfast and also some drinks. Awesome Coca-Cola will have those drinks provided for us. So we're really looking forward to that. Once again, it'll be April 21st from 9 to noon. They're at Masterson Station Park at the playground parking lot up at the top there. That's great. Thank you all. Bluegrass Pride also does a tremendous amount of work in our city, educating children and so forth. And then that brings me to the event that will take place right here at Valley Park. And it is the second annual festival. We call it the Valley Park Stream Clean. And last year, we picked up 200 bags of garbage, I believe. and lots and lots of people came out to volunteer. But it is April 28th. The creek cleanup begins at 1 and ends at 3, and then from 3 to 5 we will have a tent with educational components for adults, and even the children can come get in the stream with a staff person from Bluegrass Pride where they will take some samples and learn about our water quality and the importance of it. I always felt like our children, if you start with the children, they will teach parents and so forth. So as I was growing up, I was not taught about water quality. I really wasn't. So now we've changed our focus and we're going to educate as well as clean up the stream. Like Mark said earlier, if we just let the trash continue to accumulate, polluting our waterways, it's just unthinkable, I think, of the effects that it would have on our communities. So by educating, cleaning up the creek, everyone that comes will be provided with a T-shirt and some free food. And last year was a really good time. I think the kids, parents, everybody really enjoyed it. So we need volunteers. Since this is, Valley Park runs through apartments. There's many, many multi-housing units along the way. Modern Property Management, who manages many of these properties, they're working as a sponsor, and they will provide all the food and drinks for the folks that volunteer to clean up the creek, as well as some equipment. So I just want to send a thank you out to them for their hard work and dedication to the area. the area. I also wanted to mention that volunteers this year were asking that they wear hip waders or rubber boots. The creeks have been tested and there's a lot of E. coli bacteria that it's, you know, it's not real real clean so you need to take precautions. Plus there's glass and things that could cause you some harm. The event sponsors, in addition to Modern Property Management, are Keep Lakes and Beautiful Commission, Wolf Run, Friends of Wolf Run, Bluegrass Pride, and the Audubon Toyota Together Green. All of these efforts are being done because Wolf Run is one of the many creeks in Fayette County suffering from the effects of stormwater runoff pollution, as we said earlier. Trash, litter, automotive fluid, pet waste, all of that contributes to the pollution in our creeks. The following day after the Valley Park Stream clean, there will be a cleanup at Preston Cave Springs, which is located at 1937 Dunkirk Drive, and it will take place, of course, Sunday, April 29th from 1 to 3. I just want to take the time to thank Mark and Joanna for being here for such, I think, a great event that's going to be occurring. And if you would like to volunteer for the event, we will have the websites posted on the screen. My phone number is 859-258-3218 if you would like to call me for more information or whatever, or visit the websites on your screen. Thank you so much. You're welcome. Thank you. I appreciate that. We'll be right back. We're asking you to take the survey online at lexingtonky.gov. The mission of GTV3 is to keep you, the citizen, informed about the goings-on in your government through education and information using television, live web streaming, and now, social media like Facebook and YouTube. Go to lexingtonky.gov to take our survey. We'd appreciate your input, and thanks for watching your government information channel, GTV3. What would you do if a major emergency was happening right now in your neighborhood? The Lexington Fayette County Local Emergency Planning Committee can help. If you haven't already, write a family emergency plan and stock an emergency kit. To learn how to write a plan and what you should have in your emergency kit, go to FayetteLEPC.com. Practice your plan on a regular basis. Every member of your family needs to know what to do in an emergency. Find more ways to protect your family at FayetteLEPC.com. We got down to the gate and I was dreaming of the night Would it turn out right? How to tell you, girl I wanna build my world around you Tell you that it's true I wanna make you understand I'm talking about a lifetime plan That's the way it began We were hand in hand Ben Miller's man was better than before We yelled and screamed for more In the port of June Night and day Made us dance across the room It ended all too soon On the way back home I promise you'd never be alone Hurry, don't be late I can hardly wait, I said to myself when we're wrong We'll go dancing in the garbage, walking through the fog and reminiscing Friday night was late I was walking you home We got down to the gate And I was dreaming of the night Would it turn out right Now as the years roll on Each time we hear our favorite song, the memories come along. Older times we're missing, spending the hours reminiscing. Hurry, don't be late I can hardly wait I said to myself when we're old We'll go dancing in the dark Walking through the park and reminiscing Thank you. Thank you. Power of love is a curious thing Make a one man weep, make another man sing Change your heart to a little white dove More than a feeling, that's the power of love Tough and diamonds, rich like cream Stronger and harder than a bad girl's dream Make a bad one good, make your own one right Power of love will keep you home at night Don't need money, don't take fame Don't need a credit card to ride this train It's dark and it's sudden and it's true sometimes But if I just leave your life That's the power of love That's the power of love First time you're feeling it might make you sad Next time you're feeling it will make you mad We do be glad to be you when you're found Some power makes the world around And it don't take money, it don't take fame Don't need no credit card to write this dream A song and a sudden, it can be cruel sometimes But it might just be a lie They say that all in love is there Yeah, but you don't care But you'll know what to do When it gets on you And with a little Love from above You'll feel the power of love You'll feel the power of love Can you feel it? We'll be right back. Don't take money Don't take fame Don't need no teddy car To ride this train It's tougher than iron It's stronger than steel You won't feel nothing Till you feel You feel the power You feel the power of love That's the power That's the power of love Feel the power of love Feel the power of love Feel the power of love Why am I losing sleep over you? Reliving precious moments we knew So many days have gone by Still I'm so lonely and I guess there's just no getting over you Cause there's nothing I can do But you've been out of my time, out of my mind Over you Within the prison walls of my mind There's still a part of you left behind And though it hurts our goodbye Without your loving And I guess there's just no gain Over you There's nothing I can do But spend all of my time Out of my mind Over you And I guess there's just no gain Over you Oh there is nothing I can do I'm spending all of my time Out of my mind Over you And I guess There's just no kidding Over you Oh there is nothing I can do Over you Out of the room Out from the baggage Can't make the same mistake this time We are the children The last generation The last generation We are the ones I'm just laying behind. And I wonder when we are ever gonna change. Living under the fear, do nothing else we need. We don't need another hero. We don't need to know the way. All we want is my friend Looking for something We can rely on There's got to be something better out there Love and compassion That day is coming All else our plans Is building in And I wonder what way Are ever gonna change Maybe I'm not a fear Till nothing else remains All the children say We don't need to know the hero We don't need to know the way All we want is life beyond Nothing to know So what do we do in our lives? We leave our place alone Will our story shine like a light Or is this a job? Is it all or nothing? We don't need another hero We don't need to know why All we want is life beyond Underdome All the children say We don't need another hero We don't need another hero We don't need another world All we want is life beyond It Mays Do It Time I ain't got no luggage, as you can see, just a whole lot of heavy memories. I was finally up, well, just to settle it down, till I found out you've been fooling around. You can send me north, you can send me south, just don't send me past my house. Don't ask me where I'm going, cause I don't care. I want a ticket that'll take me anywhere from here A ticket that'll take me anywhere from here But I hear it's cold up in Saskatoon But it couldn't be colder than our bedroom The skies are blue down in Alabama But there won't be any bluer than I am You can send me north, you can send me south Just don't send me past my house Don't ask me where I'm going, cause I don't care I want a ticket that'll take me anywhere for here A ticket that'll take me anywhere for here I use a thing off and you can send me a shout But just don't send me past my house Don't ask me where I'm going cause I don't care I want a ticket that I'll take anywhere from here My tickets don't take me anywhere from here Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh I need a drink and a quick decision Now it's gone to me What will be if she's gone She's gone, oh I, oh I I better learn how to face it She's gone, she's gone, oh I, oh I I paid the devil to replace it She's gone, oh I, what went wrong Get up in the morning, look in the mirror The morning there's a toothbrush hanging in the stand My face ain't looking any younger Now I can see I'm taking her toll on me She's gone Oh I Oh I I gotta learn how to face it She's gone Oh I Oh I I made the devil to a person She's gone Oh I What went wrong Oh Think I'll spend eternity In the city Let the carbon and monoxide Drove my thoughts away In pretty bodies Tells us other memories They can never be What she wants To be And she's gone Oh I Oh I I better let her face it She's gone Oh I Oh, I'll pay the devil to represent And she's gone, oh, I'll work way more She's gone I better learn how to face it She's gone I can't believe that she's gone I'll pay the devil to my place She's gone Is she really going out with him? Oh, there she is, let's ask her Betty, is that Jimmy's ring you're wearing? Mm-hmm. Gee, it must be great riding with him. Is he picking you up after school today? Mm-mm. By the way, where'd you meet him? I met him at the candy store. He turned around and smiled at me. You get the picture? Yes, we see. That's when I fell for the leader of the pack. I broke the wrong way Putting him down Down, down They said he came from the wrong side of town What do you mean they said he came from the wrong side of town? They told me he was bad But I knew he was dead That's why I fell for the leader of the pack. I had to tell my team you win. What do you mean when you say that you better go find somebody new? He stood there and asked me why. But all I could do was cry. I'm sorry I hurt you. Leader of the pack. I So small, I'm just gonna go out. The tears we're giving you a show. I took it away on the mirror. I couldn't get it. I'll never know. No, no, no, no, no, no, no. Look out, look out, look out, look out! I felt so helpless, what could I do? Remembering all the things we've been through Ouch, it's full of yourself and snaps I can't have a chance, but I don't care I'll never forget him Leader of the pack Ooh Gone Now he's gone Gone Now he's gone Don't you act, let it go Don't you act, let it go Don't you act, let it go I just had to have. My mind told me I should proceed with caution. But my heart said, go ahead and make a bid on that. And I said, hey, pretty lady, won't you give me a sign? I'd give anything to make you mine or mine. I'll see you bitten and be at your beckon call. Yeah, I've never seen anyone looking so fine. Man, I gotta have her. She's a one of a kind. I'm going once, going twice. I'm sold. I'm a lady in the second row. She's an eight. She's a nine. She's a ten. I know she's got ruby red lips, blonde hair, blue eyes And I'm about to bid my heart goodbye Well, the auctioneer was going about a mile a minute He was taking bids and calling them out loud And I guess I was really getting in it Cause I just shouted out above the crowd And I said, hey pretty lady, won't you give me a sign I'd give anything to make you mine or mine I'll do your bidding and be if you beck and call Yeah, I've never seen anyone looking so fine Man, I gotta have a chance of one of a kind I'm going once, going twice, I'm sold Like a lady in a long black dress, which won my heart It was no contest with a ruby red lips, blonde hair, blue eyes Well, I'm about to bid my heart goodbye Yeah, we found love on the auction block And I hauled a