# Urban County Council Work Session - September 11, 2012 > Auto-transcribed civic record · September 11, 2012 - **Permalink**: https://meetings.lexingtonky.news/meeting/2686 - **Source video**: https://lfucg.granicus.com/player/clip/2686?view_id=14&redirect=true - **Date**: 2012-09-11 - **Last revised**: July 17, 2026 - **Length**: 21,500 words > ⚠️ **Auto-generated content.** Audio from the official Granicus video was auto-transcribed with OpenAI's open-source Whisper large-v3-turbo model, run locally by The Lexington Times. Structured facts were extracted with GPT-4o; the narrative summary was written by Anthropic Claude. Verbatim wording may contain errors. See [methodology](https://meetings.lexingtonky.news/about/methodology) or [report a correction](mailto:editor@lexingtonky.news). --- ## Meeting Overview The Urban County Council met on September 11, 2012, at 3:00 p.m. in the Council Chambers on the 2nd Floor of the Government Center, with Mayor Jim Gray presiding. During the meeting, the Council took 16 votes and heard 8 public comments from residents on both agenda and non-agenda items. The Council addressed 9 agenda items, including requested rezonings and docket approvals, budget amendments, new business, continuing business and presentations, and council and mayor reports. All substantive agenda items were approved, including the requested rezonings and docket approvals, summary approval, budget amendments, new business, continuing business and presentations, council reports, and the mayor's report. ## Attendance **Present:** - Mayor Jim Gray - Council Member Henson - Council Member Blues - Council Member Gorton - Council Member Farmer - Council Member Ellinger - Council Member Stinnett - Council Member Lawless - Council Member Myers - Council Member Kay - Council Member Ford - Council Member McCord - Council Member Lane **Absent:** - Council Member Crosbie - Council Member Martin ## Votes and Decisions The meeting included 16 votes, with the majority passing unanimously. **Zoning and Land Use Matters** A motion to place an ordinance changing the zone from Wholesale and Warehouse Business (B-4) to Mixed-Use Community (MU-3) for property at 1200 Red Mile Rd. and 439, 441, 445, 451, 455, 459, 461, 463, 471 Nelms Ave on the docket for the August 30, 2012 Council meeting without a public hearing passed unanimously. Motion by Henson, seconded by Blues [00:05:18]. A motion to hold a public hearing for an ordinance changing the zone from Single Family Residential (R-1D) to Townhouse Residential (R-1T) for property at 99-119 Burley Ave on October 9, 2012 at 6:00pm passed by roll call vote, 8-4. Voting in favor: Henson, Blues, Gorton, Farmer, Ellinger, Stinnett, Myers, and Kay. Voting against: Lane, Ford, McChord, and Martin. Motion by Lawless, seconded by Gorton [00:05:18]. A motion to place amending Article 1 and Article 8 of the Zoning Ordinance to define adult day care centers and regulate such facilities as a conditional use in the P-1, B-1, B-2, B-2A and P-2 zones into the Planning and Public Works Committee passed by roll call vote, 12-1. Voting in favor: Henson, Blues, Gorton, Farmer, Ellinger, Stinnett, Lawless, Myers, Kay, Ford, McChord, and Martin. Voting against: Lane. Motion by Stinnett, seconded by Henson [00:05:18]. A motion to set the date for a special meeting to hold a public hearing for the Anderson Campus Rentals property on October 9, 2012 at 6:00pm passed unanimously. Motion by Farmer, seconded by Gorton [00:05:18]. **Administrative and Financial Matters** A motion to approve the docket passed unanimously. Motion by Farmer, seconded by Kay [00:05:18]. A motion to approve the summary passed unanimously. Motion by Beard, seconded by Farmer [00:06:27]. A motion to approve budget amendments passed unanimously. Motion by Farmer, seconded by Myers [00:09:49]. A motion to compel the Department of Finance to provide the Completed Annual Comprehensive Financial Review (CAFR) at the November 27, 2012 Budget and Finance Committee meeting passed by roll call vote, 9-1. Voting in favor: Henson, Blues, Gorton, Farmer, Ellinger, Stinnett, Lawless, Myers, and Kay. Voting against: Ford. Motion by Farmer, seconded by Stinnett [00:11:09]. **Other Matters** Motions to approve new business items, the NDF list, add the Social Services Committee summary to the continuing business/presentations agenda, add the Fireworks Ordinance to the August 30, 2012 docket, bluesheet the Partner Agency Funding Process for FY2014, approve the Mayor's Report, and adjourn all passed unanimously [00:10:21 through 00:24:12]. A motion to place on the docket for the September 13, 2012 Council meeting a resolution requesting amendment of KRS 512.080 to authorize civil fines for unlawfully positioning advertisements on public property passed unanimously. Motion by Myers, seconded by Stinnett [00:03:23]. ## Budget and Financial Actions The meeting authorized the following financial actions and contractual agreements: **Construction and Infrastructure Projects** - Change Order No. 1 with Judy Construction Company (L876-12) for $9,431 to address additional work on the West Hickman WWTP Improvement Clarifier #8 Modifications/Repairs Project - Change Order No. 1 with LAGCO (L877-12) for $4,751.50 for the Anniston/Wickland Capital Storm Sewer Project Phase 2 - Amendment to Resolution No. 91-2012 (L889-12) to increase funding by $5,000 for acquisition of fee simple right of way and temporary construction easements for Meadows/Northland/Arlington Public Improvements Section 5A - Partial Release of Easement (L915-12) releasing a portion of a sanitary sewer easement on property at 249 Towne Square Park **Grants and Federal Funding** - Acceptance of additional federal funding from the Kentucky Energy and Environment Cabinet (L924-12) in the amount of $300,000 for the Wolf Run Creek Watershed Based Plan **Service Agreements and Amendments** - Mutual Aid Agreement with Rural/Metro Ambulance (L880-12) with no budgetary impact - Amendment to Agreement with Kentucky Theater Management Group, Inc. (L902-12) for operation and management of the Kentucky and State Theaters, with no budgetary impact - Three amendments to agreements with Kentucky Transportation Cabinet for the Share the Road Media Campaign Project (L890-12), Gainesway Trail Project (L891-12), and Fiber Optic Cable 2009 Project (L892-12), all with no budgetary impact - Amendment to Agreement with Disponette Service Co. Inc. (L927-12) for improvements to Charles Young Center, requiring no additional funds **Public Safety and Personnel** - Agreement with the Institute of Police Technology and Management (L909-12) for $11,500 for a Burglary Investigations course - Memoranda of Understanding with Kentucky State Police, Kentucky Internet Crimes Against Children Task Force (L910-12) and Internal Revenue Service, Criminal Investigation (L911-12), both with no budgetary impact - Creation of one Program Supervisor P/T position (Grade 106N) in the Department of Social Services (L903-12) with funds included in the FY 2013 adopted budget **Tax Collection** - Agreement with Fayette County Sheriff (L928-12) for collection of 2012 ad valorem urban services property taxes, not to exceed $350,000 ## Public Comment The meeting opened with remarks from Mayor Jim Gray, who observed a moment of silence and recognition for the 11th anniversary of 9/11, honoring those lost and reflecting on national unity and resilience [timestamp: 00:03:00]. The Mayor also paid tribute to Louis Stout, a respected community leader and former Board of Adjustments chair, recognizing his contributions to sports, civic life, and public service [timestamp: 00:03:00]. Council Member Ford extended condolences to Louis Stout's family, praising his lifelong dedication to youth development through athletics and community service [timestamp: 00:22:37]. Several council members raised concerns about paving and infrastructure budgets. Council Member Farmer expressed concern over the reduced paving budget for the 5th District, noting a significant drop from the previous year and the difficulty of addressing road needs with limited funds [timestamp: 00:13:20]. Council Member Lawless echoed similar concerns about the 3rd District's low paving allocation, citing high street failure rates and the challenges of addressing infrastructure issues with minimal funding [timestamp: 00:18:20]. Council Member Stinnett called for a comprehensive plan to address the city's long-term street repaving needs, noting that $27 million in unmet demand remains despite past efforts [timestamp: 00:20:34]. On healthcare matters, Council Member McCord emphasized the importance of managing healthcare costs and praised the administration for implementing cost-saving measures and improving plan benefits [timestamp: 00:14:01]. Council Member Stinnett highlighted the complexity of the health plan transition and stressed the need for comprehensive employee education to ensure understanding and successful enrollment [timestamp: 00:14:31]. ## Appointments Richard Moloney was appointed to the position of Chief Administrative Officer. ## Contested Items Three major areas of contention emerged during the meeting: **Long-term Management of EPA Consent Decree Projects** Council Member Lane raised significant concerns about the city's ability to manage a $500 million EPA Consent Decree project over the long term. Lane questioned the council's expertise in overseeing a project of this magnitude and called for stronger oversight mechanisms. The discussion centered on cost control and continuity, with Lane advocating for potential project management oversight to ensure accountability and prevent cost overruns throughout the project's duration. **Right-of-Way Acquisition Process** Council Members Lawless and Kaye engaged in heated discussion regarding delays in the right-of-way acquisition process. Both members expressed frustration with the pace of negotiations and urged the administration to streamline its approach. They specifically recommended that the city consider using condemnation procedures when necessary to expedite acquisitions and prevent further project delays. The council members emphasized that delays in securing rights-of-way could jeopardize the overall project timeline. **Health Plan Renewal and Employee Education** Council Members Stinnett and Myers raised concerns about the adequacy of employee education regarding the new health plan renewal. Both emphasized that the plan's complexity required comprehensive communication to employees before open enrollment began. They expressed worry that insufficient education could lead to confusion among city employees during the enrollment period and advocated for more robust educational efforts to ensure employees understood their options and coverage details. ## Public Comment – Issues on Agenda [timestamp: 00:05:18] No public comment was received for issues on the agenda. The meeting proceeded to the next item without discussion. ## Requested Rezonings/Docket Approval [timestamp: 00:05:18] The Council addressed multiple rezoning requests and approved the docket during this agenda item. **Actions Taken:** The Council approved a rezoning request for 1200 Red Mile Road, changing the property classification from B-4 to MU-3. Additionally, a public hearing was scheduled for a rezoning request affecting the properties at 99-119 Burley Avenue. The docket was approved by the Council. **Key Participants:** The discussion involved Council members Henson, Lawless, Farmer, and Stinnett. **Outcome:** All rezoning requests and docket approval were approved. ## Approval of Summary The Council considered the approval of the summary from the previous meeting. [timestamp: 00:06:27] Key speakers on this item included Beard and Farmer. The summary was presented for approval without discussion or objections being raised by Council members. **Outcome:** The Council approved the summary. ## Budget Amendments The Council considered a series of budget amendments during this agenda item [timestamp: 00:09:49]. Key speakers on this matter included Farmer and Myers. The amendments encompassed reallocations across multiple budget categories, including grants, asset forfeiture funds, and operational expenses. The Council approved all proposed amendments without opposition. ## New Business The Council addressed the New Business agenda item [timestamp: 00:10:21], which provided an opportunity to discuss various administrative and operational matters. **Speakers and Participation** The discussion involved Council members Ellinger, Beard, and Farmer. **Outcome** The Council approved the new business agenda without debate, allowing for the discussion of various administrative and operational items to proceed. ## Continuing Business/Presentations During this agenda item, the Council reviewed several updates and presentations [timestamp: 00:11:09]. **Topics Covered** The Council addressed updates on the following matters: - Neighborhood Development Funds - General Government Committee - Budget & Finance Committee - Sanitary sewer operations - Health plan renewal **Key Speakers** Lane, Martin, and Marrs presented information and participated in the discussion of these continuing business items. **Outcome** The items presented were approved by the Council. ## Council Reports [timestamp: 00:03:23] Council Members Myers, Gorton, Kaye, McCord, Farmer, and Ford presented reports on various initiatives during this agenda item. A resolution to amend KRS 512.080 was presented for consideration. The proposed amendment would allow for the imposition of civil fines for unauthorized signage. Following discussion and presentation by the council members, this resolution was approved. ## Mayor's Report The Mayor's Report was presented during the meeting [timestamp: 00:11:09]. Key speakers on this agenda item included Gorton and Myers. The report was presented to the council and approved without discussion. This approval confirmed the administration's ongoing activities and priorities without requiring further deliberation or debate from the council members present. ## Public Comment – Issues Not on Agenda [timestamp: 00:24:12] No public comment was received for issues not on the agenda. The meeting proceeded directly to adjournment. --- ## Decisions - **Motion** — passed (0-0): approve docket - **Motion** — passed (0-0): approve summary - **Motion** — passed (0-0): approve budget amendments - **Motion** — passed (0-0): approve new business - **Motion** — passed (0-0): approve the NDF list - **Motion** — passed (0-0): suspend the rules to allow CM Lane to speak again - **Motion** — passed (0-0): place on the September 13, 2012 Council Meeting docket a resolution requesting that the Legislature amend KRS 512.080 to expressly authorize urban county governments and other local governments to issue civil fines for unlawfully posting advertisements, posters, notices or other matters to public property and notifying appropriate elected officials of this resolution - **Motion** — passed (0-0): approve Mayor's report - **Motion** — passed (0-0): Adjourn --- ## Full transcript Music Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. to the work session of the Council. And first, one announcement. And many know in the community this, that over the weekend, that a remarkable leader and teacher and citizen, Louis Stout, passed away. Many know that Lewis was active in so many ways, living an extraordinary, notable sporting life in Kentucky as an athlete, as a coach, himself as an official and an administrator in every way. The Herald-Leader did a wonderful story on his life yesterday. Many of us in government know that he led a life as a contributing citizen as well. And up until he became ill a few weeks ago, he was active as the chair of our Board of Adjustments. And we all know that he will be enormously missed. The vice mayor mentioned that it's rare that we mark a remarkable event in our country's history on the day of a council meeting. And that occurs today with 9-11. But the numbers 9-11, of course, have been etched in our memory, in our collective souls, and in our country's history. And at the suggestion of several council members, we would like to have a standing moment of prayer and recognition of all those who gave their lives on that day. Thank you. Thank you all. I think as we proceed into our agenda, it does allow us to reflect on a time like today as we reflect on this history. Even in times of adversity, what a remarkable country we have the opportunity to participate in because of many who have given their lives for us to have this opportunity. All right, first on our