# Board of Architectural Review - May 8, 2019 > Auto-transcribed civic record · May 8, 2019 - **Permalink**: https://meetings.lexingtonky.news/meeting/4750 - **Source video**: https://lfucg.granicus.com/player/clip/4750?view_id=14&redirect=true - **Date**: 2019-05-08 - **Last revised**: May 8, 2019 - **Length**: 11,438 words > ⚠️ **Auto-generated content.** Audio from the official Granicus video was auto-transcribed with OpenAI's open-source Whisper large-v3-turbo model, run locally by The Lexington Times. Structured facts were extracted with GPT-4o; the narrative summary was written by Anthropic Claude. Verbatim wording may contain errors. See [methodology](https://meetings.lexingtonky.news/about/methodology) or [report a correction](mailto:editor@lexingtonky.news). --- ## Meeting Overview The Board of Architectural Review convened on May 8, 2019, at 101 East Vine Street, Room 220. The board reviewed eight agenda items consisting of various architectural and development proposals throughout the city. During the meeting, the board took eight votes and heard one public comment from community members. The board achieved significant progress on pending applications, approving six of the eight proposals under consideration. The approved projects included developments at 192 North Broadway, 137 Woodland Avenue, 317 South Mill Street, 621 Sayre Avenue, 141 Forest Avenue, and 210 Bell Place. However, the board denied the application for 342-344 Desha Road and tabled the proposal for 591 West Short Street for future consideration. The meeting demonstrated the board's active role in reviewing architectural proposals and ensuring compliance with local design standards and regulations. With six approvals out of eight total applications, the session reflected a productive review process for most of the submitted projects. ## Votes and Decisions The board considered eight applications during the May 8, 2019 meeting, approving six, denying one, and continuing one to a future meeting. All votes were conducted by voice vote with motions made by the Chairman or Chair. **Approved Applications:** • **Application 02500190-c** for 192 North Broadway to install signage was approved [timestamp: 00:00]. The motion was made by Mr. Chairman and passed with the condition that professional signage be installed with mounting through mortar joints. • **Application 05550342-b** for 137 Woodland Avenue to screen mechanical unit and install guardrails was approved [timestamp: 00:00]. Mr. Chair made the motion, which passed with the condition that revised updated drawings be provided to staff. • **Application 13150317-d** for 317 South Mill Street to replace and widen driveway was approved [timestamp: 00:00]. Mr. Chairman made the motion, which passed with the condition that final details of brick be provided prior to issuance of COA. • **Application 16780621-f** for 621 Sayre Avenue to replace lattice with windows and doors was approved [timestamp: 00:00]. The motion by Mr. Chair passed with standard conditions 1 and 2. • **Application 072801-41-u** for 141 Forest Avenue to construct garage shed roof addition was approved [timestamp: 00:00]. Mr. Chairman's motion passed with standard conditions 1 and 2. • **Application 32930210-f** for 210 Bell Place to construct garage was approved [timestamp: 00:00]. The motion passed with conditions that windows and doors be one over one, with reveal size six instead of eight. **Denied Application:** • **Application 05550342-b** for 342-344 Desha Road to remove chimney was denied [timestamp: 00:00]. Mr. Chair's motion to deny the application passed. **Continued Application:** • The application for 591 West Short Street to construct shed was continued to June 12 [timestamp: 00:00]. ## Public Comment During the public comment period, one community member addressed the board with concerns about local development impacts. **David Craw** spoke regarding traffic concerns [timestamp: 00:00]. Craw expressed worries about potential traffic issues that could arise from future construction activities at the Wagon Bones site. He raised these concerns as part of the public input process, highlighting community awareness of how development projects may affect local transportation patterns and road usage. The public comment period provided an opportunity for residents to voice their perspectives on matters of local interest before the board's formal proceedings. ## Contested Items The board addressed two applications that generated significant discussion and opposition during the May 8, 2019 meeting. **Chimney Removal at 342-344 Desha Road** The most contentious issue involved a request to remove a chimney at 342-344 Desha Road due to persistent water leaks. The application sparked heated discussion among board members, who weighed the practical concerns of ongoing structural damage against the historical significance of the chimney feature. Despite acknowledging the legitimate maintenance issues presented by the applicant, the board ultimately denied the removal application, determining that the chimney's historical value to the property outweighed the practical considerations of the leak problems. **Shed Construction at 591 West Short Street** The second contested item concerned a proposal to construct a shed at 591 West Short Street, which faced community opposition. The discussion centered on two primary concerns: the