hard way Now we still love to laugh about The way we met that day when I said Hey, pretty lady, won't you give me a sign? I'd give anything to make you mine on mine I'll do your bidding and be at your beck and call Yeah, I've never seen anyone looking so fine Man, I gotta have her, she's a one of a kind I'm going once, going twice I'm sold on the lady in the second row She's a naked, she's a nine, she's a ten, I know She's got booby-red lips, blonde, and blue eyes I'm about to get my heart to fire We're caught in a trap I can't walk out Because I love you too much, baby Why can't you see What you're doing to me When you don't believe a word I say We can't go on together With suspicious minds And we can build our dreams On suspicious minds So if an old friend I know I might have said hello Would I still see suspicion in your eyes But here we go again Asking where I've been You can't see the tears are real, I'm crying We can't go on together With suspicious minds And we can build our dreams On suspicious minds Oh, let our love survive I'd dry the tears from the eyes Let's don't let a good thing die When honey, you know I'll never lie to you Yeah, yeah We're caught in a trap I can't walk out Because I love you too much, baby Why can't you see What you do with me When you don't believe a word I say Don't you know I'm caught in a trap I can't walk out Because I love you too much, baby Don't you know I'm caught in a trap I can't walk out Because I love you too much, baby Don't you know I'm caught in a trap I can't walk out Because I love you too much, baby Don't you know I'm caught in a trap I can't walk out because I love you too much, baby. Don't you know I'm caught in a trap? I can't walk out because I love you too much, baby. Don't you know I'm caught in a trap I can't walk out Because I love you too much, baby Don't you know I'm caught in a trap I know you need a friend Someone you can talk to Who will understand What you're going through When it comes to love There's no easy answer Only you can say What you're gonna do I heard you on the phone You took his number, said you were alone, but you called him soon Isn't he the guy, the guy who left you crying? Isn't he the one who made you blue? When you remember those nights in his arms You know you gotta make up your mind Are you gonna stay with the one who loves you Or are you going back to the one you love? Someone's gonna cry when they know they've lost you Someone's gonna thank the stars above What you gonna say when he comes over There's no easy way to see this through All the broken dreams, all the disappointment Oh girl, what you gonna do? Your heart keeps saying it's just not fair But still you gotta make up your mind Are you gonna stay for the one who loves you? Or are you going back to the one you love? Someone's gonna cry when they know they've lost you. Someone's gonna thank the stars above. I love you. I love you. Oh, yeah. Thank you. Oh, yeah. I need to see your face Like a morning sun He'd be back in the deep It's coming up like a few Had thought to read it In my life to me I'm so fine When I'm inclined To do my best Negative wins When I compare Then I lose the test Not many times Come out Tell the story Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah Surely as I've begun You will have one battle with the serpentine fire Surely as I've begun You will have one battle with the serpentine fire Gonna tell the story of morning glory All about the serpentine fire Gonna tell the story of morning glory All about the serpentine fire We'll be right back. I took my card in a standing line To make a buck I would go over time I guess I'll let us keep going in there I'll put my back to the track with me The boss can't even recall my name I show up late and I'm down in the middle I feel like just another Smoke in a great big wheel Like a tiny blade of grass in a great big field To workers, I'm just another drunk To my bell, I'm just another drunk I'm just another statistic on the sheet. Teachers, I'm just another child. IRS, I'm another file. I'm just another consensus on the streets. Gonna cruise out of this city. Head down to the sea. Gonna shout out at the ocean. It's me. And I feel like a number. I feel like a number I feel like a stranger A stranger in this land I feel like a number I'm not a number I'm not a number Give me that I'm a man I said I'm a man I'm going to cruise out of this city Head down to the sea I'm going to shout out at the ocean Hey, it's me I feel like a number I feel like a number I feel like a stranger A stranger in this land I feel like a number I'm not a number I'm not a number Damn it, I'm a man I feel like a number I feel like a number Feel like a monster I'm a monster Thank you. so I'd ask for any postponements or withdrawals at this time. While they're coming up, I have been asked to remind the commission members to please log in. Mr. Cayley. Mr. Chairman, members of the commission, Rory Cayley with EA Partners. Page 1, Item B, Plan 2003-209P, Masterson Hills and Masterson Station, request a one-month postponement. Thank you. Anyone in the audience wish to speak on this proposed postponement? If not, you're asking for a one-month? Yes. Mr. Sally, do you have a date on that? Yes, Mr. Chairman. your meeting in May is on the 10th for subdivision items. Okay. Do we have a motion for postponement? Mr. Chairman. Yes, sir. Move a postponement of plan 2012, no, 2003-09p until May the 10th. Okay. Thank you. Is there a second? Second. Motion has been made and seconded for postponement until May 10th, 2012. Well, all those in favor, please vote, or please vote one way or another. Motion passes. Thank you. Thank you. Any other requests for postponement or withdrawals? Mr. Chairman and members of the Commission, my name is Matt Carter with Vision Engineering. If you look on page 4 of the agenda, item F, DP 2012-23, George West Estate Property, we would ask for a two-week postponement to the April 26th hearing. Thank you, Mr. Carter. Anyone in the audience wish to speak to this postponement? If not, I'll entertain a motion. Mr. Chairman, I recommend postponement of DP 2012-23 George Wester State for the two-week postponement until April 26th. Still second. Still second. The motion has been made and seconded for postponement until April 26th. Please vote. Thank you, Mr. Carter. It passes. See you in two weeks. Any other requests for postponement or withdrawal? If not, Mr. Sallee, can you run us through the consent agenda? I'd be glad to, Mr. Chairman. Thank you. I'm pleased to tell the Commission that most of your remaining items do qualify for consideration at this time on your consent agenda. There is one preliminary subdivision plan that's been recommended for approval by your subdivision committee. That is the very first item on your agenda, page 1, item A, Plan 2012-14P, an amended preliminary subdivision plan for Hamburg Place Community, Phase 2. This involves property at 2350 Winchester Road, a portion of that address. There are three final subdivision plans also recommended for approval by your subdivision committee that can be considered on your consent agenda. The first is on page 2, item A of your regular meeting agenda, Plan 2012-15F, Henry Clay Subdivision, Unit 11, Section 3, Lots 106, 107, and 108, amended. This involves property at 737, 741, and 745 Pioneer Lane. The next item on your meeting agenda is also on the consent agenda. It's Plan, page 2, item B, Plan 2012-16F, an amended final record plat for Santa Barbara and Lucille Cottle Little Property, Unit 1A, Lot 1A, located at 2400 Old Frankfurt Pike and 2407 Mackinwood Drive. The final subdivision plat is the next item on your meeting agenda, page 2, item C, Plan 2012-17F, amended plat for Hamburg Place Mall, Unit 1, Parcel 2, Lot 4, amended. This involves a portion of 2145 Sir Barton Way. There are also three remaining final development plans that can be considered on your consent agenda. The first appears on page 3, item C of your meeting agenda, DP 2012-18, an amended final development plan for Family Center, Unit 1A, Lot 5, involving property at 1114 East New Circle Road. The next item on your meeting agenda, page 4, item D, is also on the consent agenda, DP 2012-19, Beaumont Forest, Unit 1, Lot 4E, amended. This involves property at 2429 Members Way. The final item on your consent agenda is on page 4, item E of your meeting agenda, DP 2012-20, an amended final development plan for the Lexington Clinic property located at 1225 South Broadway. Mr. Chairman, at this time, all of these items can be considered for approval based on the recommendation of your subdivision committee unless a member of the Commission or a member of the audience would ask to have one of these removed for further discussion. Thank you. Would any Commission member like to have one of these removed? Anyone in the audience wish to hear one of these? If not, I'll entertain a motion for approval of the consent agenda. Mr. Chairman, I'll move for approval of the consent agenda. Thank you. The motion has been made and seconded for approval of the consent agenda as read. Please vote when it comes up on your screen. Motion passes for approval of the consent agenda. I believe our first item is DP 2012-7, Tattersall's apartment. We'll let staff set up. And we do have revised conditions and a waiver before you as well. Thank you. of the situation. Mr. Martin, is that a new jacket? Yes, sir, it is. Are you going to Keeneland? Not today, no. Okay. Go ahead, Mr. Martin. The first item on your agenda is on page 3 under development plans, It's item A, DP 2012-7, Tattersall's Apartment Development. The development is located off South Broadway. Oops. I brought a picture map for you today. Is this not on? How's that? Yeah, it's a problem. How's this? There we go. I can get myself now. There we go. Again, I wanted to give you an orientation to where this property was located. Although the zone change was approved in November, it's been a while since you've seen this property. The development plan has been postponed for several months. Here is South Broadway in this location. I use nice bright spring colors, by the way, so it would stand out for you. This is the property in question. Of course, here is Red Mile Road. You can see the track and that development and how it dominates the area. These I highlighted for you. These are the more recent student housing developments that have been approved along Angliana recently. Here, of course, is Curry Avenue. And again, as I stated, this is the area in question that is depicted on the final development plan. There are revised conditions, by the way, that have been handed out to you at your seats. Again, here we are on South Broadway. This is the frontage along South Broadway. Curry Avenue is running right up through here. the top of the plan. Here is the proposed connection of the new public street from Curry that runs down along the rear of this development plan. Red Mile Track sits in this location. The plan that you see before you is one of several revisions that staff has received on this plan during the time that it was postponed. You may recall that originally on the ZDP, you had buildings located in these locations. They were apartment buildings. They were four stories. They had interior courtyards. That was what was approved on your ZDP. Subsequently, the original development plan that was filed had that same layout. The revision that you see before you shows a townhouse-oriented development. Now, the apartments or the units are concentrated in the same general location as the original buildings. These are three-story townhouse-style apartments. The parking and number of units and bedrooms have all been significantly reduced. There was a lot more parking in this area originally. You can see that that has been removed. In fact, the exact numbers for this plan is that the original plan had 272 units proposed. This plan is proposing 152 units. The bedrooms have been reduced from 832 bedrooms to a total of 608 bedrooms. and the parking has been reduced from 745 parking spaces to 607. And in fact, the most recent revision that we received was yesterday and that was an additional small reduction in the parking that the applicant wished to make to reach that number that I just related to you. Again, here's the South Broadway frontage. Here is the office, community center, recreational area for the residents. This is the pool. Detention is proposed here underground along this part of the plan. Access is being proposed in this location off of Broadway. You can see it's modified from the original plan. there was a lot of discussion about the improvements and how this would work there was discussion about whether or not an access would work here access would work here or here it has been worked out with the applicant that this location will work it's important to note that it's at grade is how it will be built which will allow turning movements to be quicker into this and not present as much of a backup problem along South Broadway. On the back, again, with the public street that's being proposed here, there's an entrance here and here being proposed. These are gated or proposed to be gated entrants to control access to the apartment complex. There is a gate as well in