agenda is a public comment for issues on the agenda. Mr. Mundy signals that no one has signed up for issues on the agenda, so we can move on to rezonings or docket approval. Is there a motion for the docket? Motion approved. Second. Motion by Council Member Ellinger, seconded by Vice Mayor Gordon. Is there any discussion on the motion? All right. Hearing none, then we can take a vote. All in favor of the motion, please indicate by saying aye. Aye. Opposed, no. Motion carries. Next on our agenda is approval of the summary. Is there a motion to approve the summary? There was a motion by a running motion there, quite a competition. I'll call it for Council Member Blues, a motion by Council Member Blues, second by Council Member Myers to approve the summary. Is there any discussion on the motion? Okay. Then we can take a vote. All in favor, please say aye. Aye. Opposed, no. Motion carries. And next on our agenda is budget amendments. Is there a motion? Move approval. Motion by Vice Mayor Gorton, second by Council Member Farmer. Is there any discussion on the motion? Yes, sir. Council Member Farmer. I'm just going to ask about just the journal entries on page 10. The first one, two, three, four, five, six of them have to do with the Department of Justice. I just want to get a feel for just the range of things that's going on in this group. Irene, good afternoon. All right. Irene, thank you, ma'am. You're referring to the SCAT program? Yes. In the first four, it says to eliminate negative balances. I just wanted an explanation about that, just so I would understand. Our projects aren't actually closed, even if we spent all the money, and some of them are sitting there with negative balances on them. So what this does is make everything even. Can we do that with pensions? I don't know about pensions, but we do it with grant budgets, because even if it could be a grant budget that's four years old, but it's still technically open, it's sitting there, all the funds are spent, but you don't necessarily have all the funds spent exactly in the accounts that they were budgeted. So this makes everything zero out. Cleans it up, moves it along. Yes, it's a cleanup. It's what we call cleaning it up. It doesn't derive anything to fund balance, I note. No. It's just like a ledger transaction then? It's just a budget amendment to clean up the grand budgets. It makes them look better. And it also, what happens is if they're off, sometimes you're doing budget amendments in current grants, and you get that red box of death when you try to do it. And so you have to go back and you have to do them all, clean them all up, so that you can do the one that you want to do. Okay. I appreciate your explanation. Thank you very much. Thank you, Mayor. Yes, sir. All right. No one else has signed up to speak, so we can take a vote. All in favor of the motion, please indicate by saying aye. Aye. Opposed, no. Motion carries. All right. Next on our agenda is new business. Is there a motion? Motion. Motion by Council Member Beard, second by Council Member Farmer. All right. Is there any discussion? Is there any discussion on new business? All right. Hearing none, then we can take a vote. All in favor of the motion, please indicate by saying aye. Aye. Opposed, no. Motion carries. Next on our agenda, continuing business and presentations. First we have NDS. Is there a motion? Motion approved. Motion by Councilman Ellinger. Second by Councilman Crosby. Is there any discussion? Okay. All in favor, please say aye. Aye. Opposed, no. Motion carries. Before we go to the general government report by Council Member Lane, I do want to recognize our esteemed former Vice Mayor Isabel Yates, who is here in the audience today. She was here just in case there had been any questions or any comments regarding item H. Isabel, we know how much you enjoy staying for a council meeting, though, so you're just welcome to stay for the whole thing. Thank you. Management, Jamshed Barbar Dharan. He said that the fiscal year 2012 fleet budget was $7.3 million, of which $5.8 million was for fuel. There are 1,520 vehicles in the fleet, with police having $693. The fleet was reduced by 55 since 2009. Jamshed said that the downtown down fleet of approximately 80 vehicles is the current focus for fleet reduction. This is due to the renovation of the annex garage, which will displace parking for those vehicles. We asked John Shee to come back to the General Government Committee with a proposed policy for managing and maintaining the fleet in the future. The next item on the agenda was the website linking policy, and the purpose of the discussion was to review the website linking policy that is being proposed by the chief administrative officer of the government. Scott Shapiro of the mayor's office presented the policy and we discussed that in detail and asked Mr. Shapiro to bring that back for further review by the committee, which coincidentally that meeting was this morning and we reviewed that again. The third item was an update by Director of Revenue Bill Amara regarding fee and tax delinquent contractors, and his report was that the process for selecting contractors and the review process by purchasing and subsequent licensing works very well, and he thinks that the process needs no changes. That concludes the report. There were no actions or recommendations to the Council. Thank you. Thank you, Council Member Lane. Next on our agenda is the Budget and Finance Committee Summary. And I believe, Council Member Lane, you're going to provide this report to us as well. Council Member Ellinger was absent that day because of illness. Rare, rare, rare. As a matter of fact, I don't believe that Councilmember Ellinger has ever missed a meeting before. It ever happened. He has a perfect attendance record on this. He does. So that being said, it was a privilege for me to stand in as vice chair in his stead. This may be the only times I'll get a chance to do it. All right. The financial report, this was on August 28th, and Commissioner Driscoll and Directors O'Mara and Barrow presented the monthly financial report. And there are a couple of bits of good news there. First off, the unemployment rate in Fayette County was 6.5%, and that was up higher than April and May, but that is one of the lowest ones in the state and in the country. The state's unemployment rate was 8.3% in June, and that is the same as the U.S. unemployment rate. And that's unusual because normally the state runs about a percentage point above the national average. So that was also some relatively good news. In July, the report was for July, it was the first month of the city's fiscal year, and general fund revenues were running ahead of budget, which I'm sure everybody's happy about that too. Overall, general fund revenue was approximately $1.9 million ahead of the budgeted amount, and the economic indicators were slightly improved. Mr. Barrow said that expenses were running about $500,000 over budget, but that was due to timing issues, and that may have been a factor also in the revenue for the first month of the year. The next item on the agenda was the discussion of the fiscal year 12 audit timetable, and Commissioner Driscoll indicated that the auditors have completed the preliminary testing of the financial information and the on-site work will be completed on October 15th, and the completion of the comprehensive annual financial report is due on November 28th. Vice Mayor Gordon noted that November 28th is after the final Budget and Finance Committee meeting of the year. where Council Member Farmer also said he was disappointed that the audit would not be completed in the time prescribed by the Charter. So in the ongoing discussion with Commissioner Driscoll, she said that she would try to accelerate the report getting out, but if it was not able to be reported out before the Council goes on break, that she would provide a preliminary financial statement that would be subject to the final CAFR report. The commissioner also noted that Lexmark had laid off 500 people, and the estimate is that would reduce the urban county government's revenues by about $1,800,000 in employee withholding and about $200,000 in net profits. And then Benji Mars with Benefit Insurance Marketing reported on the employee medical insurance financials. Mr. Morris stated that the city's health care costs increased from $31.3 million in 2009 to $36.8 million in 2011. Now, these are calendar years. With the implementation of the cost of services model in January 12, the estimated annual cost for calendar year 2012 is estimated to be $24.6 million. That is going to be about a $12 million reduction in our health care costs for this calendar year. And then in the meeting, Council Member Myers requested how long the benefit insurance marketing would manage the plan until it can be handled by our city's urban resources. And the CAO Maloney said the contract is for three years. And then Mr. Myers further asked about the development of incentive programs for better health. And the meeting adjourned at 2.25 p.m. That concludes that report, Mayor. Thank you, Council Member Lane. All right. Next on our agenda is a presentation that was requested by Council Member Lane, and it is going to be presented by Charlie Martin, who's the director of our Water and Air Quality Division. Charlie? Thank you, Mayor. Cheers. Folks with our consultant team is going to hand out something that I'm just going to reference. And so what we're going to talk about today is the annual sanitary sewer capacity management, operation, and maintenance service contract. I'll use this acronym over and over again CMOM so it'll be sprinkled in here but it's it's really about what we do as far as on our day-to-day activities and as the mayor alluded to that this is this was a request from Councilmember Lane but in particular there's a new business item that was introduced in the August 21st work session and the division of water quality is requesting approval a contract extension for professional services to continue the CMOM program implementation with Hazen and Sawyer and integrated engineering this is really an expanded presentation from what we gave or I gave to the Environmental Quality Committee in May of this year the agenda generally is what is CMO we're going to talk about what some of the goals are the overview the history what we've accomplished to date what we're asking for or what we intend to do in the future what our recommendations and allow for whatever questions that the council may have there we go what is cmon again it stands for capacity management operations and maintenance and it's really about improving water quality improving our operations from management operation and maintenance of the infrastructure it's different than the capital improvement program that we've talked about over and over again the 500 550 million dollar program Although the consulting engineers, that company is still involved. It's actually different people, and it's more focused on what we do every day, such as like what we did yesterday at Euclid and Rose Street. The main goal, obviously, is to protect the public health by eliminating overflows from the sanitary sewer system that occur on days like today because of grease or tree roots or what have you, but also minimizing or controlling the wet weather situation where we don't expose the public to a public health issue. As I said back in May, this is a major requirement of the consent decree, but it's not as major from the standpoint of the financial implications. The capital program is still the 800-pound gorilla in the room. For us on the operations end, though, there's a lot of pieces for us to pick up, and we're going to talk about that here in a few minutes. Here's the program management structure. Many of you, if not all of you, have seen this before. And the one we're talking about over here today is CMOM. You notice that the LFUCG thing is team, because there are so many different components of this. There is a team component of it that is the LFUCG thing. Not one, two, three, or four people own it. There's a lot of people that own a lot of components of it. And Hazen & Sawyer is the prime consultant that is helping us with the implementation phase. phases associated with CMOM. The goals, the first two are obvious. I mean, that's really what we're all about is regulatory compliance and environmental protection. The last four, though, are equally important because they're obviously what the customer is going to see in the end game is improved customer service, improved efficiency about how we do things, improved accountability for why we did it and how we're expending their fees, their taxes, and increased reliability to where it's working the way it's supposed to instead of us fixing it in a reactive mode. The consent decree has multiple CMOM components, and here is the basic five of them. These are plans that we developed from 2007 to 2009. We submitted them to EPA when the consent decree was not yet official. The bottom line is that you notice the first four, those were approved within the last month, and so those are go live for us, is that we now are subject to stipulated penalties for any of the milestones that are associated with each one of those approved plans. Number five is one that we've been working on a lot here over the last month because we have 30 days to respond to their, essentially, comments not approving the pump station operation plan for power outages. That one's a mouthful. But there's a lot of different components of this. 150 implementation elements associated with each one of these plans, and that's what I handed out to you or that they handed out to you on the 11 by 17. I didn't give you the scroll, but this is the kind of stuff that we're having to deal with. This is a schedule of implementation steps, over 150 of them that we have to do over the next roughly three years. Again, it has a fairly low financial impact relative to the remedial measures plan or the capital plan, but it has a defined schedule that still has stipulated penalties that if we miss deadlines, we're subject to fines from EPA from anywhere from $500 a day to thousands of dollars a day. And we also had to continue to provide progress reports in the consent decree required quarterly and annual reports. The history, as I said before, is that we began implementation of these things a while back, but we really got in earnest in the FY budget. We had allocated $287,500 in FY12 to begin work on this. In December 2011, the Council authorized us to hire Hazen and Sawyer in integrated engineering as the program manager for CMOM implementation. As we've done with many of the other consent decree contracts, where we're entering into a work activity that doesn't always have a predictable or certain outcome, because it's all based on EPA's approval of a proposal, is that we do it through task orders. and that the first task order was issued for slightly less than what the budget was. It took us a while to actually get that task order in place because we spent a lot of time with Hazen and Sawyer and integrated trying to make sure that they were clear about what it is that we expected them to do. When we put that contract out on the street, there were three proposers, and Hazen was the recommended selection. We put that out with a one-year contract asking for two renewals, which the first renewal is what we're basically asking for today, recognizing that for the government there was going to be a lot of effort orienting whoever we selected about what it is that we do. Not a lot of people, including probably many of the people in this room, realize what goes on in the day-to-day operations and sewer line maintenance and pump stations. So there's a steep learning curve, and we wanted to make sure that we took advantage of the learning curve when it came to implementation. So what is the program consultant supposed to do? Well, they're supposed to track the CMOM implementation schedule. The thing I just unfurled is that their job every day is to make sure that Charlie Martin and the rest of the team knows that you've got so many days to be able to get this thing done, or otherwise you're exposing the government to stipulated penalties. We spend a lot of time developing compliance metrics. On the first page of that handout that was given to you, I'll direct your attention to the bottom of the sheet. It's ID number 24 that's identified as SO21, Expand Educational Activities. What does that mean? It means a lot of different things to a lot of people. lot