proposed placement and appearance of the structure, and its potential impact on available parking in the area. Board members and community members raised questions about whether the shed design would conform to established guidelines and how the structure might affect the neighborhood's character and functionality. The opposition highlighted broader concerns about maintaining appropriate standards for accessory structures while addressing residents' storage needs. Both applications demonstrated the ongoing challenge the board faces in balancing property owners' practical needs with preservation standards and community concerns. The discussions reflected the careful consideration required when evaluating modifications to historic properties and new construction in established neighborhoods. ## 192 North Broadway [timestamp: 00:00] The board reviewed an application for signage installation at 192 North Broadway. The discussion was brief, as the applicant was not present at the meeting but had previously indicated agreement with the staff report recommendations. The board proceeded to consider the signage proposal based on the staff analysis and documentation provided. No concerns were raised during the discussion, and no debate occurred regarding the application details or compliance requirements. The board approved the signage application for 192 North Broadway without opposition. ## 137 Woodland Avenue [timestamp: 00:00] The board reviewed an application for 137 Woodland Avenue involving the screening of a mechanical unit and installation of guardrails. This item was listed as agenda item 2 during the meeting discussion. The application centered on two main components: providing appropriate screening for mechanical equipment and adding necessary guardrails to the property. These types of modifications typically require board review to ensure compliance with local design standards and safety requirements. During the discussion, the applicant committed to providing revised drawings to address any concerns or specifications raised by the board. This agreement to submit updated plans suggests the board may have requested modifications or clarifications to the original proposal. The board ultimately approved the application. The approval indicates that the proposed screening and guardrail installations were deemed acceptable, either as originally submitted or with the understanding that the revised drawings would address any outstanding issues. The relatively straightforward nature of this agenda item - involving mechanical screening and safety railings rather than major structural changes - likely contributed to the positive outcome. Such improvements generally align with municipal goals of maintaining property safety standards while ensuring mechanical equipment is appropriately concealed from public view. ## 317 South Mill Street [timestamp: 00:00] The board reviewed an application for property improvements at 317 South Mill Street during agenda item 3. The proposed work involved replacing and widening the existing driveway at the property. During the discussion, the applicant presented their plans for the driveway modifications. The board expressed interest in obtaining additional information about the materials to be used in the project, specifically requesting final details regarding the brick components of the proposed work. The applicant agreed to provide the requested specifications for the brick materials as part of their submission. No significant concerns or objections were raised during the review process. Following the discussion and the applicant's commitment to supply the final brick details, the board approved the application for the driveway replacement and widening project at 317 South Mill Street. ## 621 Sayre Avenue [timestamp: 00:00] The board reviewed an application for 621 Sayre Avenue involving the replacement of existing lattice work with windows and doors. The discussion focused on the proposed modifications to the property's exterior elements. During the review process, the applicant demonstrated willingness to work with the board's requirements by agreeing to the standard conditions typically imposed for such modifications. The nature of these standard conditions was not detailed in the available materials, but they likely relate to design compatibility, materials specifications, or other regulatory requirements common to such applications. The application appears to have proceeded smoothly without significant debate or concerns raised by board members. No specific speakers were identified as leading the discussion or raising particular issues with the proposed changes. The board ultimately **approved** the application for 621 Sayre Avenue, allowing the applicant to proceed with replacing the lattice with the proposed windows and doors, subject to the agreed-upon standard conditions. ## 141 Forest Avenue [timestamp: 00:00] The board reviewed an application for a construction project at 141 Forest Avenue involving a garage shed roof addition. The discussion was brief, with the applicant demonstrating agreement to comply with the standard conditions typically required for such projects. No significant concerns or objections were raised during the review process. The applicant's willingness to accept the standard conditions appeared to satisfy the board's requirements for approval. The application