this location to control access from South Broadway. You can see, again from your handout, that we've modified some of the conditions we're recommending on this plan. There are standard conditions, as you can see, including the engineer, traffic and building inspection, forest or fire, solid waste. These are all standard sign-offs on a final development plan. The first condition that you see, provided the Urban County Council approved ZODA 2012-3, is the amendment to Article 9 that the Planning Commission recently passed that allows group residential projects to be in an R5 zone. And that's why you see the townhouse development. Without that ZODA, you would not see the plan in this current configuration that's before you today. There are a few cleanup conditions. One of those has relevance to a waiver request that you have before you today. You may recall that initially in front of the committees there was discussion about the trees on this site. This is a heavily treed site. Most of the trees are going to be removed. They are making an effort to maintain a significant tree, a bur oak in this location, and a sycamore in this location. But by and large, the remaining trees are going to be removed on this site, including several very large trees. You may recall the large catapa tree is included on this site. Unfortunately, with the development, they are going to be removed. Staff was concerned with the original plan, again, where they had the rectangles with the courtyard. Staff had been concerned about their ability to meet their canopy requirement. With this revised layout, we are comfortable that they can. In addition, they are allowed under the ordinance to count areas through here where there's existing canopy. They're allowed to count that towards their own. We had just been concerned whether or not they could meet it. they are comfortable now that they can do so. For instance, in this area, there is a very large hackberry, very large. Again, they can count part of that canopy. So staff is comfortable in that regard. We just want those numbers clarified, and that's the purpose of that condition. There were Board of Adjustment approvals of several dimensional variances that need to be denoted on the plan. we're requiring that they extend sidewalks to connect to the new street that's I'm sure just an oversight on their part there's going to be sidewalks along that street on one side and we believe sidewalks obviously ought to be extended out of development to that street height of the buildings need to be denoted on the plan as I stated before There is a waiver request, number 14, and I'm going to come back to that. Kentucky Department of Transportation's approval of the proposed access to South Broadway. It is staff's understanding that our traffic engineering division, the Kentucky Department of Transportation applicant, met and discussed this proposed access. As I mentioned before, there had been discussion about three different points along South Broadway. They have had a meeting of the minds on how this will work and function appropriately in this location. It's our understanding. Again, as I stated, we want tree canopy information. In the case of 17, condition 17, our concern was on a previous submittal. They showed heavy landscaping in this area. That landscaping is designed to shield the track, and that's a very important part of this plan. It's a very important aspect of their negotiations with Red Mile. They want to minimize the distractions of headlights and similar things, moving traffic and that sort of thing, scaring horses and being a safety issue. They drop that off, and they need to add that back onto this plan because that's an important aspect of what they intend to do in this area. There's a slight conflict that they need to resolve with the sidewalk in this area. You can see this connection to Curry. There's a slight little sidewalk getting onto somebody else's property. They need to resolve that and show that correctly on property that they control and be well within the right-of-way. So it's a slight cleanup condition. we have another issue on the development plan and this again was new to this submittal and they're talking about a temporary turnaround in this area we'd like to have all that information removed there's no need to denote that this street is intended to come through they're going to build it and we'll hook up with the access that exists on Red Mile Road to provide an eventual connection all the way through to Red Mile Road The waiver request that you have before you, and has been handed out on white paper, concerns the geometrics primarily of the cross-section of this new public street. there is in your handout and I think this will assist you in following is the proposal that they're making for their cross section and this is in fact not a typical cross section for a local street our local streets and the subregs require 40 feet of pavement which they are proposing, it requires 7-foot utility strips on each side and a 4-foot sidewalk. That's your standard local street geometrics. Our subregs also require that the curves through here have a 200-foot radius. This that you see before you today is 100 feet. these curves just have now the justification in your report for that is the constraints on this narrow strip of land between their proposed development and the red mile and the need to screen the red mile this little section through here is approximately 140 feet as they come down through here again this will help slow and calm traffic and it's unlikely that anyone will be able to pick up a lot of speed over this short distance. They are also proposing a six-foot sidewalk in this location. And again, as I stated, normally we have a four-foot sidewalk. They are proposing six feet here along their property to allow for a good pedestrian connection and a comfortable sidewalk for people to use. One of the reasons they are doing that is because they are proposing no sidewalk along the trackside. And that is to prevent pedestrians from having a negative impact on Red Mount harness track. And that is of great concern to the harness track. They're very, very concerned that pedestrians, if they're encouraged on this side, might be encouraged to do things that could be harmful or negative to the track. So that's the purpose for this. So the compromise, again, is to have a six-foot sidewalk along this side. Along the same lines, if you look at the cross-section, they are proposing a six-foot utility strip along this side. That is certainly adequate for the provision of utilities. It was reviewed by your technical committee, this plan was. There were no issues at that time with that particular utility strip. Now, on this side of the street, they're proposing a two-foot utility strip. In conjunction with the two-foot utility strip, they've requested a waiver of 6-10 of your subdivision regulations, which govern street trees. Street trees are often planted within the utility strip, that seven-foot strip. However, the subdivision regs offer the option of street trees being planted in a five-foot easement on the outside of the sidewalk. In this case, staff is confident they have plenty of room to establish a five-foot easement along this side to plant street trees, and that will complement their efforts to shield the track with additional landscaping. I will summarize the waiver report by saying that your staff is recommending approval of the waiver on the geometrics of the proposed street. We, however, are recommending disapproval of the request for the street tree waiver. Again, it's not necessary. There is an option available to the applicant to plant street trees along the track side of the development. Your subdivision committee did recommend approval of this plan at their meeting, and staff, again, has handed out revised conditions for your consideration. With that, I'll be happy to answer any questions you may have. Any questions from Mr. Martin? Mr. Penn. So, Tom, does this plan show a connection or does it show a turnaround? This plan shows a turnaround, which will have to be removed. The intent is for it to connect and allow traffic to move through Red Mile. Now, that will be based on the timing of the Red Mile development as well. They control that portion of access. Will they be their tree canopy? Is that conditioned on an easement to put on the backside of the track like we saw? No, sir, it is not. They have prepared an exhibit. Staff has had several discussions with them, and they are confident they can meet that canopy requirement without those extra trees. Thank you. Mr. Burr? Tom, the entrance and exit on South Broadway, that's right in, right out only? No, sir. So you got a left turn? Yes, sir. On that second? This is the right in only right here. Second was my concern. I'm sorry. This is right in. This is a right out and a left turn is available to people should traffic allow at this location. Should traffic allow? Should traffic allow. Yes, sir. Once a decade? And traffic's okay with that? They have informed us that they did agree with this access point, as did the Kentucky Department of Transportation. Wow. Okay. Marie. Yes, Mr. Martin. I want you to look at typical Section B-B. And particularly, on the right-hand side underneath the tree, there's a four-foot, meaning a four-foot sidewalk. two more feet, which would make a six-foot sidewalk, and then a plank fence right beside the sidewalk. Am I reading that right? Yes, ma'am. The six-foot sidewalk that you see there is four feet of it is in the right-of-way, and two feet of it is in a sidewalk easement that will be established on the applicant's property. So even though they're going to put six feet of concrete, one side's against a wall, so you've really only got four feet of working sidewalk because people don't walk in that two feet. They swing their arms. So you've really still just got a four-foot sidewalk on a six-foot pad because it's right up against the fence. There will be a fence there, yes, ma'am. Yeah, so it's technically, and I take it, it's higher than two or three feet. It's a four-foot-tall fence, right? It's a four-plank fence. Well, as long as it's higher than a knee, you've lost that two feet of concrete because of arm swing and people don't walk next to a wall. So I just want to point out that we've still got a four-foot sidewalk on a six-foot pad. That's all. Yes, ma'am. Mr. Penn? Mr. Martin, on that access to South Broadway, where it's proposed there, how close is it to the access from the restaurant? In other words, are we going to have two cars trying to turn left out of two real close driveways? There is a driveway to this restaurant. Of course, this was formerly known as the Coach House. I understand. I'm not aware. But yes, yes, sir, there is an access point, and potentially there could be two left turns happening. So who has the right-of-way when you pull up there? Whichever one goes first? I guess whichever one can beat the other one, yes, sir. As you are aware, there's a lot of that mixed access up and down Broadway, and undoubtedly there will be times of conflict. And the Department of Transportation thinks that's all right? I think they agreed that this is the best of a bad situation. I don't understand why you couldn't have a joint with the restaurant and only have one going out of there at a time. I can't address that issue. They tried. They met with that property owner, as did planning and the division of traffic, and no accommodation could be reached at this time. That would be a very, very much better solution. Much better. I'm not. But, yes, much better. The best adjective I could come up. It would be an improvement, certainly, but they just could not reach an accommodation. Any other questions from commission members? I do have something. Two things. One, you were talking about the back entrances. You first said gated or proposed. Are they gated or are they still in discussion? They are proposed entrances, and they are gated, yes. Okay. The second thing, following up with Mr. Penn, as far as coming back down the back road, whatever that's going to be called, we're doing away with temporary language and so forth. When will that be connected and have full access on out to Red Mile? We can't speak to an exact time other than to say that the Red Mile does have its own change that affects a portion of property near this. It is on their development plan, and there is a TIF money that's involved that will allow them to do improvements. But it will be contingent upon their developing the property. It will be contingent on Red Mile's development? Yes, sir. Okay. Ms. Phillips. Tom, I'm confused. Is that public street existing, or is that a part of this development? It is a proposed public street. Okay. So they will build the portion that you see on this plan as a part of this plan. Okay. So the property line actually comes all the way back to the edge of the track. And they're using the rear portion of the property? In reality, this is all on Red Mile property. And this road will be all on Red Mile property, and there will have to be a plat dedicating it. There is a gap between the track and the street. The applicant will own what you see here. I guess what I'm getting at is I don't