of people. So in the early phases of the program management, we've spent a lot of time defining what is it we're going to accomplish that says we have expanded educational activities. Because we need to know what compliance looks like when we get there, and we need to make sure that whoever owns that is making sure that they're doing it time and time and time again, is that we're ringing the bell over and over again. So that's a lot of what we've spent the last six months on. Identifying cost measures, obviously an important thing for us to do right now. I mentioned that pump station operations plan earlier, something we've spent the last several weeks on. EPA, I think, generally expects us to buy a backup generator or backup pump for every pump station we own. That's 82 pump stations. And that would be a huge, huge capital expenditure on the part of urban county government. They, along with the team, have developed a concept to where we are going to buy a significantly less number of those based on an ad-needed basis, based on the historical trends. The ice storm of 2003 is our worst-case scenario, and not all 82 pump stations fail at that time. So through the course of that, long story short is that they've taken what potentially could be a $3 million to $5 million obligation and reduce that down to a $1 million proposal to EPA, subject to their approval, where we would have the right number of generators and the right number of pumps and that they would be applicable to multiple pump stations rather than having one dedicated to each one of them. So there's a lot of work that we're doing in the cost-saving ones, but I wanted to mention that one in particular because it's been a very recent effort. The other four, I won't necessarily read them to you, but except for that bottom one, is that if we're going to develop processes and protocols about how we're going to do business and be efficient about how we're doing that, we need to make sure that we communicate that all the way down to the lowest levels or the lowest tiers of the division. If we don't know what we're supposed to do, we're not going to be efficient in doing it. Where we are right now, again, we've done the compliance metrics for the 150 implementation elements. We've developed the tracking schedule database. we've completed 14 of these deliverables already with the go live date for four of the plans only being a month ago so we've been working in advance on these things for a while we've initiated on another 21 of them some of them take a long time to kind of develop they don't just develop over the course of a couple of weeks the most important part of it is the work that we have done today we're 14 percent under what the budgeted amount was for FY 12 so we feel like that we're on schedule ahead of schedule and under budget we're where we need to be right now the the fy13 approved budget has five hundred thousand dollars for continued implementation of cmom initiatives we got a hundred and six thirty six more program elements to do over the next four years and there you see what how the schedule is going to be is how those things play out a lot of work to do over over the near term. And aside from whether or not we're meeting the deadlines for EPA is that a lot of these things are important for us as a government, as a utility, as the government owned utility doing things right and making sure that we're doing them in a proactive, cost effective way whether we're required to do it by EPA or not. So our recommendation is that we utilize the FY13 budget as approved for $500,000 and that we renew this annual annual contract with hazin and sawyer and integrated engineering using the task order format that we have in the past is that we make sure that we we have a defined amount of dollars devoted in a task order and defined deliverables and we hold them firm to those deliverables before we issue new task orders questions council member council member lane i guess i'm the lead off guy You know, my concern is not so much with the price or the scope of the work or the qualifications of the engineers working on the project. The concern that I have has to do with the process and how we're managing this over the long term. and, you know, for example, there have been three mayors that have been involved in the EPA consent, and I guess there have been four different councils of two years each involved in that. And so the continuity and the ongoing management of the project is a concern. We're looking at a $540 million investment. That is equivalent to about two and a half YUM centers over in Louisville. And if we lose control of our cost on this, a 10% overage would be $54 million. That's a significant amount of money. And, of course, if we save 2%, that's $10 million. That's also a significant amount of money also. So this is the concern that I have is that, first off, we're asking the council to approve this contract. There's not anybody on this council that can say whether this is a good deal or a bad deal, average deal or whatever, because we are not knowledgeable about all the details. To bring forward the approvals of each construction job that we do and have us approve it, we're not knowledgeable about whether that's a good deal or not either because we're not full-time employees. We're not working and concentrating on this. So this is the issue that I have. The issue is the process, the 10-year project we have that's going to cost a half a billion dollars, and our taxpayers and ratepayers and our citizens are going to have to pay for this. And if we let this slip out of control, and this has happened in other cities where I think one city went bankrupt because of that. Another one has had to reorganize the way they're managing their construction under the EPA consent agreements. I'm just concerned that this should be the highest level of due diligence of our council is to make sure that our process is protecting our taxpayers and ratepayers and make sure we're getting a fair return on our investment. That's the issue that I have, and that's one that I'm concerned about. And, you know, it's not like I just brought this up today. I've discussed this for the last two years, pretty much, I've been talking about this. And that is my concern. And if we don't do something about it today or tomorrow and we wait and wait and wait, we'll be so far down the road that we won't be able to make an adjustment and, you know, take care of the issue. So that's my question. And do you, I mean, you're running the show pretty much. Do you feel that you have adequate control over everything, that you can assure the taxpayers and ratepayers that we're not going to run our costs up and run out of control? And the other factor, too, I mean, you may not be here 10 more years, and you're sort of the backbone of the operation. And I'm not saying because you're not doing a good job, but because you might decide to retire or something. But you see where I'm getting with this. I'm one lottery ticket away from being an issue. I realize that, and I think the administration realizes that as well, and that we're trying to build the team to where there is redundancy in the team. One of the things that I've been tasked to work on is develop an RFQ for a construction management firm, and where there would be, and I think this was included in the budget as well, that there's an administrative representative to oversee the construction aspect of things, which, as I said before, is the 800-pound gorilla in the room. I think that what that will allow me to do is to focus more on these operational things because I'll be honest with you, Council Member Lane, it's pretty hard to bring anybody in to your day-to-day operations. I'm sure in your business as well is that you know it as well as anybody because you live and breathe it every day. And so that's why when we put our team together with Hazen and Sawyer that I made sure that on my staff that there is a team of people involved in order to be able to not only build the redundancy, but I'm not the one who's going to execute part of this stuff. It's going to be the front-line people that are going to have to execute it day in and day out. But on the construction end of it, I share your concerns as well, And we've been working with the administration to fill that gap and give everybody a higher comfort level that this thing is being managed effectively and efficiently. Because you're right, you're talking about a whole bunch of money. All right. I have some more questions. Would you prefer for me to wait until other people have asked us to come back around? We'll do that. Okay. Thank you. Council Member Stenet. Thank you, Mayor. Charlie, thank you. We've heard this environmental quality meeting, and it's good for the whole council to be caught up to speed on this issue. As Councilman Lane said, it's a big-ticket item. It's one of the most serious issues we're facing here in our community, and it's something we don't want to lay by the wayside and not do right the first time, because if we had done this 20 years ago, obviously we wouldn't be in the boat we're in today. And I respect Councilman Lane's issue with making sure we're doing it right. I guess I'm not sure, Councilman, are you asking for a project manager to manage the project manager, or are you asking, I'm not sure what you're asking for, because we've hired an outside consultant. I feel like Charlie's spearheading everything he can internally, because as he said, he knows what's going on, and to train the people, my biggest question, and you can respond in a second, Ed, is, Charlie, do you have the staff to execute this agreement, or are we looking at being able to help you and give you more staff? Because right now, you've got a docket that's pages of 155 on down to 179 of programs that we're going to have to create. Do we have the staff to do this? On some days, it seems like we do, and on some days, it seems like I'm slipping away. I can tell you this. I have the same concerns that you guys do about me because I've got key people. We all have certain people that we rely on as being our key go-to folks. and as soon as you remove them from the equation, you've got a management problem that you've got to wrestle to the ground. And so, you know, yes, I think that we do, provided that we can augment our staff using the consultants that we have in the past because they're able to provide a service for us that we can't necessarily get our arms around because we're too busy with the day-to-day. And then also the important part of that is that I love to hire people to do one specialized thing and then they're done. You have to rely on staff, the stuff that you do all day, every day, because it's very hard to outsource those kind of things in certain categories. But I think we're okay right now, provided, like I said, we continue to be able to utilize the consulting expertise that we have. Secondly, though, I would say is that I'm going to be coming back to this group about removing barriers. You've heard me talk about right-of-way acquisition and easement acquisition. If we do not find a way to streamline that process, and I have a recommendation that I'm developing for you folks right now, designing the projects and building the projects are challenging enough, but the deal killer based on the process diagrams we've put together to this point is right-of-way acquisition. It will kill your schedule more than anything else and cost you a bunch of money. Talk about maintenance. I know one of the big components of this, Charlie, is maintenance. Do we have enough maintenance personnel? I know we reshuffled streets and roads at the beginning of the year to bring maintenance over. Do we have the personnel to actually maintain the system? Basically, we use our maintenance personnel for the routine things. We have a maintenance contract with outside vendors that come in and do more specialized things for us because we don't have enough staff to get tied into a project over the long haul. You know, our staff, they came in at Rose and Euclid yesterday, did a great job. They were in one day, out one day. If that's a three- or four-day job, we're going to hand that over to a contractor because we just don't have enough staff to be able to get bogged down on something like that. These guys are helping us come up with other contracts that we can outsource work as well for our emergency pumping. We're going to buy some pumps and generators, but we also have an existing contract with an outside vendor who within two hours is to deliver us pumps or generators and get them set up to work. Some of the smaller pump stations, you don't need to do that because when the power's out, there's nobody there to generate sewage anyway. And so what they've recently done is developed a contract. I think it's on your docket right now as far as for Thursday night, to where we're going to use a vendor who's going to come and pump those out, haul them to a prescribed location, and do that while we have a power outage. So we're finding ways that we can make our staff go farther by utilizing outsourced resources as opposed to expanding staff. When the time comes that I think that we need to expand staff, I'll be the first one that comes to tell you that. In my last 30 seconds, Charlie, revenue. Do we have enough revenue from the current sanitary sewer to cover this, or are we looking at doing the revenue bonds? Have we had those discussions yet? We're continuing to have those discussions, and we meet with the finance team, Ryan, Jane, and others on a monthly basis, and we're monitoring that very closely. I'll be happy to say that we got a group of letters the day before yesterday inviting us to take out 1.75% loans through the Kentucky Infrastructure Authority, and that is encouraging. And I mentioned it to Ryan here in the back room. He was pretty excited about that as well. We know we're going to have to generate cash in order to be able to pay for these projects, but if we can get money at less than 2% in favorable debt service conditions through KIA, that's a good, very positive start. But it's an ongoing thing. All right. Thank you. Thank you, Mayor. Council Member Blues. Thank you, Mayor. I appreciate Councilmember Lane's concerns about the process. When we're involved in what amounts to a half-a-billion-dollar project over 10, 12, 13 years, which is multifaceted, infinitely complex, involving large numbers of people, it is very daunting. To the extent that I've had some involvement in it, I've not been able to see a better way of moving forward, given the constraints on us, than we are. I think it's important that we understand, as I think we all do, that we have a highly capable professional staff, both in and out of the government. And we have a council that's very much involved in this process, and it's true that we have more lawyers on the council than we do engineers. We even have more former English professors than we do engineers. And yet we have to be involved as stewards of the public trust and the public money. I don't think there's any other way. And we have been involved from the very beginning since the consent decree was lodged. We had council members and professional engineers and our LFUCG staff involved in coming forward with a water quality management fee. The same is true with the Capacity Assurance Plan now in progress, where council members are working with Charlie and his team, with our Division of Planning, with our consulting engineers from Stantec, and so on. We've made, as well, great public outreach efforts. Charlie has spent a lot of time talking to the public about the remedial measures plan and getting the public input and providing the information and laying out the realities of the difficult and expensive process that we're involved in. The council is involved, as you know, legislatively. We've approved a private property access program so that Charlie's team can move forward with sump pump relocations, which is a key ingredient of this entire process of coming into compliance with the consent decree. Council members are always involved or should be involved in RFP evaluations, not as experts but as learning presences and being a resource for other council members when it comes to approving or disapproving contracts. So in answer to the question of are we getting the best that we can for our taxpayers, I think we are. I think we're doing the very best job we can do, not only with our experts in who we have to put a good deal of trust, and from where I sit, I can say very well