was approved by the board. ## 210 Bell Place [timestamp: 00:00] The board reviewed an application for construction of a garage at 210 Bell Place during agenda item 6. The discussion centered on the proposed garage construction and specific conditions that would need to be met for approval. During the review process, the applicant agreed to comply with conditions related to windows and doors for the proposed garage structure. The specific details of these conditions were not elaborated upon in the available materials, but they appeared to be standard requirements for this type of construction project. The application proceeded without significant debate or opposition from board members. No major concerns were raised regarding the proposed garage construction, and the discussion appeared to be straightforward and procedural in nature. **Outcome:** The application for the garage construction at 210 Bell Place was approved by the board, with the applicant's agreement to the specified conditions regarding windows and doors. ## 342-344 Desha Road [timestamp: 00:00] The board reviewed agenda item 7, an application for 342-344 Desha Road requesting permission to remove a chimney from the property. Staff presented their analysis of the proposal and recommended denial of the application. The recommendation was based on the historical significance of the chimney structure, which staff determined was an important architectural feature that should be preserved. The board ultimately voted to deny the application to remove the chimney at 342-344 Desha Road, following the staff recommendation to maintain the historical integrity of the property. ## 591 West Short Street [timestamp: 00:00] The board reviewed agenda item 8, an application to construct a shed at 591 West Short Street. The discussion centered on the proposed shed construction project at this location. During the meeting, the board examined the details of the application and identified issues that needed to be addressed before the project could move forward. Rather than making a final decision on the application, the board determined that additional work was needed to resolve outstanding concerns. The board advised the applicant to collaborate with city staff to develop a solution that would address the identified issues with the proposed shed construction. This approach would allow for further refinement of the project details and ensure compliance with applicable regulations and requirements. The agenda item was ultimately tabled, meaning no final action was taken at this meeting. The tabling allows time for the applicant to work with staff on resolving the concerns raised during the discussion before the application returns to the board for further consideration. The decision to table the item reflects the board's preference for collaborative problem-solving rather than outright denial, giving the applicant an opportunity to address the issues and potentially move forward with the shed construction project at 591 West Short Street. --- ## Decisions - **02500190-c** — passed (0-0): Approval of application for 192 North Broadway to install signage - **05550342-b** — passed (0-0): Approval of application for 137 Woodland Avenue to screen mechanical unit and install guardrails - **13150317-d** — passed (0-0): Approval of application for 317 South Mill Street to replace and widen driveway - **16780621-f** — passed (0-0): Approval of application for 621 Sayre Avenue to replace lattice with windows and doors - **072801-41-u** — passed (0-0): Approval of application for 141 Forest Avenue to construct garage shed roof addition - **32930210-f** — passed (0-0): Approval of application for 210 Bell Place to construct garage - **05550342-b** — failed (0-0): Denial of application for 342-344 Desha Road to remove chimney - **Motion** — postponed (0-0): Continuance of application for 591 West Short Street to construct shed --- ## Full transcript I'd like to welcome you to the May 8th, 2019 meeting of the Board of Architectural Review. We appreciate those of you who are in attendance today. The board was established by zoning ordinance in 1958. Our first historic district was Grants Park, and we now have a total of 15 historic districts. The board, which is appointed by the mayor and confirmed by the Urban County Council, is a part of the Division of Historic Preservation. The Historic Preservation Office maintains a full-time staff to assist you with your projects. The board encourages and recommends that applicants use them as a resource. The Historic Preservation Office is located at 101 East Vine Street, Room 220. It is our procedure to consider applications in the order in which they are listed on our agenda. In each case, we'll have a presentation by the staff and we'll hear any additional comments from the applicant. The board will then ask questions or make comments regarding the application and then hear comments from any other interested parties. The chair will then ask the board members to enter a motion. If you wish to address the board, please come to the microphone and state your name and address for the public record. We also ask that you write your name on the sign-in sheet by the door so that information can be recorded correctly. I would like to note the following staff approvals before we begin our review of the applications. There are certain items that the staff can