understand why we're even contemplating waivers for that street when it's not a part of this development plan. It is a part of this development plan, and this is also a preliminary subdivision plan as well, which is how you show the infrastructure and allows the waiver to be granted so that when it's dedicated as a record plan, it has been built according to your approval, this body's approval. I'm still not clear. What are we subdividing? This property can be subdivided if they choose to, and they'll need a preliminary subdivision plan to do so. And originally, before you approve the ZODA, which is going to council, they had to create a lot for each one of those buildings to comply with the R5 zoning requirements. Right, I remember when you talked about that. So it had to be a preliminary subdivision at that time. At this point, it needs to be a preliminary subdivision plan in order to create this street. And then they can choose to subdivide this or not subdivide it, whatever is appropriate to their requirements. Okay, so the only thing that's being subdivided at this point is the dedication of that public street. But didn't you say that's on the Red Miles property? It is, and they have permission. I mean, it's all part of the agreement, and I'm sure they could elaborate on the nature of that agreement and how it's intended to work. Any other questions? If not, we'll ask for that. We'll come forward and speak. Thank you, Tom. Good afternoon. I'm Chris Westover. I've got the pleasure of representing Hallmark Student Development in this final development plan and preliminary subdivision plan. With me is Matt Carter from Vision Engineering. First of all, let me say that after many, many hours and conversations that we've come to this point, I want to thank the staff for all their help and their effort, and I want to say that we agree with the staff's conditions and the recommendation of approval and request the Planning Commission to follow this recommendation. I can address specific issues, or I can entertain your questions. One issue I think that was raised was the landscaping and the separation from Red Mile of the proposed public street. I have an exhibit, if you all are interested to see it, to show how in addition to the tree canopy on the existing lot, we're going to do extensive tree stand in the corner of the Red Mile lot by Curry Avenue and then have heavy tree planting along there. This is conceptual, but this is something that the Red Mile has agreed to. I will say the Red Mile is most vigilant and most concerned that we do adequate protection of the horses in the track from the pedestrians and the traffic on here. So I can show you this. Go ahead and put it up on the screen. And in terms of the timing of the rest of that street, the Red Mile is actively trying to, right now, rezone part of the property there by Nelms Avenue. You will see that. I'm going to request a postponement at your April hearing. It's going to be heard in May, But that will give the Red Mile a little bigger chunk of developable land there, and their intention is that as soon as they can get a developer, that the developer would then continue that street from where it ends on the Tattersall lot all the way to Red Mile Road. Right now, if there's not an actual developer there, we're not sure exactly what is the best alignment of the street. and that's why there's not going to be a street put in now. In addition, Hallmark doesn't control that property. So I expect you'll be seeing something in the relatively near future. I just can't say when, but I do not think it's going to be years and years away. But anyway, if you look up there back by Curry Avenue, you can see an extensive tree planting there, and I think there's an intention to maybe put more trees even in that, what I'll call the triangular area. And then you can see going down around the track, there's a very heavy buffer there, and that is to, in part, protect the horses from being spooked from lights, traffic, and so forth. And I would say it's also in part because if you're sitting in the grandstand and you're looking over there, it's probably a more attractive view than seeing a road. The waiver that we requested for planting over there, we asked in an abundance of caution. We don't need it, and we would be just as agreeable to withdraw the request because what we are doing now is we have an agreement with Red Mile for a planting and maintenance easement that is going to take care of all the landscaping on Red Miles property, not just in this corner but all the way around and down. So we do have plenty of room within that planting easement so that we can do adequate trees. So there's no question but that we will have not only enough to meet the tree canopy, but we will have a very attractive and adequate space to put our street trees as well. Ms. Westover, Mr. Penn has a question. On that road, are you using the planting on tattersaws to meet your tree canopy? No. So all the planning left of that road going toward Curry Avenue is not counted on your tree canopy? On that side of the street. On the Red Mile side? On the Red Mile side of the street. We can count the other side of the street because it abuts. I understand. But none of that is counted, no. The other question is, is that are you telling us that these buildings may be occupied and traffic may be flowing before you get the connection to Red Mile Road? That's possible, but there's going to be a connection to Curry, to the lighted Curry, and then to Versailles. So if you don't get it done, you'll put a turnaround just before it would take? No, no. There's going to be a provision for a turnaround at the driveway that's closest to Red Mile Road. I'll point it out. Take your microphone with you, Ms. Westover. Thank you. It will be right there that there will be adequate room for people temporarily to come here and turn around here and go back. Ms. Westover, what about will the connection to Curry Avenue be made before you get an occupancy permit? Yes. So what we're going to do in effect if we don't get the other zoning done is we're going to make all those people either go out Curry Avenue or make a left-hand turn out of Broadway or right. There's no relief other than Curry Avenue to a stoplight or go out on Broadway and make a left all right. Well, actually, this is a great improvement to the original plan. I think the preliminary zoning development plan that we originally presented, we did not have access to Curry Avenue at all. And that was a subsequent development, and we were very happy to be able to get that connection there. We have also reduced the number of units and reduce the number of beds as well by, I guess, one-fourth. So just temporarily, it should be more than adequate to accommodate the traffic that is leaving because there will be the choice of South Broadway or there will be the choice of going to Curry and either going left onto Versailles or right onto South Broadway. And in response to one comment about when is there ever a gap in traffic, I went out there yesterday. I was out there a couple different times of the day, And these are photographs that I took standing more or less at where this full access is going to be. And that's our property in the foreground, and there's no traffic coming or going. I think there are certainly times of day when it's problematic, but there are other times of day when there would be a way to make that turn there. There are several other ones, too, that it's pretty much wide open. And there's a middle lane as well, so that if somebody wanted to leave there to turn left, they have the security of that middle lane. That's looking up in the other direction. And so the state highway engineer has approved this access, and our local traffic engineers have approved this as a full access. And it's also very consistent. That's just some shows where they were there. But if you recall, up and down South Broadway, this is an infill situation. It's an urban situation, and there are a number of full-service entrances all up and down there. I think Matt has counted there may be our 13 full-access turning movements possible all up and down there. So this is pretty much consistent with that. Also, our development should not be generating too much in the way of traffic, especially during peak hour trips, because our students are going to be going onto that sidewalk, walking down to the light, crossing over, and then crossing on that pedestrian bridge over to the U.K. We have a question from Mr. Burr. Yeah, well, I've got two accesses. So this is one of my big concerns. I agree that there's too many other accesses that are coming left on the metro. You understand, it's ridiculous. We had so many dangerous – I don't know when you took these pictures, but it's circling that anytime I've ever written down there. There's always traffic. So, again, that's not my profession. So I'll leave it to the experts from the state and city, but that seems to me to be the wrong way to go with this. The second question is having to do with the light from the buildings closest to the red mile. You had an overhead there before. The trees on the opposite side, the side closest to the apartments. How tall are those trees? And how tall are the buildings? So if some kids are partying out of the balcony, are they going to be disturbing the horses by line of sight? With lights or music or anything? The buildings, I believe, are 35 feet tall. and they're three-story buildings, and so you figure the balconies would be a little bit lower than that, and there are a number of large species trees proposed to be planted throughout there. I think that that can be taken into consideration in designing which trees are going to be planted where or the type of tree. And when. I mean, if you plant a tree that's going to be tall enough in 10 years, it's probably not going to do much for the track now. So did they wait in on this and they're in agreement? We have shown the Red Mile the landscape, the type of landscaping, and they are fine with it. They like it. They approve it. Can I add one thing about the lighting? I spoke with the engineer who's designing the lighting yesterday, and he's designing it so that when you get to the property line, the foot candles read zero from this development. So he's not going to be pushing light out onto the surrounding developments. Okay, so that would be the light, I guess the common lighting, as opposed to the apartment lighting or the townhouse lighting. It would be parking lighting, and it would take account any lighting that's like backlighting on the building. And, you know, it doesn't take into account vehicles and things like that, but any lighting that is being developed in there, it takes that into account. Okay, so I'm not trying to micromanage this, but the end buildings closest to the track, if there's, again, kids out there partying on their balconies, is it going to be visible from the track? Because there's going to be a time lag between when you plant these trees and when they're at the full height of whatever they're supposed to be. Yeah, exactly. The night racing is what I'm concerned about. Right. I believe that the balconies would be back here and back here, not along the sides here, and the front of the buildings don't have balconies. So where your finger is right now, though, you're looking at four or five, potentially six balconies that could have line of sight to the track over the tree. Some of them, perhaps, yes. And then the same four, and then two or three, and then probably none on that last one. I doubt that there would be many there, so there could be a few there. But again, Red Mile has seen this, and they approve the landscaping. And I think they have the most substantial stake in making sure of the viability and the success of the Red Mile. So they are fine with the landscaping plan. One thing I'd like to add is they are familiar with, on Angliana, there's apartments that back up to the Red Mile. and they're familiar with students and how that interacts with the horses. So I would speculate that based on the ones that are already built, they have a certain comfort level. Other questions, Mr. Burr? Mr. Berkeley? Can you tell me the distance from this entrance to the intersection? To the intersection of Angliana, it's 400 feet. And to the intersection of Red Mile, 900 feet. Right. And those are plus or minus a few feet. Well, and I think one thing we need to consider, too, in the very near future, Newtown Pike Extension will also dump on to South Byway. So there's going to be increased traffic as a result of that. So I guess my question is, as a compromise, would you all consider a write-in, write-out only entrance there? Well, the full access is what they require. And everybody understands that the left turn onto South Broadway to go back to town is only feasible at certain times of the day. And that is consistent with every other development up and down that area. So based on the timing of the lights and traffic at different times of day and the ability of folks in this development to go back and have alternative access, and eventually when they get to Red Mile Road, they're going to even be able to have more choices. Well, and that's my