justified trust, but also, of course, on the part of our council, which is very much involved in this process and very well-tuned to the complications that are involved and to the necessity of doing it right. So I do appreciate Council Member Lane's concerns. It's all of our concerns. But I'm confident that we're going to do it right. Thank you, Mayor. Thank you. Council Member Blues? Council Member Lane? Thank you, Mayor. Well, I will say that Council Member Blues is one of our top council members when it comes to staying on top of the issue. But he's a good example of the quality of council members we have, but he's not running for re-election. So we're going to lose Mr. Blues off of our council, and that is one of the issues that we have to be thinking about. There's always going to be transition and change on our council and the people running the program. I had a couple of questions for Charlie. The first one, could you explain how the fees are set for the CMON items on the list? How do you decide what the rate will be for the work to be done? The proposal required the submitters to submit hourly rates. And so use the hourly rates along with the people who are working on the particular subtasks and essentially negotiate the total hours that you believe are going to be necessary to do that. They will tell you here in the back here that I always try to muscle them over. is that give me the few people that I need and give me the people I really need and don't send me people that have high rates that I don't need. Part of this team is that Mr. Shubarth here that's on my immediate right, he's a former director of engineering for both the city of Winchester, Winchester Municipal Utilities, and also for the Warren County Water District. Another key member of their team who's not here is a guy by the name of Roy Berger. He was the operations manager for Winchester as well. Those are the two key people that we deal with on a day-to-day basis. And like I said, what we do is we use the hourly rates that are quoted in their proposal and negotiate the number of hours that it's going to take to complete a task, and that's the fee for that subtask. So essentially what you're saying, the services are on a time and materials basis and not on a competitive bid basis. They are on a timely materials basis. The difficulty in doing it in a competitive thing is because you don't know what your deliverable is. We didn't even really begin to find out what EPA was going to agree to until just last month. And even what they agreed to is they said you have to expand educational activities by August of 2012. It's like love. Some people define love one way, other people define love a different way. You know, I love football, but I don't love it like I love my family. So we had to spend a lot of time with them on determining what that really means. Now, I'm going to probably regret saying this, but I guess is that we were intentionally vague in some of the things that we send to EPA because we want to make sure that we've got flexibility in what we define as compliance as opposed to them having the position to say if you don't do it exactly this way that you're subject to penalties. I think that would be a bad recommendation on the part of the government. So, yes, they have to be on time and materials until we get this thing planed out and define all these compliance metrics about what it is exactly we're supposed to do day after day after day. Hazen and Sawyer, we're just using them for example because they happen to be putting their contract up here. But what other services do they provide in addition to the CIMON services? What other contracts do they have with the Urban County Government? They have the remedial measures contract. I was going to get him to bring that slide back up. They're working on remedial measures, which is also in the same time and materials. We work within. Essentially, the council establishes us a budget in the approved budget, and we work within that budget using task orders. As I said earlier, we're really careful about how we go about doing that because for me, if I don't get the deliverables I want, you don't get the next task order. John would tell you we go round and round about that all the time because I want to see the finished product. Generally, this is how we have done the consent decree all the way through. Every one of those contracts is set up the same way. They're time and materials. because the consent decree, when we signed it, it was a 90-page document, but there was a ton and ton of uncertainty associated with it. Charlie, excuse me just a second. I think it's appropriate to intervene so the public understands. When you originally engaged these engineering firms, you did engage a competitive process. Yes, yes, sir. Okay, that's important because that's being lost here. You need to dial back to that so that you can characterize today's work as amendments that were anticipated all along. Thank you. Yes. This particular one, there were three engineering firms that were each interviewed in a panel that included, I believe, Council Member Blues and representatives of the mayor's office selected Hazen and Sawyer. And this is what we're characterizing today. This was how many years ago? This was a year ago plus. So now we're asking for the renewal that that contract allowed for. But the selection process was not based on price. It was based on qualifications. It was based on qualifications. But hourly rate obviously was one of those considerations. I can't tell you right now where they were on the overall scale of hourly rates, but they were competitive compared to what the average of the three were. The other question I would like to ask is with regard to the billing, once an assignment has been given, what type of documentation do you get for each of the jobs that were assigned, and how do you evaluate whether it's a payout, if the price is right, if the work has been completed? As you've seen in the invoices that I sent to your office, they bill us detail on what it is that they delivered at that particular time. Because we have to report these things to EPA, there has to be a physical something that's part of that deliverable because it goes into the quarterly report, it goes into the annual report, it goes on our CMOM project website because when EPA shows up to audit me, I have to show them that I have that. So it's a whole litany of documents. For example, if we have to have a procedures plan, a standard operating procedure on how to clean a sewer, I've got to have that in writing. And so that's part of what their deliverables are. When Rod reviews their invoices, based on what he sees as far as their work product and their deliverables, he makes the decision on whether or not that is an invoice that is payable. Do you have an itemized timesheet of what time was spent for that particular assignment based on the day of the week and the time spent of that day or whatever? I did get a couple of documents from you, but I didn't see any kind of... This is what they send us with every one of those invoices. It lists each one of the subtasks, and it lists the budget, the budget remaining, the percent complete of that task and who did what. As far as the breakdown in the individual hours of individuals, you'll see on the integrated one, they list the quantity and the hourly rate associated with that particular activity. So, yeah, I believe that we do have that. is that I'm looking at another one of the pages where Mr. Schubarth lists a certain number of hours and a rate and a calculation associated with that fee. Well, I mean, in that particular case, I was looking at do we have each day of the week and sort of a time sheet, I've spent three hours here, two hours there, 15 minutes there. I don't know, do you keep that kind of timing? No, I'm looking back at them and know apparently they don't punch a time clock. Excuse me just a second. and I often am reminded that I have the unpopular role of timekeeper along with the Chair's role. But I do want to comment that, even though Council Member Lane's time has expired, that I really admire his persistence and his determination and his willingness to challenge. Just like Council Member Blue said, it's been helpful for me, even though I've spent a lifetime in this industry, because it has allowed me to, in fact, in a number of meetings with Charlie, to ask questions about our management of this work and if we can improve. We should wake up every morning thinking, how can we improve today what we did yesterday? And I'm comfortable that, and I'm rarely comfortable, so I say that with a lot of thought, I'm comfortable that they are asking the right questions of themselves, that we are examining the addition of personnel, skilled personnel, where we need it, and that the financial management of the project is responsible as well. But, of course, I think it's useful, Council Member Lane, to ask the questions. I certainly agree with Council Member Blues. In fact, the Vice Mayor and I were just commenting, I've done a lot of government projects, and one thing about local projects that's different than state and federal projects is you do have this level of really on the ground, unfortunately for Charlie and his staff, you have a very close inspection of every almost granular detail, which makes it more challenging, of course, sometimes, for those who are responsible for the project, the managers of the project, those in Charlie's role. But it certainly also makes for a more accountable project. Sometimes some would say that you've got checking checkers, but sometimes that is a useful thing in our process. It is. Thank you, Council Member Lane. Council Member Henson, do you wish to speak on this? If you want to ask some more questions, we can come back. there may be a limit on how many times. I don't know if the rules have that limit or not. Thank you, Mayor. Council Member Henson. Charlie. I was looking, you know, as this moves along, our water quality is very, very complicated because you've got the capacity assurance, you've got the remedial measures, you've got the CMO, And we use a lot of acronyms and all of that. So it can get overwhelming. But I feel like I do appreciate Council Member Lane's questioning this because we don't want folks thinking that government's a bottomless pit, that we have all this money and we can just do with it what we please because that is absolutely not true. But I do appreciate your work, and I think any time that we have presented you with a question, you seem to know this stuff like the back of your hand, and I appreciate that very much. will we be receiving through either environmental quality or to council as a whole updates about the progress? Are we moving forward as planned or are we falling behind? As I said before, I believe we're on schedule and that there will be points that we will continue to update you on where we are because there will be future requests for appropriations, whether it's for a renewal or not. if it's for another competitive selection process. I mean, we're stuck in doing this for a long time. So, you know, this will not be the last time that you hear it. And I don't ever take it. I know that generally speaking that most all of you, if not all of you, have a lot of confidence in what we're doing, and I welcome the questioning. It makes my job a little bit easier when our consultants realize that there are a lot of people, not just me, that are looking at the work product they're doing. So I don't take it as a negative. Well, good. Thank you. And come January, we will have several new council members, and we will somehow need to bring them up to speed on all the work that's been occurring for the last two or three years at least. We've had a couple of the potential candidates contact different people in the division. We've already kind of talked about it loosely ourselves. We'll probably have to almost have a workshop for them that's devoted entirely to the consent decree primer. We may need it, too. Thank you, Charlie. Council Member Lawless. Thank you, Mayor. One of the things, and people get tired of me, I think I'll learn about this, but I know there are older neighborhoods in a lot of districts, but in the third district it's almost all old neighborhoods, many of which don't even have stormwater systems. And at the same time, entire backyards are being paved with no retention basin. Lots are being subdivided. Gravel is not being abated. and it seems like we take, and some of these are neighborhoods where when it rains hard, the manhole in the backyard from the sanitary sewer literally flies up in the air with raw sewage coming out. I'm wondering if part of this process really needs to be also examining those issues. It feels like in many of the areas in my district, we take one step forward and ten backwards by doing things that exacerbate these issues. And I've talked to you about, you know, I know I recently asked for a hearing on a zone change because the staff wanted water quality to be able to look at it before it passed planning. planning and I've talked to you about riding around with me to see some of these issues and what we can do about it. And so just for the general public and for the council, these are my concerns. It's just this. I mean, that you've got stormwater going into the sanitary sewer because there's no stormwater system in the neighborhood, and yet we're, you know, then-filled and redevelopment issues have created these huge parking, I mean, literally parking lots and backyards in R1 and R2 neighborhoods. So I'd like for all of us to consider that, and I'm sure most everybody has some of those neighborhoods in their district. Fortunately and unfortunately, all of them in the 3rd District are like that in one way or another. So thank you very much, and I want to say to you and the people that work for you, when I've called, you are Johnny on the spot. I so appreciate how you and the workers that I've dealt with are just fantastic. So thank you so much for your hard work and to all the people that work for you. Thank you. Thank you, Councilman Lawless. Go to Council Member Stenet. Council Member Stenet, have you spoken on this issue once? Okay, you can go again then. Oh, Council Member Myers, sorry about that. Thank you, Mayor. Director Martin, you talked earlier about bringing a recommendation to us to streamline the right-of-way acquisition process. That's one piece of it. The other piece, though, that metrics that you just had up there, where does the actual acquisition of the right-of-ways fall in the responsibility chart there? Well, you know, this is obviously a 30,000-foot. But acquisition is going to happen here in the stormwater capital and in the sanitary capital. So they're really in two different areas. I met with the law department last week. What we're trying to develop is the state transportation cabinet uses outside negotiators to negotiate acquisitions for them. I'm trying to follow a similar model. And they would be used by both programs. Essentially, they would be used by other programs. Anybody in urban county government that wants to use them, they can use them, but we're trying to pave the way on that. The secret, though, in my mind is I've got to give them parameters of how a negotiation is to be executed. What I propose right now is essentially a three-pass type of situation that after three documented offers that we reach a decision point of either we execute or we condemn. Now, that's unpleasant, and like I said, I've got to give you more detail on that, but at some point in time, if we're going to execute this number of projects in the period of time that we need to, we've got to call the question, as you folks use oftentimes here. Our current process doesn't allow that to happen. It allows for, and in some cases encourages, indefinite negotiation, and we will fail miserably if we do that. Okay. Do you actually know to some degree, at least for some of those projects on that list, what right-of-ways have to be acquired? I can just give you a generalization. Most of our plan is about rebuilding existing sanitary sewers that are undersized. And so that means digging up and replacing the existing pipe with a larger pipe. It's in everybody's backyard. And some of those have recorded easements because they're newer neighborhoods, not new-new, but newer. But some in the oldest neighborhoods, and I'll look at Ms. Lawless and Mr. Farmer, is those sewers have been in place long before easements were ever granted. And so we've got to somehow work our way through that difficulty. We may have to change the horizontal alignment because garages and walls and trees and all these kind of things. But essentially the easement, the biggest draw on our easement is going to be is if we're going in the backyard on the street, you're going to have 20 different property owners that you're going to have to deal with just to get off that street. So you have the recommendation you're going to make to us to streamline the process, which is going to involve trying to follow the state model. But then do you actually have a plan for we know we've got to get these right-of-ways and so these are the ones we're starting on? Yes. Yeah. I mean, can I hand it to you right now? The remedial measures plan shows the maps of the particular segments. Have they been culled out to where there has been a title search done to figure out who each one of the property owners are, and we're going to mail them a certified letter and those kind of things? No, we haven't gotten to that point yet. We're very, very close to that point. But you've got a plan on how you know you're going to do that? Oh, absolutely, yes. Thank you very much. Thank you, Mayor. Thank you. Council Member Kaye has signed on to speak. He hasn't spoken before, so I'll call on Council Member Kaye. Thank you, Mayor. I just want to kind of follow up on Dr. Blue's comments and agree with him that from what I've seen from serving on one part of this whole effort, which is the Capacity Assurance program, both the professional staff and the outside consultants have been doing really what I consider an exemplary job. And secondly, on the question of the right-of-way negotiations, there's a perception that in the past on certain projects, the government has really been held up, I'm looking for the right word here, but let's say beyond the time when it was reasonable and trying to be reasonable in negotiating with citizens. On this particular project, I don't think we have that luxury, and I hope that this council will back the administration and backing you in assuring that we have a plan that allows full rights of negotiation with owners, but where there is a holdup, that we do not hesitate to go to condemnation, as painful as it is. Otherwise, this project is going to get stalled over and over and over again. Thank you, Mayor. Thank you, Council Member Kay. Council Member Stennett. Council Member Stennett. Thank you, Mayor. Charlie, looking at the chart on our overhead screen, can you briefly go across there and give the council and the public watching the price tag for each one of those on an annual basis or what we're looking to spend in regards to Sanitary Surer Capital? Because that's the $500-plus million we're looking at. the stormwater and what it costs to do the green box each year because that's important. These are big price tags, and it really emphasizes what Councilman Booz and Councilman Lane are talking about, how big a deal this is. Let me make sure I understand what your question is. Are you asking for me to say how much we're spending on the current consultant on an annual basis? No, just how much our budgets are or how much work we have ahead of us in each one of those operations because these aren't small numbers. The sanitary sewer capital, the current estimate is $550 million. On the stormwater end of it, we are only committed through the supplemental environmental project to spend $30 million over the course of 10 years in stormwater projects. The sanitary sewer capacity, that doesn't have a capital outlay on us, but obviously has a huge impact on others. Stormwater operations, it's an annual contract through Tetra Tech in the neighborhood of $800,000, and we're managing it with them and us. And then on the sanitary sewer operations, again, like I said, we're talking about $500,000 in a contract for this year. The expenditures are to be determined, but, for example, over a three-year period in our CIP, we're looking at spending a million dollars on backup pumps and generators for power outage purposes. There will be expenditures like that, but nothing like $30 million, and it's definitely nothing like $550 million. And that's in addition to the budgets for the personnel in both stormwater and sewers that we budget each year as a council. So these are not small numbers, and this is why this discussion is so important. That's why it doesn't always hurt to hear it more than once and twice and maybe a third time. And I appreciate Councilman Elaine's questions because I think one big issue that we haven't talked about today is what happens if Charlie Martin leaves? Have we duplicated our staff enough so that we have other people who know what's going on? Do you feel comfortable in the people that work in all these divisions? If one person leaves, we can duplicate that person the next day? Because that's my biggest fear is Charlie leaves. I know you're going to give us a year of notice before you leave. But, you know, on a serious note, that's a big issue. And maybe we do need a project manager over all this that can help us keep that continuity if someone does leave. You see these names here, and you only see my name in one of them, is because I felt like I needed to be the lead person on the capacity assurance, although Rod goes to every meeting, as you know, and he's kind of my co-project manager on it. But no, I know everything there is to know about them at a level to come and tell you guys. These are the people who do them every day. They are capable, very capable substitutes in the absence of Charlie Martin. that I would not be doing my job if I did not build a level of redundancy below me. I'm glad to hear that. I was hoping you would say that. I've heard that all those people have stepped up to the plate recently and done a great job regardless of the task because we're asking them to do a lot of new things too. So thank you for that work. Thank you, Mayor. Council Member McCord. Thank you, Mayor. Just real quickly, one of the things that we've learned or I've learned in my eight years in government is that there's never enough money to do it right the first time, but somehow there seems to be enough money to do it right and pay four times as much later on. And it's with every project. And what I really appreciate, Charlie, is the fact that, as it relates to a very serious issue in our community with our water quality, that even though this document is the Encyclopedia Britannica of projects, it is one project, then the next, then the next, and getting these things off the list and not just sitting out there and, as we say, kick the can down the road. So, again, one of the questions that we have, we're looking at $500 million in capital and all of the expense that comes with that. But there is a savings, there is a cost savings to going ahead, getting these things done and finished and off the books forever. And so one of the things that I would just encourage this council and every council that subsequently oversees these projects is do everything in our power to give these folks the tools that they need to get the project done and checked off the list and moved to the next and build efficiencies. Because I think, Charlie, one of the other things that I see, at least, is that in the last number of years, the efficiency factor has gone way up is how we look at these projects. And I think that's only going to increase. Our level of expertise is going to go up, and I think that we're going to start to see efficiencies. And I think that's what Council Member Lane's driving at is, is every turn let's look for efficiencies. But the momentum of this is really critical. Let's put the tools in the hands. Let's get this thing fixed so that you never have to worry about this one again, and we don't have to have things half done and folks in jeopardy. So, again, it's been a pleasure to work with you over my stint here. And while I won't have an opportunity come January to make decisions in this capacity, I would just charge everyone that does have that role going forward to give all the tools necessary and for everyone that is involved, from our consultants to our staff, to do what it takes to move every single one of these projects off and just get it moved over to the completed phase. So my appreciation to everyone who is at the table and those names that are on there, because this is a monstrous task. But at the same time, by doing it the way we're doing it and getting it done, it doesn't cost us four times as much later on. And this is the group that decided to do something about it. And so those who put this into play and who have built this structure and who voted for things to get us to where we are should be applauded because we absolutely stepped out in a way to fix a problem in our community. So again, Charlie, I just want to take the opportunity to thank you and to thank our partners and all those names that are up there for this task ahead. Thank you, Council Member McCord. Council Member Lane has indicated an interest in speaking again. He's spoken twice, which three times would exceed the limit of the Council rules. If it's the will of the Council, then I'll accept a motion to suspend the rules and allow Council Member Lane to speak again. All right. There's a motion by Council Member Lawless and a second by Vice Mayor Gordon. Is there any discussion? All right. Hearing none, unless there's objections, we'll let Council Member Lane speak. I'd like to thank my fellow Council Members. You know, the issue here is that I feel sort of badly because I'm very favorably impressed with Hazen and Sawyer, So I'm not trying to pick on that. It just happened that this contract came up, and this was the opportunity to discuss spending the money. Now, the mayor just corrected me, so I would like to restate that this is not a half a million dollar project. This is a $50 million a year project for 12 years, according to the mayor. So I don't want to over-exaggerate the amount. But I am concerned about this because of the long-term continuity. Now, I have a question for Charlie. And here again, I'm not trying to pick on Hazen and Sawyer. but what will be their fee for the sanitary sewer capital projects portion of the work? Right now they have a contract that is not to exceed $2 million. They will not be doing the design work. What they will be doing is helping us get the design work assigned to other design engineers who will have a defined deliverable, which I know you want, and I want as well. They are not eligible to design any of the projects that we're doing. What their role is going to be moving forward once we get, I guess, the wind in our sails and we're cranking out that 10 to 12 projects a year. I assume that our staff is going to be able to take a larger role in it, and I see their role diminishing over time. I know they're not happy about hearing that. What I tell every one of our consultants about this is your job is to direct us in a way that gets you out of a job. That's what they're supposed to be doing, and we remind them of that consistently. But for right now, I believe their contract is for $2 million, and what they're doing is helping my staff with getting the scopes ready for the 8 to 10 projects that we have for this year that will be awarded to other consulting engineers in a competitive manner. Okay. They're also developing standardized specifications for the construction documents, And so we don't build a pump station over here that looks like one thing and then build another one over here that looks like the other thing. Standardizing the specs, eliminating risk on the part of potential construction bidders to where we can get the best and tightest prices we can, standardizing our materials. Would there also be the issue of redundancy of equipment so that you have interchangeability or you could maintain the equipment with the small inventory of spare parts and things? Absolutely, yes. Okay. I'm getting near the last question I've got here. Do you feel that it's really necessary for the council to approve the scope of this work? Because technically, if you're negotiating on a time and materials basis, it's not competitively bid, which is, you know, I know a lot of jobs are done that way. then what do we need the council to approve that for? It seems like the more appropriate thing would be to have a quarterly report and come to the council and give us an update on what jobs were let, what construction started, what's completed, what percentage of the work is done, how we're doing on our budgets, and let us review it from that standpoint as opposed to proving fees and costs, because there are going to be time and materials, so our approval is really irrelevant because it's going to be whatever the cost is that you all negotiate. And I don't believe that the council members are really competent to, and I'm referring to myself in particular, to make a decision whether this is a good or bad price because we don't know the scope of the work and all the issues that are involved. And that maybe would be a way that you could accelerate the construction with the understanding we would get a quarterly report on the progress. Do you think something like that would be a better strategy for you? You know, I am open to anything that gives a comfort level on the part of the elected officials that there are steady and competent hands on the wheel. So I'm fine with that. I think the law department would probably tell us that because it is a contract that there has to be two readings on that, that the law kind of dictates that. What you're really approving is, in my mind, is that, Charlie, this is your ceiling. You are not allowed to go above this dollar amount under this contract without coming back to the council for authorization. But what I'm hearing is that I need to get it done for something less than that. Every one of those so far is that we have operated under what the allocated budget has been, because we're not just out having them do stuff for exercise. They'll tell you I bristle at any time they give me a task order that says they're going to analyze something or study something. I want to know what you are going to give me that I can actually make a decision with for that money. Okay. That's all my questions. Thank you for coming in and giving us an update on this. We appreciate your time. Thank you. Charlie, thanks a lot. As you're gathering your papers, when Council Member Stenet's comments made me think of a comment that was attributed to General de Gaulle during World War II, when he was still fighting on behalf of the Free French, and he was asked, suggested that he couldn't possibly live without a couple of his generals that had departed. And he quickly responded by saying, the cemetery is full of irreplaceable people. You have some great people, but that doesn't include you, Charlie. We know that. A little humor. They are irreplaceable. Oh, dear. Yeah. Indispensable and irreplaceable. We were looking for some humor today, weren't we? Oh, we needed it. Yes, Council Member Farmer. Yes, always. Next on our agenda. Next on our agenda. I'll ask Benji Mars with Benefit Insurance Marketing to please, he's already at the podium, presentation on the Lexington Fayette Urban County Government 2013 Health Plan Renewal. Right on, Calfoy. Good afternoon, Mayor Gray, Vice Mayor Gordon, Councilmembers. First, thank you to Vice Mayor Gordon for rearranging our schedule and getting us on, knowing that we were ready to present the rates. We wanted to get them out in front of you as quickly as possible, the rates and plans for 2013, so we appreciate you accommodating us for this particular meeting. We're going to present a few slides in the beginning of our presentation that recap or go back through what was presented last week in the financial committee, as well as take you through the renewal for Humana and then the projected rates and plans for 2013, and then we'll be available to answer any questions you might have. First, in establishing premiums, there's a number of factors that are included in setting rates or setting premiums for plans. First, we have to include the fixed costs. Those are Humana administration reinsurance premiums. We include the consulting fees for ourselves in those fixed costs. HSA contributions. The LFUCG contributes $500 per single employee that participates on a health savings account and $1,000 per year to any other contract on the HSA, whether that be employee spouse, employee child, or full family. Then we look at medical costs. Those include the marathon fees for the