point is that I see that connection as being very critical. And the point to other entrances that are existing now, you know, this property, yes, it has an entrance, but it's not in this type of use at this point. And I have a real problem with a left out. Well, when we discussed this repeatedly with the state transportation people and our local transportation people, they felt sufficiently secure in signing off on this location as a full access. And in fact, when the vision engineering went and met on site the last time, when they talked to the state transportation people and the local transportation people, a right lane turn-in was discussed, and it was determined that that wasn't even warranted. Ms. Westover, if I may, it seems like everybody's focusing on South Broadway there. Let me ask Mr. Gallimore from Traffic to come up and give us his thoughts on this. Mr. Gallimore, as you're coming up, obviously we're having a discussion now. The last time we saw this, there was quite a bit of discussion as well simply on this and the merits of a left turn as opposed to just a right in, right out only. What kind of light can you shed on this? Well, I think everybody will agree that there are definitely certain times that the left turn is almost going to be impossible out of this property. And there's two schools of thought on that process, and that is people will very quickly learn those times and will not try to make that left turn maneuver, either by right turning out of the Broadway access point or ultimately when the rear connections are made. So you would like to think that would happen, but in reality there's probably on the other end of the spectrum there's some people that are going to try to make that move, irregardless whether or not it's going to be a safe movement or not. Broadway, like most of our major articles, you have a.m. peaks, you have p.m. peaks. We now also talk about what I call the noon hour peak, which I think most of you will grieve, probably from about 11 o'clock till 1 o'clock in the afternoon all these arcturals are pretty much flooded with traffic we have to time the lights different for the noon hour versus the morning and the evenings in the morning and evenings we work on kind of a plug flow concept where we're pushing everybody out to town or everybody in town. At lunch time you've got people pretty much 50% distribution going either way so we can't use that plug flow concept and pretty much just have to tie the timing to even things out. This intersection, in a way, is somewhat, or this access point, is somewhat of a good location because it's approximately halfway between the two signals. And you would like to think that we could be able to create a gap with the signals to allow some left-turn movements. And as I mentioned, when traffic volumes are low, there is probably a gap, and I think Ms. Westover's picture somewhat indicated that. The other thing to keep in mind is, too, we do have the center lane for cars to hover. If it were not for that center lane, the left-hand movement would be even more so difficult probably a lot more times in the day. But at least what they can do is if they can get over that center lane, and then they can wait and then merge into the traffic on the inbound side. So this property does, I think, ultimately is going to have some advantage of having alternate routes, which, as you know, there was a property not too long ago close to this location, closer to Red Mile that was approved and had no other access except full access to Broadway. And just watching that property, that seems to be a real problem for that development because I think a lot of people may not visit that property because they don't have a good way out. That's a property where the Apple Market and Motel and Mexican Restaurant? All right. Mr. Penn, do you have a question? Yeah. Mr. Galloway, are we going to change the traffic pattern on Curry Avenue as far as parking? so if they can't go out that way, they can go out and curb, but they don't have to zigzag through the cars that are parked on Curry. If you go down to Curry now, I mean, you've got one lady at best, and they're parked on both sides of the street. I can't see Curry being widened, and if they're going to not make the connection to Red Mile Road before they take occupancy, you're going to have two tough trips. You've either got to make a left-hand turn out of there, or you've got to hope you don't meet somebody on Curry Avenue. And what's traffic? What do you all plan to do about that? For an existing situation like Curry, generally what would have to happen is typically a neighborhood would have to form a petition and vote to eliminate parking or reduce parking on the street. and typically what we find a lot of folks even though they don't like the congestion they like even less the idea of having less on street parking so in other words we can't go in and automatically just eliminate that parking the only thing that i'm aware of that the city can do is if it's deemed i think it's by the fire marshal that that's a fire hazard that could be the parking could be taken away as a fire lane But there's businesses on Curry Avenue, too. It's not just residential. Well, it's still the same idea, that it has to be voted on by the folks in that block, and we would only do it normally a block at a time. And I think it requires not just a majority vote. I think it's a 60% or 66%. So the students are going to have to duck and weave and wait and do whatever to get to the light. That would be my guess, and that's one of the reasons, if you'll notice, for the last, I'm going to say, three or four years, when we have new subdivision plats come through, we try to lobby to get parking restricted to that time on the plat. Sure. And one reason being people don't like to move into a neighborhood thinking they have parking on both sides of the street, and then two years later we come down there and put up no parking signs, and then, you know, they've got an overflow situation. It'll be a great sobriety test on them. Any other questions for Mr. Gallimore? Mr. Calamore, I do have one. You mentioned the center plane on Broadway. What's the stacking situation there for backing up from Angliana? Would that get into that play? I think you have stacking problems from Angliana at times, and you also have stacking problems from Red Mile. From Red Mile as well? Yes. So potentially you can have it from, I won't say both in simultaneously. I think there are certain parts of the day it's Angliana stacking, and then the other part times of the day it's the Red Mile stacking. Okay. Thank you. Any other questions for Mr. Gallimore? Thank you, sir. Ms. Westover, sorry for the interruption. That's quite all right. I can point something else out as well, and that is that although there's not going to be a public street yet constructed between the Tattersall property line and Red Mile Road, there is going to be a driveway that the Red Mile can use. It's their existing driveway. It's their property, as well as the students and others related to this development. So in other words, the students who live here, if they choose to drive out by a different way, they can go by way of Curry or they can use that driveway that will get them to Red Mile Road. so it won't be 100% going out Curry as an alternative to South Broadway. Okay, thank you. Any other questions for Ms. Westover? Anything else you'd like to add this morning, Ms. Westover? Whoops, I'm sorry. Ms. Copeland? Ms. Westover, do you see this ever becoming faculty housing? Well, when it's built, it will be multifamily housing. In theory, it could be anybody's housing. It's just that the developer is currently building it to market to students. Okay, because we don't have a faculty housing kind of place close to the university. But keep in mind, commissioners, that students aren't necessarily interested in going in 5 o'clock traffic somewhere or 9 o'clock traffic. They're in school, and maybe they biked, and they're interested in going to the movies or to their night job. So that may diminish the effect of the in-and-out problem. because if it's going to stay student housing, then you've got student habits, one, they don't get up until 10 o'clock. So is the other plan available that was first offered? And could you quickly, is it available, Mr. Martin? Oh, I'm sure it is. The preliminary zoning development plan. Yes. Before we finish, could you just quickly show us the contrast of the two as far as coming up for the zoning? And can these townhouses be sold fee simple? No, it's all going to be on one lot. But you can't buy Townhouse A or Townhouse B. You'd have to buy that group, right? Well, this entire property is all on one lot. It's going to be all owned by one entity. So they are not going to be subdivided and sold. Well, could they be down the road? Well, I suppose hypothetically they could be condoed, but they cannot be subdivided because this is all on one lot. But the current plan is 200 beds fewer, almost 200 parking spaces fewer, and it is a much better plan. And this was, what was this one? I just want to see why we need a new zoning ordinance. What's the advantage of the new zoning ordinance? And this points it out. The new zoning ordinance will allow this development to take place all on one lot. under the current laws until that zoning ordinance text amendment is enacted by the council, we had to create a separate lot for each principal structure. This clubhouse could have gone to another, could go with this one, let's say. So we had to create this crazy quilt of lot lines, and each building separately had to meet the height to yard requirements and all the other requirements, which made it very difficult to do even four. But now that we've gone to this townhouse-looking concept, it would be, I think, impossible to do this development under the current R5 zoning regulations because we would have to have a separate lot for each one of these. Thank you. Any other questions for Ms. Westover on this? I can't tell on this original plan the entrance that was off Broadway. What does it say there? I can't tell. Is it a full access? It was, and there was discussion at that time. I remember discussing it. Anything else? If not, I'll close this part of the hearing and open it up for discussion among the commission members and or vote. Motion. Any thoughts from anyone? Well, right now, I'll start and weigh in. The access onto South Broadway, the full access onto South Broadway, is very problematic to me, as I think has been expressed here. I have no problem with the right in, right out. to have our left turn lane there makes it problematic for me, plus hearing the fact that right now we would not have a connection onto the Red Mile property. So those would be my thoughts right now. Anybody else? Mr. Berkeley? I'm going to agree. The right in, right out, I would be fine with. The left turn. I'm not, and if that's the way it's going to be, I don't think I'm going to be able to vote for it. Mr. Penn? Somebody else go. No. Anyone else? Mr. Patrick. I'll reiterate my concern as well. I'm torn, though, because clearly you've got the traffic experts telling us they think it's okay. You've got a bunch of other people who have this right to do it. But why are we going to start to make our stand now? It seems to me this should have been the case all along. You've got this traffic pattern there. Again, every time I've been down there, it's a zoo. And I can't imagine trying to turn left out of there or how many accidents are going to be caused by somebody in the first lane waving them on and then the car coming up behind the second lane and hitting that car coming out or trying to get into the middle lane. I think it's going to be a fiasco, but I think it's a fiasco now, and I'm having a hard time drawing the line in the sand with this development plan. Mr. Penn. You know, I have the same concerns, but I didn't get a whole lot of relief when they talked about Curry Avenue. You can go down to Curry Avenue. I mean, I lived down in that area with tobacco warehouses, And with the businesses there and with the people that park there, it's one lane at best if you don't have a truck with side-view mirrors because there's traffic parked on both sides. So if you're going to close the entrance to Red Mile Road, and that may or may not be, probably won't be connected by the time you have occupancy there, and you force them one or two ways to go downtown, they either make a left-hand turn and play the lottery, or they get on Curry Avenue and have a sobriety test. I mean, it's just there's no good way to go left out of there, safe way to go left, unless you get that stoplight at Curry Avenue. So, you know, I don't know whether the state trumps the city on this. That's not my concern. It's just it's hard for me to believe that traffic professionals would agree that it's okay to go out of there. The other thing is that the restaurant, whatever it's used for, that exit is pretty close to the exit that is going to come out of this property. and I don't know who has the right-of-way. Is it whoever leaves first? I mean, I just don't see how that works. And when we talked about zoning this thing, we talked about having a joint entrance that