on-site wellness center. It includes their rent, utilities. We look at financing from an incurred medical claims perspective. We're only looking at claims that have been incurred in 2012, claims that are incurred under these plan designs. When we first started analyzing your finances to fine-tune these rates, we were looking at claims through June and then claims through July. And then the first couple weeks of August, we cut data off at July. So July claims that were incurred in that month had not been fully paid at that time. So we have to formulate a calculation each month to account for what has been incurred but not yet reported. There's a claims delay just in the natural progression of from the time an employee sees a physician to the time they file that claim to Humana, Humana pays it, or bills LFUCG, LFUCG pays Humana, and they remit the claim, and sometimes that just takes time. So we create that calculation for IB&R to true up the claims. Also included are pharmacy costs. We have the on-site RX claims. Those are claims balanced for prescriptions that are filled at the on-site pharmacy. We have on-site RX administration fees, less employee co-pays, and then we have retail RX claims. And all those things are aggregated together to come up with a total number of which, when we design plans, we determine how much of that cost needs to be attributed to each plan design. Looking back, this is a slide from last week which just stated the problem of premium equivalents were never properly set to attribute what was actually being spent by LFUCG for employee health care. In 2012, you'll see that LFUCG is on target premium-wise, budgeting-wise, to spend $24,212,000 as roughly the premium equivalents, and you're on track to spend roughly $24,579,000, which includes all of those fees and costs and administration that we just reviewed. for 2012 when we factor in the benefit pools the supplement the up to 3.8 million and then what the balance of the premium cost or employee payroll deductions when we factor those three things we're on track to to be within your budget for this 2012 plan year As we look ahead to 2013, a component of your cost is obviously your Humana renewal. You're paying them a fixed administration cost to adjudicate claims, to rent their network, network doctor discounts. You're buying reinsurance for them. And as part of our RFP process that we initially released to the marketplace, of which Humana was your incumbent, but they also participated and had to compete in an RFP process to maintain your business, We were able to negotiate several rate caps and performance guarantees for this 2013 renewal. That included a 3.5% cap on administration costs. That included a 19% specific reinsurance cap if LFUCG transitions to a $300,000 deductible from a $250,000 deductible. Your aggregate insurance, which protects the entire claims, there was a 19% cap on those rates. And then additionally, there's a $350,000 in additional performance guarantees, which won't be determined until after the plan year ends. Those are for guaranteed doctor network discounts off of billed charges. Those are also for performance and administration functions. Your actual renewal, your administration costs came in at a 3.5% increase right at the rate cap, which is a $42,000 annual increase to LFECG. Your aggregate stop loss premium, we're actually going to recommend that you drop this coverage. Aggregate insurance, Humana sets the expected claims number, and then your aggregate insurance protects you at 120% above that number. Last year in transitioning through all the plans and not knowing where people would end up or enroll, we felt like aggregate was a worthwhile protection, but now that we've plateaued out and we understand where people are enrolled and where your claims are, we think we would recommend that you eliminate that coverage and save the premium. Your specific stop-loss premium, you've heard us talk about this up to now. Your initial increase called for an 80% increase. That was eventually reduced to 63%, or $354,000, over what you're currently paying to maintain the $250,000 specific. And I'll come back and talk a little bit more about that on the next slide. Alternatively, if we transition to a $300,000 specific, meaning you're taking an additional $50,000 of risk per individual, then your rate cap is capped at 19%, and that is equivalent to a $110,000 annual increase. We conducted a financial RFP of the reinsurance market just to ensure that Humana was in line with their renewal and what they projected. And every reinsurance carrier that we approached declined to quote. They were not interested in providing a proposal because they were not competitive with the 80% increase or any of the other proposals as well. Year to date, and this is through the end of August, LFUCG has paid Humana $368,853 in specific reinsurance premium. LFUCG has earned in excess of $1 million of stop-loss claims rebates for claims in excess of that $250,000 number on five members. Additionally, you have additional eight members that are in excess of 50% of the stop loss, so you have a large number of high claimants. When we factor in the million dollars of reimbursements you've received compared to the $360,000 in specific premium, as well as your aggregate premium, and as well as your administrative costs, Humana is operating through the end of August of 2012 at a net loss. After we factor in the fixed cost renewal, then we start to look at trend. And trend for this geographic region with Humana in this segment is 9% to 10% annually. Just simplifying what is trend, trend just means that in 2013, if your claims repeat themselves, it will cost 9% to 10% more to pay the same cost. 9% to 10% in this market, as well as nationally, that's the average that we typically see. Health care reform mandates, in addition to trend, are adding about 1% to your health care premiums for next year. This is a look at your current five options and your enrollment, and I believe this enrollment count was actually through the end of July. PPO A, B, C, HSA 1 and 2 are the five plans that you currently offer. As you can see, the total gross premium across for each of those plans. In green shading, you can see where the employee premium, the employee spouse, employee children, or family premium is allocated for each of the five plan options. You can also see how many employees enrolled in each plan and in each tier, what the percentage of makeup of the employee base is for those plans, the total monthly premium for each plan, and in an aggregate, where the $24 million number comes from. This is factored and changed each month. Each month goes by, you have employees come onto the plan, you have old employees go off the plan. So this number is constantly fluctuating, but if we annualize those numbers, we're anticipating just over $24 million in premium budgeted to cover all of the expenses we talked about in the beginning of the presentation. With all these considerations, understanding where people are enrolled, we next look at claims impact by plan. This is a breakout of the participation and the expense per plan. As you can see, PPOB, C1, and 2 were the four new plans introduced last year. PPOA was the plan that 89% of your employee base had been enrolled in previously. We left those benefits intact and trued up the cost, stated the true cost for that particular plan. And as you can see, 42% of the population chose to remain in that plan and are incurring 72% of the total plan costs. As we look at PPOB, C, HSA 1 and 2, the relative percent of claims versus enrollment, those four plans are working quite favorably. So that's a major consideration as we go forward in evaluating plan design and rates. This slide. This is the 2013 plans as well as premiums for those plans. As we just saw, approximately 28% of your population is enrolled in either HSA 1 or HSA 2. Those two plan designs will remain intact with the exception of we're removing back-end copays. Right now, on either of those two plan designs, once an employee meets their deductible, they continue to pay Rx copays until they meet another maximum out-of-pocket for those prescriptions. Moving forward for 2013, we're removing those back-end copays. Also noted on all four plans, you'll note the maximum out-of-pocket. We've stated that to include the deductible. previously on the plan designs you had a deductible stated and then a maximum out of pocket and those two were not inclusive you met your deductible and then you met another maximum out of pocket now on all four plan designs the stated maximum out of pocket includes your deductible so on hsa1 plan the deductible is twenty five hundred dollars for a single employee Once they meet that $2,500 deductible, they have 100% coverage for all medical and Rx expenses. So HSA1 and HSA2 are actually improved plans from what they currently are. PPO1 and PPO2, this is a blend or a culmination of PPOA, B, and C. We took into consideration, first, based on the previous slide, that once we established the correct premiums for PPOA and have gone through three-quarters of a year under that plan, we understand that that plan is actually a driver of health care costs, just the nature of the plan design itself. So we chose to blend the three plans, also hearing employees in that PPOC, the maximum risk or the maximum out-of-pocket was too high. So we've reduced that from $5,000, that in totaling the deductible in the max, down to four. So we've taken those considerations and spread those off into two different plan designs, and then these are the rates for those four plan options. I'm going to come back to this slide very shortly. My understanding that for 2013 is that your benefit pools by division will remain the same as they are today, as well as the LFUCG supplement has been approved through the first six months of this plan year, which is the end of your fiscal year. So for at least these first six months, the supplement will remain intact as well. Newly introduced for 2013, we will be giving a premium credit for non-tobacco users. On any of the four plan designs, for single and for employee plus children, they will receive a $25 monthly premium credit. For anybody that's an employee spouse or a full family and non-tobacco, they'll receive a $50 monthly premium credit. As we back up and consider these slides, again, 28% of the population is enrolled in HSA 1 or 2. For non-tobacco users, based on the premium and based on the credit, that means those people will have an enhanced plan, as well as those enrolled on HSA 2, employee spouse and employee child will actually have a payroll reduction over what they're paying today. Those currently enrolled in HSA-1, non-tobacco users, will experience just a slight increase, and by slight increase, about $1.40 per paycheck. But they're taking a $1,500 less risk by eliminating that $1,500 of back-end co-pays. The majority of the population on the PPO plans was enrolled in PPOA. 100% of non-tobacco users from PPOA will receive a payroll reduction regardless of which plan they use. We know that everyone enrolled in PPOA, whether tobacco or non-tobacco, is 100% financially better off by electing HSA-1 if they are eligible to participate in that. simply taking the $182.29 differential in the cost of the plan from what they're paying today for single coverage and transitioning to HSA 1, that's $2,687 in annual premium savings. If that money is taken and deposited into an HSA, excuse me, $2,187 savings plus $500 HSA contribution from LFUCG, that's $2,687 they can have in their HSA account over the course of 12 months before they've had to come out of pocket any additional money to pay for expenses incurred under the plan. $2,687 is $187 more than the maximum out-of-pocket for that plan design. So in a worst-case scenario, if they took what they're paying today and contributed that to the health savings account, if they hit their maximum out-of-pocket, they'll still have $187 left at the end of the year before they've had to come out-of-pocket any more money. Now, we know that that plan design is not for everybody. So we're not suggesting that that's the best plan for everybody. We're just simply stating that financially that's a better position. Different people like different plan designs. And so therefore, because of the high number of enrollees in PPOA, we wanted to design a plan that was as close to PPOA that blended the three plans together, and that would be PPO1. PPO1, in comparison to those currently enrolled in PPOA, maintains the free cost to use the LFSD Health Center, no co-pay. The prescription costs at retail and at the on-site pharmacy remain exactly the same, so no change. And between those two elements, that's roughly 35% of the total plan cost without change, in combination with physician co-pays. The $15 primary care physician co-pay is exactly the same as it is today, and the specialist co-pay is going up $5 from $25 to $30, again, relative to those enrolled in PPLA. The biggest difference between the two is if you look currently, PPLA has a $500 inpatient co-pay. You currently pay that co-pay as often as you're admitted to the hospital with no end in sight. There is no maximum amount of pocket. Under PPO1, you have a $500 deductible, which is a one-time annual expense. And then once you've met that deductible, you pay coinsurance until you've reached a $1,500 maximum out-of-pocket. Once you reach your $1,500 maximum out-of-pocket, the only thing you have left to continue paying are co-pays. You have 100% coverage for all things emergency room, inpatient, and outpatient services at that point. That's the equivalent of someone having three inpatient co-pays under this current plan year. In addition to that, PPOA, non-tobacco user, will pay a reduction in cost to transition to that plan if they choose to do so. Our expectation is that approximately 50% or more of your population will actually experience a payroll reduction based on the plan they use. With 28% of the population enrolled in HSA 1 or 2, that's another high percentage of employees that will experience either the same or a reduced payroll reduction for a better plan. And with that, I'll open up for questions. Council Member Stennett. Thank you, Mayor. Thank you for the presentation, and this is a lot to grasp in a 15-minute presentation. I know there's going to be a lot of questions from Councilmen and the employees of our government over the next several weeks, so we appreciate your patience in answering those. Just a couple follow-up questions. You quoted some numbers and stuff from last year and what we've used to date this year. Is our usage up or down from last year? Your usage, claims usage? Yes. Oh, it's down. And do we know what percentage is down? I don't. I don't offhand. There's obviously going from the $37 million down to $24.5 million, $25 million, but there's also a change in enrollment and change in population, so I don't know exactly, balancing those two out, what the percentage is. And you said our costs actually went up about 9%? Your cost? The 9% is looking ahead at 2013 and applying trend. We actually backed off that. HSA-2 is about a 5.7% increase. HSA-1 is about a 6.5% increase. But then when you consider the premium credits for non-tobacco, that brings that down to almost nothing. Yeah, but I'm just saying we had a cost increase. Absolutely. I think a lot of people need to understand that we didn't just have overall savings. We had that, but we also have increased costs for pharmacy, for the medical piece, for marathon, and for administration costs too. I know the national average projected for next year is 4% across the country that people in the United States will pay additional 4%, and last year it was 9%. And that's because what you just said, and I asked you about usage, is people are using their plans less because of the deductibles changing and things like that. So this is no different, I'm trying to point it, than the private sector. We're all experiencing the same cost and increases in deductibles. I know you all see it in the private sector. So this is playing out the same for the public sector as well. In terms of the plan prices, there was no way. Did you look at keeping plan one the same as PPOB in terms of cost last year? Because it's similar to that plan. Obviously, it's a better plan, actually, than PPOB. It is a better plan than PPOB. And the challenge there is because we've got to, if you look at the utilization on PPOA, we've got to make assumptions about where those folks will enroll and migrate to. They're bringing a large claims per employee per month number with them to the plan that they go to, and that's part of the impact of cost. PPOB, for somebody enrolled in PPOB, if they choose to go to PPO2, right now that person in PPOB has a $500 deductible, a $2,000 max for a combined $2,500. If they choose to go to the new PPO2, they'll take an additional $1,500 of risk, but they save almost $1,200 in payroll deductions. So, and then to go to PPO1, they get an enhanced plan by saving $1,000 in total maximum risk, plus reduced co-pays, but they have to pay additional for that. Because PPOB was one of the smallest participating plans, it was just a balance of. And obviously, Council Members, we can all see how complex this is. I mean, there's a lot of moving parts when you start talking about this. And one big number that we all need to understand, 72% of that $24 million came from the PPOA plan last year. So if that plan's gone, that 72% has to filter into the other four plans. And this is a projection. We don't know where everyone's going to jump to. Each person's situation will be different. But we have to make up 72% of our claims in these other four plans, and that will be closer to getting us on a real track so that next year it will be even easier to keep the cost low and project it out going forward. But this is a big transition year again, and I appreciate your hard work. I will emphasize one thing. We need to educate people. We need to educate people. We need to educate people. And I know you're ready after what we learned last year, ready to go out and do this. But please, let's get the word out and let's make sure people understand this. Absolutely, and I think your HR team has a great game plan for doing just that, almost daily from here to the end of October. Yeah, that sounds good. Thank you. Thank you, Mayor. Thank you, Council Member Stenet. We might want to just give us a preview, give us a picture of what that plan, that information plan represents. Here in the next day, today, tomorrow, employees will be released a survey, Q&A survey, so that on a daily basis at any point, employees can go into the link that will be sent out and they can view the ongoing questions and answers that have been asked, as well as they can ask any related question to the health plan. And we're going to make every attempt to get those answered within two business days. So as employees type in questions that they have for the plan, we can respond back and continue to build the Q&A as we go. So that's going to be launched within the next day or two. Within the next two weeks, I believe we'll be doing what's called a go-to-meeting presentation where we'll invite members of divisions to participate from typically noon to 1 on any given day, where we'll go through a PowerPoint presentation via webinar where people can call in telephonically. They can also watch from their computers. They'll be able to participate that from typically 12 to 1 each day of the week, Monday through Friday. We're going to film a video presentation that will run continuously on GTV. That will be a presentation like an employee format where we do a Q&A as well as a benefit explanation. And we'll also be releasing a book that Mary Lowell's been working hard on that gives more detail, plan detail, designs. That will come out within the next couple of weeks. And all of these things will be done prior to the actual open enrollment, as well as we'll have some site locations where we go out and do meetings leading up to PeopleSoft opening up for open enrollment. choices. All right. Thank you, Benji. Vice Mayor Gordon. Thank you, Mayor. Thank you, Benji. That was one of the things I was going to ask you about was the education program. I remember last year that there were lots of employee questions coming to lots of different people, and I really like your Q&A survey. that employees will be able to ask questions, and I guess everybody can see all the answers. Correct. All the questions and all the answers. That's great. They won't be able to see all the questions that are asked. Right. There are some, based on the surveys in the past, we typically have one or two that are not relevant to the topic, but we'll try and keep them relevant to health care and respond back, and we'll continually update the list. We won't take anything off. We'll just continually add to it as we go and try and get everybody's questions answered in a timely fashion. And then the webinars employees can watch from their office or from their computer. That all sounds really good. Would you tell me again which date you said open enrollment begins? It will begin the end of October. Well, maybe probably the 15th or the 22nd. Either the 15th or the 22nd. Okay. We've got some timing with PeopleSoft loading programs, plans, as well as Humana getting plans and designs to them as well. Okay. And then I want you to talk a little bit about the tobacco, non-tobacco use, how that will work, what employees will need to do to verify that they are non-tobacco users, et cetera. Sure. As a part of the enrollment process, open enrollment, everybody, when they go through PeopleSoft and elects plans, one of the first things they'll be asked is simply are you or your covered spouse a tobacco user, if they're covered under the health plan. They'll have to attest that either yes or no. And then for those that attest that they are not tobacco users, going forward, there will be random nicotine tests, as in any typical plan. just at random, completely at random, and that's quite simply how it will work. What if an employee refuses the test? If they refuse the test? That would be a policy question. How would that? I mean, I think that all needs to be worked out ahead of time. Yeah, that's definitely. Vice Mayor, we are working on a policy for that, but any employee would have a right to refuse the test. They would be charged the tobacco rates. I see. And if the employee, through open enrollment, you said they have to say, yes, I'm a user, or no, I'm not, Is that a legal statement, or what's the status of that statement? Well, there are some legal implications in making an election, and we do have to provide some opportunity to get enrolled in a cessation program. If an employee is a user, there will also be some parameters on how long they would have to be a non-user prior to signing the affidavit. So there are some particulars that we're still working out, but we'll have worked out shortly. And are you, if the employee does not choose to answer that question, will you have a policy for that? or if an employee says, I'm not going to answer that? Sure. They'll just be charged a normal premium without the credit. Okay. So one would have to verify that they're a non-user. Correct. Whether they answer that question or not. That's correct. So they'll just be charged the regular premium if they haven't answered it. That's correct. Okay. Well, just in the last few seconds I have, I personally, and as a registered nurse, applaud this policy. Companies have been doing this for many, many, many years, and we are behind the curve on this, but I'm glad that we are catching up because, of course, all the science with smoking has shown that when our employees don't smoke, they generally have some good health benefits or use tobacco. So thank you for attending to that this year. Very good. Thank you. Council Member Myers. Thank you, Mayor. Thank you for your presentation. And I wanted to start with the education program. For those who have satellite TV, who don't have cable, they won't be able to see that on GTV3. If I'm maybe a field employee, like code enforcement or something like that, I'm out in the field at 1 o'clock and I can't do that. And there's some employees who don't have computers. So do we have a plan for addressing that part of our population? Yes, we had actually talked about burning that on the disks so people could watch that at their leisure. They could watch it at home. Or if somebody requests that with them, we'd be able to provide that. Okay. If they don't have a computer, how quickly will you be able to get those messages that you send out daily to people who don't have a computer? The updated Q&A? Yes. We'll probably take the approach of having divisional leaders print those out because it will just be a standard Q&A two, three times a week. as it's updated, and post that for people to see. Excellent. And then could you include in your Q&A questions from employees about how they are able to have access to the information you're putting out there? Oh, yes, absolutely. If they come up with an idea that if you do it this way, it will help us to get it. The smoking cessation program, are we going to automatically offer a couple? I think I said in the past on this topic, I worked for a company 20 years ago that went to a smoker's rate and a non-smoker's rate, and they offered all the employees and anyone in their household two opportunities for a smoking cessation program that they paid for. I know it's a private sector. I don't know if we can do that or not, but is there a plan for those who have maybe always wanted to stop smoking to provide the smoking cessation up front? There is a plan to provide, and as a matter of fact, we're evaluating costs, employer costs, versus looking at voluntary plans. We're looking at different, we're looking at Marathon will be able to provide a program for employees to use at no cost. We're looking at other local agencies that might participate in that as well. We're evaluating the cost of, for instance, potentially waiving the copay on Chantix. And I think currently the policy is three. three trials of Chantix. So those things will be a part of this program as well. Okay. And Chantix, is that a smoking cessation drug? It's a smoking cessation drug. It's one of the more prevalent, prominent, accepted. Okay. And then last question is the CHIP program? Yes. You have a date when you might bring something back to us? As we talked about last Tuesday, we'd submitted that information. Your legal team has reviewed it. They've marked it. We had questions internally. John and I met and discussed those. that proposal that contract reworded reworked is back in chips hand right now and we hope to have answer for them in the next few days and then what that's that's what's my understanding is that is required before it's it's blue she did along with the car okay then after that that's okay okay thank you you're welcome thank you councilman mary councilman mccord thank you mayor so benji just just so folks know what's what's happening here you're presenting this this first time we've had a chance to really see these these rates you're you're not asking for council's approval you're you're basically just informing us this is what the rates are that's correct okay so when will this go on to the docket or or is this going to be walked on Thursday night are we are we moving it forward my understanding is that this isn't required of council approval that this council approved the budget of the benefit pools and that's the approval that goes into that process. We did have council input. Council Member Stenet gave us some great input as well as Vice Mayor Gordon and Council Member Kaye and Henson and Beard. So they've been a part of that process at the end, and so that's my understanding. Well, and again, last year things changed so radically. A lot of folks, a lot of employees didn't quite understand the process. And so, again, this is a function of the administration. We set the budget. Here's what we're going to spend. The administration engages you all to help craft that, come up with the best offer that we can, and Council is made aware of it. It's not a Council decision. Council's not setting these rates. We're just being made aware. That's exactly right. Thank you. I just want to make that clear for folks watching. Thank you. Thank you, Council Member Court. Council Member Stanton. Thank you, Mayor. And this may not be for you, so I apologize. Commissioner Driscoll, he said that the subsidy's only in there for the next six months. But the council, we were under the impression when we set the FY 2013 budget beginning July 1, we were doing the subsidy for another 12 months. It's just the way the budget year falls. No, I just want to make sure it's in there for the first six months of next year. Yes, for the first six months of the calendar year. The way it sounded, it sounded like it was only in there for this six months, and then next year, January 1, it would be. It follows through the budget that you've approved. I just want to make sure. Okay, we got that straight. I didn't want anyone thinking it was just for half the year, because that does get confusing. And, Benji, do we look at trying to get the health plans, have we looked at that yet in sync with our budget year? Have we looked at advantages and disadvantages of trying to do that? We discussed that a lot last year. Right. And we haven't revisited it since then of trying to sync those two. I can see where it could be advantageous and, you know, a disadvantage as well. But, you know, it just comes to your all's directive of having. if you chose to move it to that cycle of having a short plan year and then readjusting again at the end of six months. And again, at this point, we're evaluating and basing these plans off of seven months of claims, really. So you're running in the same position in terms of projecting. But to answer your question, no, we've not revisited that. Or we could take a long plan year and go 18 months to get us back on sync. So there's two ways to skin the cat. I just, you know, maybe once we get a little more closer to normal-type plans every year and get some consistency after this year, it's something I hope we can look at Commissioner Driscoll is to see if that would help us on budgeting a lot and claims, and I think it would help ease some of the confusion. And I want to point out last but not least, these plans are better benefits than last year. I think that's been missed here. These are better benefits, and for the most part, for most people on them, we'll pay less this year with the non-smoker subsidy. So, you know, trying to keep health care costs once again when they're going up 9% is a very difficult job. It's a national debate even in the presidential election, as we all know. So thank you for your hard work. I know it's not going to please everybody. It's still hard on our families out there. But, you know, we're all facing this, and, you know, we've just got to learn to manage our health care costs. Thank you. Thank you, Mayor. Thank you, Councilman. All right. I have no one else signed up to speak. So, Benji, thank you. Thank you. Thanks very much, Mr. Maher. All right, we can move on then to the next item on our agenda, council reports. If you'll please log in. Who wishes to give a council report? Who wishes to give a council member, Myers? You ready? You want to go? Council Member Myers. Thank you, Mayor. Council Members, we talked about this earlier in one of the standing committee meetings, but you all got a memo from me last week and then another update just for your review today regarding asking the state to change the KRS so that they will decriminalize right-of-way signage. Everybody remember that? So in that memo, we said we were going to walk that on today. So I moved to place on the docket for the September 13, 2012 Council meeting, a resolution requesting that the General Assembly amend KRS 512.080 to expressly authorize Irving County governments and other local governments to issue civil fines for unlawfully positioning advertisements, posters, notices, or other matters to public property and notifying appropriate elected officials of this resolution. So moved. Second. Motion. There's a motion and a second. Is there any discussion on the motion? Yes, sir. Council Member Stenet. I know we talked about this a couple weeks ago, and thank you, Council Member Meyer, for bringing this in a more formal fashion. And, Mayor, I assume this is already on the agenda for our January session in Frankfort. I know we kind of joked about it, but I want to make sure that we have the people that can carry this message to Frankfort and help us. Yes, it will be. It is on there? It will be? It will be. Thank you, sir. We appreciate it. Council has... Along with everything else we have to talk about. There we go. Well, let's see. You hadn't voted yet. Maybe this will be a victory. Thank you. Any more discussion? Okay. We can take a vote. All in favor, please say aye. Aye. Opposed, no. Motion carries. Thank