would clean up the restaurant and clean up this too. And this is a big 10-acre development, and I don't understand why that exit on Broadway could not have been worked out. If we can work out the exit on Curry Avenue and we can talk about maybe sometime connecting the other one and we're going to put 800-something beds in there. I mean, this is a big development. This isn't just a little restaurant that comes out on South Broadway. May I address those concerns? I'm sorry, what was the question? May I address those concerns? Yes, ma'am, you may. Well, first of all, Mr. Penn, it's not 800 beds. We've reduced it. It's only 600 in some now. Now, the second thing is the students who live there, as well as staff or anybody involved with that, will have driveway access from the development to Red Mile Road now. It's just that it won't be opened up fully to public access. So the people that would be more likely to leave there would be the students themselves, and they'll still have driveway access there as another dispersal point until that road is fully open and dedicated as a public street. If that's the case, why were you talking about putting a turn around there? It was to get to the driveway. It doesn't show it here because it's off-site, but the current road there on Red Mile, that is the driveway. That's where you go to Fennels. That's the driveway. and this is more on the track side of the driveway. So there was trying to figure out how to do that. On the Red Mile side, Red Mile and the students will have access to that driveway. It just won't be open to the general public. So if you're concerned about traffic leaving here, it would be students, and the students could leave South Broadway, Curry, or they could take the driveway with card access. with card access okay Mr. Cravens so Ms. Westover of course I guess aren't these students supposed to be walking anyway riding bikes so you're not willing to give that left turn up onto Broadway even if the plan goes down you're not willing to do that well I hope that the plan doesn't go down. This is part of the Red Mile TIF that the Council recently approved to expand the development area. And if we get this approved, then we will be able to build this 30-some million dollar development, and that will trigger the TIF. So it's a linchpin in the overall Red Mile TIF. It would be probably the first tax increment financing district that will not only be approved, but will actually be on the ground in the very near future. And so it is a critically important piece of the overall economic development. So I hope the whole plan doesn't go down. In terms of the left turn onto South Broadway, the state and the local traffic experts, and that's what they do, they crunch those numbers and they do the traffic studies, they have determined that this is okay. and there are times of day when it's possible to make a left turn there. And I expect that any students who live there, they will figure out very quickly at such times as they use their car that they don't want to turn left at, what, 5 o'clock in the afternoon, but there are other ways out. Moreover, as you point out, the students will be walking. They will be walking to class. There are restaurants and other facilities close by where they can walk and bicycle. But the Hallmark thinks it is essential for the success of the project to have a left turn in and out. They would like to have it there so that the people will be able to pass the clubhouse and turn in, and it will be a great entry feature. Thank you, Ms. Westover. Other questions at this point? If not, I'll entertain a motion. Mr. Chairman? Mr. Wilson? I'm conflicted, too, because, quite frankly, I think that I'm sitting here listening to the traffic people tell me, the experts who are saying that it's okay, and I've also heard that other development all up and down the line is doing that. I feel uncomfortable, but I'm going to put it on the table. I will vote for approval for DP 2012-7, Datasol Apartment Development, Hallmark Student Development, located at 843 South Broadway and 1200 Red Mile Road. That motion would include the waiver as recommended by staff? It would include the waiver as presented by staff. The waiver was approved and one was disapproved. Which staff is recommended? You're going along with staff recommendations? Yes, I am. Yes. Okay, motion's been made for approval of DP 2012-7 with the 19 conditions, including the waiver, which does recommend approval of Article 6-8, Exhibits 6-1 and 6-3, and then disapproval of waiver Article 6-10B. I would need a second. Mr. Penn. I'll second it. Motion's been made and seconded for approval. Question, Mr. Penn? I don't understand why that left turn is such a needed thing for them, but they're willing to risk it. And to me, it's just silly to have a left turn out of there. And, you know, whether the rest of them have it or not doesn't matter to me. What matters to me is this plan. We can't do anything about the others. But to go along with this when a left-hand turn is an extremely dangerous thing to do. I hate to see the plan go down. It probably won't. But I have a hard time creating a situation that at best is just going to be a wreck and at worst is going to kill somebody. Because you don't bet 19- or 20-year-olds that they can't do something. Because as sure as you, they're going to try it. And, you know, it's a good plan. There's a lot of good things about the Curry Avenue thing really bothers me. But once we get the connection, I think that will work itself out. But that left turn out of there really bothers me. And I don't know why you're willing to go down on that, and I hope you don't. But I can't support this as long as that left hand turns there because I just don't believe that all those wrongs up and down South Broadway justify this one. Thank you, Mr. Penn. Any other discussion before the vote? Mr. Penn. Yes, Mr. Cravens. I guess we could amend this plan. Can we amend this plan to say that's a right turn only? Motion first. Huh? Can I vote on the motion? Well, I can amend the motion. I could amend the motion if you wanted to. Couldn't the traffic people just say, hey, we can't turn left out of here. You've got to turn right. You know, they've spoken. And if they were such experts, we wouldn't have this problem to begin with, would we? Let me ask this question to Mr. Wilson as far as a possible amendment. Do you want to leave your motion as is, or are you willing to amend it at this point? I guess the thing that bothers me so much is here the experts are telling us it's okay. And we as lay people are sitting here saying and trying to use, and I'm not arguing that that's not a good thing to do, but it's hard for me to sit here and argue against the experts who know and are sitting there now. I understand. In fact, I agree with everything that's been said on this. But, Mr. Chairman, I'm going to leave my motion as is. Okay. Thank you. Ms. Phillips, do you have anything to add at this point? I was just going to, if I can just echo Mr. Wilson's comments. I mean, we have experts on staff that are intended to give us advice, and here we're going contrary to. I'll call for the vote at this time. Vote when it appears on the screen. Motion for approval is no, is denied, so the motion is disapproved. Mr. Cravens. I might make another motion to approve it with a right turn only, right in, right out only on the South Broadway. I so move. I'll ask for legal on this. We're okay? Okay. Yes. Yes. And with the waiver for and the one against as staff recommended. Excuse me. I think that under Article 21 you need to have reason. You need to state a reason. Well, the reason that I'm making this motion. No. I think she's asking as far as reasons for disapproval. No, no. The reason for the modified condition. Okay. for the reasons of safety, traffic, health, and welfare of the residents going to live there. So, if I may, let me clarify the motion. The motion would be for approval of 2012-7 with the waiver as recommended. with the condition that access on the South Broadway is right in and right out only. That's correct. Okay. I'll ask for a second. Second. Motion's been made and seconded for approval. Changing this to right in, right out only now. Any further discussion before vote? If not, vote when it shows up on your screen. That motion passes. Thank you. Our next for staff would be DP 2012-17, Hamburg Place. And why? We have to agree. We have to agree. We have to agree. No, I don't know. She was one reason for it. She was one reason for it. Second motion. No, I don't think we have to. We only have to be heard to know that. Jeez. Mr. Taylor. All right. The next item on your agenda is on page 3. It's item B under development plans. It's DP 2012-17 Hamburg Place Mall, Unit 1, Parcel 2, Lot 4, amended. The purpose of this development plan is to add, I'm sorry, this is along Manowar Boulevard at Sir Barton Way, between Vendor and Pink Pigeon in front of the Meyer Shopping Center. The purpose of this amendment is to add a 5,800-square-foot restaurant at this outlot location in the front of the Meyer. The Culver's sits over here. Again, they're adding the restaurant here, utilizing some existing parking, using the existing access into the Meyer here, and providing one-way circulation around the building like this. The subdivision committee recommended approval of this plan subject to the eight conditions as noted on your agenda. This plan would have been eligible for your consent agenda. However, the applicant brought us a revised plan yesterday that increased the square footage by 700 square feet and added three parking spaces to the plan. With that increased square footage, that's not something the staff could approve as a minor, and it felt it important to get it in front of the planning commission so that you could be aware that this item was having an increase in the square footage. Other than that, I'll be happy to answer any questions you might have about this plan. Any questions for Mr. Taylor? No. Mr. Barrett? I don't have anything further to add. I just appreciate staff and girls allowing me to change building models at late notice like that. So thank you. Thank you, Mr. Barrett. Any questions from the commission? Yes, Ms. Copeland. What happened that we all of a sudden needed 700 square feet more? Well, they generally use, as I understand it, two models, a 57-plus model in their Cincinnati region and a 5,100-square-foot model that they use elsewhere. And they determined that Lexington fit their Cincinnati territory because it's a known restaurant, so it attracts a larger clientele. And they didn't register that initially and wanted to move it to their Cincinnati regional model, basically. So you expect higher traffic, more people at the restaurant? Right, because everyone in the Lexington market is generally familiar with Frisch's as a restaurant. Anything else from the Commission? If not, I should have asked. Anyone in the audience wish to speak on this? I'll close this part of the hearing, open it up for discussion or a motion. Mr. Brewer. Mr. Chairman, I'll move for approval of DP 2012-17, Hamburg Place Mall. Motion has been made and seconded for approval of DP 2012-17. If there's no further discussion, please vote when it comes up on your screen. Motion passes. Thank you. Thank you. As we're setting up for the next one, we do have a memorandum for the release and call of bonds. But I'll entertain a motion. Mr. Chairman, move approval of the release and call of bonds. Thank you. Motion's been made for approval. Is there a second? Motion's been made and seconded for approval of call upon stated 4-12-2012. Please vote when it comes up on the screen. Thank you. Motion passes. We'll take a very brief break, it sounds like. We'll take a break. Thank you. Okay, I think we're ready to get started. Mr. Sally. Chairman, you wish to take the staff item ahead of the commission item? Sure. Okay, just a moment, please. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. This item appears on page 5 of your agenda. This is DP 2012-16, Waller Property Amended. This is a minor amended development plan involving property at 1528, 1532, and 1534 North Limestone Street. The staff has passed out to you three items at the start of this discussion. One are the minutes from the Planning Commission's consideration of a rezoning of this property about a year and a half ago. attached to that is a staff exhibit that has a rendering of the property that was part of the Planning Commission's record at that hearing along with two elevation drawings and then finally a page entitled recommendations these are two pages from the central sector small area plan I have an aerial photograph to illustrate to you the location of this property. We'll put that on the overhead. Subject property is this lot on North Limestone Street. It is just to the south of New Circle Road, and in fact, in the top of the photograph, you can see the rear of a new CVS drugstore that is located on the corner of North Limestone and New Circle Road. Also to the south of the subject property are homes in the Shadow Lawn subdivision, and this being Rosemary Avenue, here, which intersects North Limestone at this location. You may remember we've had development plans for a car wash and auto dealership again. They're just off the photo to the north at this location. the next photo thank you it's new battery got it thank you this is the zoning development plan that the planning commission reviewed in late 2010 when the subject property was proposed for rezoning from residential to its current designation of b4 that's a wholesale and warehouse business zone and what was proposed were a series of fairly small warehouse uses and also shops of special trade that are allowable in the B4 zone. The next item on the overhead is the approved final development plan, which very closely mirrors the zoning development plan reviewed by the Planning Commission. We have the current development plan rendered to my immediate right as well. I'd like to introduce this to you first. Check. This is not true. Thank you. is proposed with a single access to North Limestone. Drainage proposed for the development was to be the career of the property here, abutting some of the residential uses on Lanetta Avenue in this location in the subdivision. The proposed development plan seeks a slightly smaller amount of square footage for these units. They are minimally 50 by 30 feet each with the exception of one larger unit at the corner. And the orientation is shifted into this arrangement, parallel line of warehouses toward the rear. This is virtually unchanged from the current plan. And these four units that were oriented along limestone, to the side of the property line adjacent to the area of this building or this location. What is really driving this proposed minor amendment is a change in the proposed detention agreement for the property. Keep trying. What is driving the change is proposed detention for the property. This is an existing basin on the property, and unlike the current development plan, this is now proposed to remain in place for the new development. This basin will be substantially reduced in size, and there is to be drainage between this line of warehouses and the homes along Rosemary Avenue, as depicted on this plan. This change in the drainage concept has been approved by the Division of Engineering, as has utilizing the existing detention basin on the property. The reduction in square footage is from 28,500 on the current plan and 26,800 is proposed on the minor amendment that's before you. The staff has referred this plan to the Commission, and it's also worthy to note that the access point is also proposed to shift a little less than 25 feet to the north, a little closer to New Circle Road. That is also allowable on a minor amendment. In looking at the minutes from your meeting in November of 2010, the staff highlighted a number of items in yellow on the attachments. And if I could refer you to page 22 of your minutes, those are the first highlights that are shown. and you can see that the architecture of the proposal was mentioned in a lot of the highlights that the staff have provided to you. The petitioner was willing to commit to developing the property in a substantial conformance with some of the architectural information you were shown about a year and a half ago. At the top of page 23, the architect said that the buildings would be tinted, split-faced block and stucco, and it would be somewhat similar to the materials used at the new drugstore at the corner of New Circle and North Limestone. Of note, on the very last page of the minutes, page 25, the Planning Commission did impose conditional zoning restrictions, for the property. You can see those in the middle of the page. There are 14 use restrictions, restrictions on music, sound systems, lighting, and under D, two landscaping proposals, one of which, under number two, set landscaping details along the frontage of the subject property. The current development plan shows this landscaping, as does the minor amendment. However, the minor amendment proposes to move the second tier of landscaping further back from North Limestone. The staff does not believe that that will purport to your conditional zoning restriction, we think the second line will need to move closer to limestone so that these trees are 15 feet on center. They look to be a little in excess of that distance. So we, under condition number two in our recommendation to you, which is on the tan sheet, are recommending that the landscaping be revised in order to meet that 15 foot on center requirement. In addition, looking again at the very last item on your page 25 minutes from November 18 of 2010, the Commission also added a condition that the buildings face North Limestone Street with some architectural detail that is identified there at the very end of the page. at the very back of the minutes the staff provided you with the rendering that was shown at the meeting and in the middle this is an elevation from north limestone for the building that had the four units and then the one end unit that was on the southern side of the property basically these four and that one our belief is that your action required basically the development to mirror that. On the bottom of what you see on the overhead is our interpretation as staff of what this proposal is with the minor amendment. In essence, this is really a one-issue plan. This bank of buildings has been shifted 90 degrees. like so. One additional building is added to it, but the amount of building that is oriented to North Limestone is now only 100 feet, where at the time the rezoning was approved, it was 120 plus 50, about 170 feet. So not quite half, but a significant change to what was originally approved. why was the architecture discussed so much with this plan one reason probably was the staff was not in favor of the rezoning however the more realistic reason is the third handout which is the central sector small area plan handout pages 71 and 96 some of the recommendations on that plan, especially on page 96, focus attention on connections between residential and business areas. This property, one of the main issues at the time of rezoning was the fact that it had almost as much neighboring property commercial as it did residential. It clearly was a transition between those two land uses. and also that they contain elements that encourage the commercial orientation to the streets, and that's evident on page 71 of the corridor plan. With this, the staff has two other recommendations about the development plan in addition to condition number two and condition number one, which I'll conclude with. The third recommendation we have is that the building elevation information that you see on the overhead be added to this new development plan. It did take quite a bit of research to pull this together. We think the time has come where this information needs to go on the plan should you decide to approve this plan this afternoon. The fourth condition, the staff is recommending that this bank of buildings return to its currently approved position as such. That would be in keeping with your approval and the information that was given to you in 2010. Finally, condition number one, should that happen, that access that they're proposing will need to shift southward, and we'd like the Traffic Engineering Department to review that and any other necessary internal changes that would result from that. Finally, on the other side of the handout that you have here that's marked staff exhibit, you'll see a section from Article 21 of the zoning ordinance. that says that the staff can refer minor plans to the Planning Commission should there be significant issues. Given the history that involved with this property about 18 months ago, we felt it important to refer this minor plan to rather than considering approval of it as a staff item. I appreciate very much your attention. At this time, I'd be glad to answer any questions from the Commission about our recommendation on this minor amendment. Questions for Mr. Salley? Yes, Mr. Cravens? You're saying turn the building 90 degrees on North Limestone? Yes, sir. We are recommending that the orientation return to that that's on the current development plan. Do they lose a unit doing that? They perhaps might lose a unit because this is an easement here. They have a setback along the front that's required by conditional zoning. They may, in fact, lose one of these five units by keeping the basin. It is possible. Other questions? Mr. Saleh, that threw me. I do not remember that part of it being discussed in subdivision as far as returning that bank back parallel to North Limestone. Is that new? That was the main reason we wanted to bring it to you at the subdivision committee, was in addition to the architectural information, was that this was such a change from what you reviewed in November of 2010, we wanted to refer this to the Planning Commission. Okay. Ms. Covenin. Mr. Salley, if they turn the buildings back around, do they have the same amount of square footage for sale in both plans? As Mr. Cravens asked whether they would lose one of these units, it's very likely that they would lose one of these 30 by 50 units if they would return this orientation. These are the same size. These are 30 by 50, and they only have four. And so the access aisle narrows, and the parking still meeting these at the same type of size. Yes, but one of the units got double-sized in the corner. Yes. So I'm not asking about units lost. I'm asking about square footage lost. Given this easement, without some odd building orientations, it's likely that they would lose one of those 30 by 50 units. Not counting the one they lost because of the overhead or the sewer easement. You're correct. The current plan shows this being abandoned and the building going over top of it. So really, if they turn the buildings around, it's not because of turning the buildings around. It's because of the overhead or the sewer easement through there. It's probably that and retaining the existing basin at this location. Okay. Any other questions for Mr. Salley? If not, thank you, Mr. Salley. Applicant, anything to add? Thank you, Mr. Chairman, members of the Commission. I'm Andy Holmes with Midwest Engineering, and I want to thank Bill for doing a thorough job of going through the changes to the plan. I will add a couple of things. First, in addition to drainage going through this corridor, There is a sewer line in existence that goes through this corridor, too, that we want to avoid disturbing. The original plan would have required eliminating that sewer line, rerouting around the buildings, and it would also have required a significant cut back here along the rears of these properties, about a 12-foot elevation drop there to make the drainage work the way it had been designed originally. The thing that drove the orientation change of the building the most was the owner's concern for public safety in this area. This plan creates a less visible, confined area in here, which he felt would have been conducive to activity that he's not trying to promote. he's not a developer that's going to build this and flip it he's a buy and hold individual he's going to own it he owns several of these houses already excuse me and so what he wanted was to create an environment that was a little bit safer for the public and he felt like the neighborhood would not have been as safe with this plan where you create places in here where criminals could hide basically and this plan opens that up. It reduces the likelihood and the opportunity for that to occur. I'd like to address the landscaping along North Limestone. We've shown that landscaping both in plan view and in cross-section, and the intent was that that landscaping would match exactly what was approved. So if it doesn't clearly express that, we'll make whatever changes we need to make. But the building orientation is a very important part of the proposed change. Thank you. So what I'm hearing from you, Mr. Combs, is that you'd like to leave the orientation as you're now proposing the drawing on the left and just do away with condition number four, which says revised building orientation 90 degrees? That's correct. Okay. Let me say one thing first. Thank you for whoever brought this, since we did ask for it. I appreciate the rendering. Would you all be in agreement with the rendering that Mr. Sally showed down at the bottom of the page? We don't prefer it, but we would accept it. Okay. Mr. Cravens. Yeah, I guess that's what I was going to ask. I mean, I can understand moving the buildings around and all that sort of thing, but this rendering, is this what you're proposing now? That rendering is based on our proposal now and the existing building designs that are developed for that property now. So you're doing more than just moving the buildings. You're redesigning them. That's correct. Okay. Ms. Copeland? I'm sorry, are you finished? Yes. Go ahead, Ms. Copeland. Is he Mrs. Copeland? No. Go ahead. Okay. The overhead doors, where are they? The overhead doors face the parking lot in all cases. Which is exactly what was not permitted in the 2010 version, right? In this version, the overhead doors all face the parking lot as well. Not on the street side. There's no parking lot there. Right. But in other words, when you were driving up the street, you pretty much didn't see overhead doors. This is going to