you, Mayor. That concludes my report, and thank you, Council. Thank you, Council Member Myers. Vice Mayor Gordon. Thank you, Mayor. Just a quick report on one of Saturday's events. As you know, it rained probably until noon. I've sort of lost track. But for those who were out and about in Lexington at the various events, it was raining quite a bit. And in spite of that, the annual dog paddle had 476 dogs swim. And the net profit to the Friends of the Dog Park is $6,200, which will all go back into the dog parks. And the current project that we are helping fund is the water fountain out at Coldstream Dog Park. And those are pricey items. So I simply wanted to thank all the supporters who came out and swam in the rain and their masters and mistresses who watched them in rain gear. Thank you. Thank you, Vice Mayor. Council Member Kaye. Thank you, Mayor. As an at-large council member, I've been trying to get around the community with informal meetings. I had one downtown about six months ago and one out Tate's Creek at the library three months ago. And on September 20th, I will be at the north side branch of the public library. It's an informal meeting. Constituents, I'll be happy to talk about any issues you're interested in. And I have a few things I'll say about what council has been doing. We'll meet at 7 o'clock in the large meeting room, north side branch of the public library. Thank you. Thank you, Council Member Kay. Council Member McCord. Thank you, Mayor. A couple of things. Again, I appreciate you taking time today to recognize the 11th anniversary of 9-11 and not only the lives that were affected by that particular day, but subsequently there's many, many folks who have served in our military and in other branches of our government to protect this homeland that have been affected by that day. Our country's never the same. And so, again, I would just encourage folks to recognize the day and what it means for our country and certainly for those who lost loved ones that day and have lost loved ones subsequent. In Lexington, over the next couple of weeks, this truly is one of the best times to be in this community in September and October. And you've got so many things that are going on in such a beautiful time of year. But there are three events from a physical activity standpoint and, again, kind of changing this culture of obesity. You've got coming up on September 28th and 29th the fourth annual Bourbon Chase Relay, a 200-mile relay race of 250 teams from across the country that will race for 24 to 30 hours and ultimately end up in the host city, which is at Lexington, Kentucky, around 6 o'clock at night on Saturday the 29th. I would encourage everyone to come down. It's, again, a street party. There's bourbon tasting. There's food. And you have folks from all over the country that have seen the Bluegrass region in a completely different way. And it's truly a unique event to this area. Along with that, on October 14th, which is the second Sunday of October, You have two events. That morning you have the Iron Horse Half Marathon, which is quickly becoming one of the most signature races around this region and in the country down in Midway. And that afternoon from 2 o'clock to 6 o'clock will be the fifth iteration of Second Sunday. And we will join with communities all across the state of Kentucky to use a piece of infrastructure to come out and blade bike, walk, push a stroller, be together as a community and be active. And when Second Sunday started five years ago, there were really two things that guided that. One was if you don't have permanent infrastructure, just borrow it, whether that be a street or an airport runway, and just shut that down for the day and come out and be active and be together as a community. The second thing was that you wanted to use that four-hour period on Second Sunday to showcase what you already had, 365. Well, this year we've changed it and made it a lot more simple. I would encourage all my council members to accept this invitation. Lexington has achieved that goal of borrowing until we own it. We actually have this amazing facility in the Legacy Trail that now extends from the YMCA on Loudoun all the way out to the Kentucky Horse Park with plans to go much further in many different directions. But on second Sunday of October, October 14th, from 2 to 6, we would encourage you, your family, and your coworkers, And I encourage all of my colleagues to come out that day and just see what an amenity you actually have and enjoy that amenity, along with many other folks from our community. And what we're doing is we're sending a message to folks around the country that the most sedentary city in America, as judged by Men's Health Magazine last year, is actually a leader in health solutions. And Second Sunday has always been, in my mind, the opportunity for a national holiday where communities across the country could shut down pieces of infrastructure and be together and be active. And so this is where it originated from in Lexington. And what I want to challenge folks is to go to our website, which is secondsundayky.com, the number 2ndsundayky.com, And you'll see on the very front page that you can sign up to be a supporter. And what a supporter means is that you are a little bit sick and tired of being sick and tired, that you want to see our community and our country change to a healthier place. And it's literally just a petition that creates an opportunity for us to say that as a community, we're going to do something about it. So on the second Sunday of October from 2 to 6, We have an amazing opportunity to come out and enjoy something we already have, but also to send a message that we want more of this type of thing. And you'll hear more about that every single week that I have this microphone. So thank you, Mayor. Thank you, Council Member McCord. Council Member Farmer. Mayor, thank you. I want to circle back to some of your comments at the beginning of the meeting and talk about Louis Stout. He was a tremendous leader and one that achieved in many different areas. It was a very nice write-up in the paper, but it didn't, I mean, it couldn't cover him in his entirety, I don't think. And I need to say, I really kind of want to say something to you in public that I know he had talked with me about more than once. and it has to do with, well, I guess overall I would call it your homelessness commission, which is at work. But I think that he wanted to make sure that after the votes were taken and the action was ordered as it relates to the community in, that Lexington worked really hard to make sure that we were able to take care of folks from that facility. And I told him more than once I would speak to you about it, and I'm just bringing it up, because I know he would want that. He held great opinions, and he backed them up very well, and it was a pleasure to know him both professionally and personally. But that was something that he knew the time clock was ticking from the time that that vote was taken and that it could run out at a very inopportune time for folks. So I'm just saying that to you just in a very general way. And I think that illustrates what a big heart he carried in so many ways. and how in carrying that big heart that cared for so many people, he also recognized that there were times when he was having to deal, as you all do, as we all do, on issues that are often both unacceptable and unavoidable. solutions to them. Thank you. Thank you, and I wanted to talk with you and honor him at that same time. In a different vein, but still in having somewhat of a conversation with you, in spending time looking at the paving list for the 5th District, and I'm sure every district person is doing it, has done it, will do it, and noting that the 5th District picked up 10 or 11 miles more of roadway than we had last time. And having spent time driving and looking in the new precincts in the 5th District, as well as the existing ones, it's just we had so much more of a budget last year to spend for paving in every capacity, and this year it's less than half that. And it reflected in the numbers for each of the districts. I don't expect you to produce a wallet. But if there was a few. Yes, sir. Sometimes. Yes, sir. It just seems like we're being called upon to spread things so much thinner. And I know this is part of the course of government right now, and I don't have a problem with it. But it just hurts when you're looking at streets and roads and cul-de-sacs and arterials that, you know, when I'm driving around trying to make a list, I can't say do this road. I'm saying do this group of house numbers because you just can't do the whole thing. I don't know that, I mean, we've had a little bit of a discussion in our planning committee about how asphalt's done and how much it costs and how we do it. But the bottom line is, you know, for the district, it's like $2.3 million out around, but have like $360,000 to spend. And I'm just saying that we did a really good job of making a good look towards it last year because we had some other monies to put in there. But this year it just feels sore again. And I like to think of us as moving forward, you know. And it's just very tough when you drive and look and you see so much, not just some more, but so much more. And not that we can program all of it in one year, nor would I want to. But as we think about our continuing priorities and how we try to take care of them, I just wanted to voice that a little bit. I wasn't really asking. You know, sometimes it's therapy for me as much as anything else. You do quite a remarkable job of that, and we appreciate it. Thank you, sir. All right. Then one more. Oh, one more. And you're out on this one. Oh, goodness. A couple of council members here will remember that about ten years ago right now, I rolled out a picture of my wife in her wedding dress because it was our 10th anniversary. And after the meeting had concluded, Victor Camp came over to me and said, in his inimitable way, Thaumma Bill, you're not supposed to show pictures like that, you know. So tomorrow will be our 20th anniversary. So I brought a different picture of my wife that shows her in her, I don't know, she fixed something there that was better than what I think the original person had envisioned for it. And it has been, you know, 7,300 days or 1,050 weeks or 20 years, but it's 91292 for me. So happy anniversary. Thank you, Mayor. Thank you, sir. I wish you hadn't taken me out of that so quickly. Thank you. By the way, I wanted to say in the context of your comments regarding Lewis Stout that just a universal thanks and appreciation and recognition for the work, the heavy lifting that Councilmember Steve Kay is doing as chair of the commission and Deborah Hensley as co-chair and many others, including Shea Rabel on our staff. Thank you, sir. Council Member Lawless. Thank you, Mayor. I would like to ditto what Council Member Farmer said about the paving. As it was pointed out to me recently by somebody in a much higher pay grade than I am, that the 3rd District is the part of town everybody goes through. and the first year that I was on council was the first year it wasn't divided into 12ths and I got 1%, which was $17,000. The next year I got, the next two years, I got the lowest amount of any district in the city. And this year I got the second lowest amount, which was just very little more, But I took on almost all the streets graded the lowest are in precincts, the new precincts in the 3rd District. So once again, I'm somewhat over a barrel, and I had many streets that had unusual failures in their, you know, one where the trolley tracks were going down High Street, et cetera. So it is hard, and there are a lot of people out there, and many of the streets, just like the sewers, et cetera, in the district have been so overpaved that it's causing stormwater problems. So I, too, am working on my list. And so this is, I think, the first year we had a deadline, point blank. But it's difficult because, you know, I took on a whole lot of areas that had problems and very little more money. So thank you. And I don't expect you to produce a check either, Mayor. and if you have any suggestions of what streets you'd like to be paved, let me know. Thank you. Yes, ma'am. Council Member Stennett. Thank you, Mayor. Council Member Farmer, I know you're chair of the Planning and Public Works, so I assume we'll have this topic of street repaving on our next meeting agenda. We're ready to go. Yes, we will. Because I think there is an opportunity to fix this problem in working with the administration. Hopefully we can come up with a solution we talked about the last meeting and make a big den in it. Because as we discussed in 2006 when we started trying to address this issue, we had $30 million of need a short five years later or long. We still have $27 million of need. So we haven't made a huge den, and it's a huge problem, but not just in the neighborhoods, but in a lot of our major corridors where none of us will ever have enough money to pave them, ever. So we need to figure out a comprehensive plan and identify those in a timetable. So I think there's a lot of good work in working with the administration going forward. So I hope that is on the October agenda or September next week. Well, yeah, we'll be ready. Okay. Yes. And I hope the administration, Mr. Maloney, can bring back what we asked for from streets and roads and the ability for them to be able to execute the work if we do find dollars. So I would appreciate that if it's on the agenda. We have compressed natural gas in that and I think one other item, But we'll take good care of all. Okay. Look forward to a lively discussion. And also, Mayor, I know we're entering into the winter months here shortly. It will be here before we know it. I know we have a vacancy in one of the commissioners. If you could give the council an update, not today necessarily, but either informally or formally, however you prefer. But what our status is of getting a commissioner, I know some of the directors have asked the council members that issue as well. So if we could maybe get some, if your time frame is, because we're anxious to have a confirmation hearing. Thank you. Thank you. Just let us know. Thank you so much for that generous option. And just give us a sooner presentation. Appreciate that latitude. It's an important position. Thank you, sir. And I know you know that, but if you could just give us an update when you get a chance. Sure thing. And then last but not least, North Point Neighborhood Association, Council Member Ford's old stomping ground, will be having their annual or monthly neighborhood meeting next Tuesday night, the 18th. I want to go ahead and say it today so people can plan on attending at 7 p.m. at Brown Station High School. Thank you, Mayor. Thank you, Council Member Stenet. Council Member Ford. Thank you, Mayor and members of Council. I'll be brief. I just also wanted to chime in and extend condolences to our loss with Coach Lewis Stout and to wish well in this time for his family and his wife, his family, and his players. I didn't have the opportunity to know Coach Stout very well personally. I was in his presence a few times, but it's very evident the impact that he had with young folk and for somebody to dedicate their entire career and life to the betterment of young folk, be it through coaching or umpiring or athletics. And we're fortunate that he called Lexington home. It does appear that his span was not only statewide but nationwide. So, again, we have a lot of great folks here in Lexington, and I would hope we would continue his work, I think, which would be to look after our kids and hope for a better future for them. So, Mayor, thanks for expressing our condolences on behalf of the government. Yes, sir. Thank you, Council Member Ford. All right. I don't have anyone else signed up for a council report. Next on the agenda is the Mayor's report. Is there a motion? Move approval. Second. Motion by Vice Mayor Gordon, seconded by Council Member Myers. Is there any discussion on the motion? Give me a second, please. Is there any discussion on the motion? All right, hearing none, we can take a vote. All in favor, please say aye. Aye. Opposed, no. Motion carries. Next on the agenda, public comment for issues not on the agenda. Mr. Mundy, anybody? No. Thank you, Mr. Mundy. It's a motion by Council Member Senate to adjourn second by Council Member Crosby. Is there any discussion? Okay. All in favor, please say aye. Opposed, no. Motion carries. We are adjourned.