be all overhead doors toward the street. There were some overhead doors. There are no overhead doors facing Broadway except for two, well, three of them that would be visible here. And they're set back from North Limestone a couple hundred feet. Well, in the former plan, on that front row, show me where the overhead doors were. They were back here and they were along here. Okay. So there were overhead doors visible from Limestone in the previous plan as well. They weren't as visible from limestone. Okay. I'm sorry, I cut Mr. Cravens off a moment ago. Mr. Cravens? I was just into this architecture a little bit, or lack of it. Please continue. So are you willing to go back and make the buildings look like these? Yes. with the split-face, not this metal stuff on the building? Right. We've already made a change to have only split-face block and stucco facing limestone, and these would also be split-face block fronts with the metal panels above, but we're willing to put the end features on there, too, like the rendering shows. But you're going to put metal that looks like metal to me, up on the top on the rest of it? We would like to. Oh, well. I guess, I mean, I asked this question before in the minutes, and we were pretty adamant at that time that this look, have a gateway look, and that these materials, they were continuous all around the building. and these renderings. Is that something you'd be willing to do? Yes. Are we talking about every side of every building, no metal panels? Why would you make one side look metal and one not? Well, if it's not exposed to view, then why restrict it? Well, your rendering actually is what made it look worse. You see it all the way around, standing across the street. We're rendering colloquial metal everywhere. We're willing to use split-faced block and stucco anywhere that it needs to go, if it makes sense. And whose opinion? Yours. Okay. Mr. Wilson. Mr. Chairman, first of all, let me say I agree with Mr. Cravens. I'm looking at these two different plans, and one has a quality look to it, and the other one does not. I like the quality look to it, and if you're saying that you're willing to do the quality look, that's fine. But am I hearing you say that that's what you would do? Yes, you are. Okay, thank you. Any other questions? Thank you, Mr. Combs. I'll close this part. Anyone else wish to speak? If not, I'll close this part of the hearing and open it up for discussion from the Commission members and or a motion. Ms. Copeland. Yes. I have several things because I was at the site and walked the site and was concerned that we were not following the intent of the central sector plan. And furthermore, the central sector plan that was just barely two years old is not involved in this re-redo. and I'm going to show you some pictures why I think we should postpone it. We have the option to postpone it so that the central sector neighborhood can meet with this person and work out an agreement that is suitable to all parties. Thank you. This central sector small area plan was done two years ago in 2009. It took a lot of work from a lot of different people, and I think you can see just driving down Limestone the significant change. I mean, they have really lifted themselves up by the bootstraps, and to lead them out of this gateway site is a mistake. Flip it over, please. There were Derek Paulson, Andrea James, many people in the neighborhood. All those people, if we could get those names up, they aren't here now, but at that time they were on the commission. And so I think in respect to all of their effort, we should back off and let this get some air and some publicity. Let's go to the next one. One of the things in the small area plan was down at the bottom there's a little circle. I wish we could blow that up. Okay. That's the intersection of New Circle Road and Limestone. and you can't see my marks, but up on the right there's an X in a green spot. That is a soccer field that is behind an apartment building. It's just a really sweet place, and on the left is a yellow mark, and that's in front of a strip service area where a number of small businesses are. But coming down through there, I've got red lines on it. It doesn't show up. But you can see there is a normal setback of residential houses down through there. There is a line. And down near the bottom there is, on the right, there's the Goodwill parking lot, the great big parking lot there that's right two doors, two lots up on the right from the circle at the bottom of the screen. Right across from Goodwill is the site we're talking about. Okay, now, the proposal that they did in 2010 was to keep that line of houses or that setback going down the street so that it wasn't just in your face that this was a somewhat commercial industrial site that they were proposing. Let's go to the next one. Now let's put the circle at the bottom of the screen so we're in the same orientation. Turn it. Yeah, that's right. Thank you. Now, the circle is at New Circle Road. My little scribbled circle is at New Circle Road and limestone. And this was the old, old design that's over there on the board. And I've got a red line going in so that it shows a 30-degree angle of vision, which is what you would see out of your windshield. If you were going down the street, you would look in and see maybe the first two buildings on the left. You would not see all of the inside, which is exactly his point. But that's exactly what the neighborhood wanted. They did not want to see all in there, all of that blacktop like the blacktop in front of Goodwill. They wanted to start their setback saying they were a neighborhood, not a commercial industrial site in blue sky. Let's go to the next one. This is the new one. and clear down in front of, now go up a little bit more so you can see, well, the yellow building that's kind of oblique down there in the bottom, that's the building next door, and you can see the retention base, and I kind of scribbled in a couple of blue lines there to show where the retention would be. This is the new plan, but I've got a red arrow on it, and you literally can see into that site all the way down from in front of CVS. That's not what the central sector people wanted, and I think we would be remiss to sit here and work on it without including them. I think what the staff recommended is a long way down the pike, but we're talking doors that are visible, overhead doors that are visible, a lot of blacktop, and a very industrial-looking place in what they call their neighborhood. That's all. Thank you, Ms. Copeland. A question for Bill Sally. This, you are calling this a minor plan. It is a minor amendment. It meets all of the requirements for a minor amendment and was filed for staff review and approval. Okay. All right, then. Thank you. Any other questions, concerns, thoughts from the commission? If not, Mr. Cravens? Yeah, I'd like to make a motion for approval, but I'm going to change number four, or just take number four out. I want to approve the plan like it is, like their proposed amendment, but with the change in the architecture to like the original architecture, with no in the round, in other words, all the way around it, none of this metal stuff on the top. So move. Okay. Motion's been made for approval of DP 2012-16 with three conditions, deleting number four, and just to clarify, number three. as far as building elevations to go along with the staff recommendations at the bottom of the page. Correct? Yes, and eliminating them. I mean, this rendering shows metal all the way around. Yeah. I just don't want it to be split. That one. This is the one you don't like. Correct. Originally, everything was approved with brick and stucco, and they were gracious enough to bring us in another rendering. However, it sounds like you're not going for it. So the motion's been made for approval with three recommendations. I would need a second. No second? Yes, sir. According to Ms. Copeland, her request, let me see if I can clarify, you'd like for this to go back before the committee, the small area? I would like, I would, we, it's, Mr. Sally, don't we have a month before we have to hear this? Can't we postpone it for a month? Yes, you can postpone this plan one month. Okay, if we postpone it, then the neighborhood has a chance to see what they want to do. If they want to come down here and talk, if they want to come down here, not come, or if they want to meet with the owner. But at least we are not jumping in front of the neighborhood, and we're giving a small area plan, and the people that have worked so hard in that neighborhood a chance to get in on this decision. it's not which decision we vote on, but let's include them. Let's not get in front of, I mean, have you driven down? It's been a while. Well, it's incredible the change that they have done on that street and in that neighborhood. The whole thing is changing. They may not want anything like this. On the other hand, they may say, gee whiz, please go ahead and do this, or we want this done. But we should involve that neighborhood. We should not, for this big a change, we should not get in front of the neighborhood. We've got time, and it's only going to cost a month, and let's bring them in. Why do a small area plan if you don't carry out the recommendations of the small area plan? We've got plenty of time. We've got a motion on the floor without a second. Ms. Phillips, I think, wants to weigh in. I'll allow her. I'm not going to second the motion. I'm just asking for your thoughts. I will if you guys want to vote on it. But I just wonder, we haven't even asked Mr. Holmes. I suppose he would have volunteered. but did you go to the North Limestone Neighborhood Association and try to coordinate with them? Have they been brought into the planning process? No. No. Okay. Okay, at this point I'm going to say the motion dies for like a second. I'll entertain a second motion. Mr. Chairman, I move for postponement for one month so that the parties can have a chance to get together or come down here and talk to us about it. Okay. Motion's been made and seconded. Hold on one second. I think as far as legal is concerned, they'd probably like to say continued, or does it matter? It'll be a continuance. Okay. Motion's been made and seconded for continuance of this for one month. More discussion? You've got another statement? Okay. I was just going to ask a question. In consideration of the timeline that Mr. Holmes has, I wondered if Mr. Holmes would be comfortable with fulfilling our request within a two-week window, and if so, if the motion could be amended instead of a full month's postponement, maybe do it for two weeks. That's fine, just as long as we get the neighborhood involved. Okay. So, Ms. Copeland, you're agreeable to amendment for two weeks? Very much so. Mr. Penn? Yes. Okay. So the motion's been amended for a two-week continuance of this discussion. How do we guarantee that other people get involved? We can give them time, but we can't lead them to the trial. No, but we will have given them a chance. Okay. Mr. Cravens? Yeah, I don't see a need to postpone this. They can go on and build it, probably have the permits, I mean, the way it is right now, if they want to build the other plan. And I think maybe that's what they were doing. They started construction or they were getting ready to, and they found they needed to make some changes in the topo and, you know, where it worked better, where it fit the site better. and they agreed to keep the architecture the way the original plan was. And I don't know that anybody from central sector was even down here when we did it the first time. There's no, huh? Well, but they're not changing it that much. And they agreed to the architecture the way it is, to keep it the way it is. So I don't see any reason to hold this up. And we'll say one thing and then we'll call for a vote. The people I remember that were here were speaking more in regards to zone change than the development plan, I believe. You know, I'm fine either way, given the chance for them to weigh in. So at this point, I will call the question and call for the vote for a continuance of two weeks on this plan. So all those in favor, or all those that wish to vote, I'll put it that way, please vote when it comes up on the screen. Motion for continuance passes. Thank you, folks. We have, if I'm correct, we have one commission item, proposed bylaw amendment change in regards to proposed time limits. Time limits for subdivision would mirror what we're currently doing for zoning. And I'll ask for any discussion at this time. If there's no discussion, I'll entertain a motion. I move for approval of the proposed bylaw amendment for review. Do we need any other further discussion of that? I move for approval. Second. Motion's been made and seconded for approval of the proposed bylaw and changes that's in front of you, highlighted in yellow. If there's no further discussion, please vote. Any other commission items? Any other staff items? If not, Mr. King? I'll only remind you of your work session next Thursday. Thank you. We do have a work session next Thursday at 1.30. If nothing else, I'll entertain a motion for adjournment. Motion's been made and seconded. All in favor? Thank you.