approve, eliminating the necessity for all applicants to appear before the board. There are a total of 39 approved applications noted on today's agenda. Our staff has been very, very busy. Let me read them into the record. In the Ashland Park Historic District at 230 Deshea Road, replace driveway. At 231 Deshea Road, install fence and gate. At 1014 Fontaine Road, renovate structure and site. At 100 South Hanover, renovate roof. In the Aylesford Historic District at 218 Arlington Avenue, remove damaged tree. At 425 East High Street, replace rear doors. At 601 East High Street, replace tree. At 274 Kentucky Avenue, replace fence. At 398 Linden Walk, renovate structure. At 131 Old Park Avenue, replace and install new fence. At 357 Transylvania Park, renovate structure. At 147 Woodland Avenue, renovate front porch. In the Bell Court Historic District, at 146 East Bell Court, install full light storm door. At 145 West Bell Court, renovate front porch. At 17 Boonsboro Avenue, remove dying trees and repair fence. And finally, at 600 Sayre Avenue, renovate structure and site. At 612 Ellesmere Park, in the Ellesmere Park Historic District, renovate Yankee gutters. In the Grants Park Historic District at 240-242 Market Street, renovate chimneys and replace flat roof. At 304 West 3rd Street, renovate chimneys. In the Fayette Park Historic District at 416 Fayette Park, remove damaging tree and renew COA. In the Mulberry Hill Historic District at 468 North Limestone, refurbished repair staircase system. In the Northside Historic District at 441 West 2nd Street, repair apron, driveway and sidewalks. At 478 West 2nd Street, tuck point structure. 478 2nd Street again installed fencing at 516 North Broadway renovate structure in sight in the South Hill historic district at 325 South Miller Street remove tree at 353 South Miller Street renovate structure at 432 South Miller Street renovate structure at 324 South Upper Street renovate structure at 365 South Upper Street renovate structure and at 389 South Upper Street renovate structure in the western suburbs historic district at 153 west short street renovate structure at 703 west short street renovate stoop and patio at 835 i'm sorry turning now to the woodward heights historic district at 835 west high street install gas meter 852 west high street install gas meter 816 west high street install gas meter and finally at 314 merino street remove damaging tree that concludes the staff approvals we'll now turn our attention to the first case before us at 190 192 north broadway scoable work install signage is the applicant here the applicant is not present but has received a copy of their staff report all right uh did he indicate his agreement with it or do you know I believe he is in agreement with him. I'm sorry. I think he is in agreement with him. Okay. You made a suggestion. You have recommended approval. Suggestion being any mounting of wall signs need to be through mortar joints in lieu of the brick. Ms. Armstrong, did you talk with them about that particular issue? I had a conversation briefly with them, but I'll reiterate that. Okay. Well, what I'm trying to get out of you is whether I need to postpone this case or go ahead and hear it. If he's in agreement, it's not going to be a problem, but I don't want to do something that's going to come as a surprise to him. I don't think this will be a surprise to him. Okay. All righty, then. Any questions or concerns by the board members? Any questions or concerns from the audience? In which case, then, let me read into the record. staff has recommended approval that signs be installed however any mounting of wall signs need be through the mortar joints in lieu of the brick and if any changes are made that alter the information submitted resubmit the changes to staff for review and approval prior to start of work of the affected work once reviewed by the other divisions any changes shall be submitted to staff or board for review and approval prior to the start of the affected work I'll note as has been our custom lately items 2 and 3 are what I call the standard conditions and it will be referred to as such during our proceedings if there's no further discussion I think the chair is ready for a motion mr. chairman relative to case number 0 to 5 0 1 9 0 day C at 1 90-92 North Broadway. I move that we approve this application as reiterated by you in this. Into the real work? Do I have a second? Yes. Second. Any further? Any further discussion on the motion? Mr. Schipps, can you hear us all right? I saw you puzzling. Do we need to speak up louder? Okay, all right. It always helps, if you would. Okay, if there's no further discussion, the Chair will call the question. All those in favor say aye. Aye. Opposed, nay. Motion passes, and the COA is approved. Randy, that's a little too much reverb. Thank you. All right, turning to the second application at 137 Woodland Avenue in the Ellsworth-Isar District. Scope of work is screen mechanical equipment and construct guardrails. Is the applicant here? You want it? Okay. State your name for the record, please. Tim Dobson. And your name, sir? Robert Lee. All right. These mics are kind of sensitive. You have to speak directly into them or we can't hear you. All right. The staff has recommended approval of your COA, and they're subject to what I've been referring to as the standard two conditions. Have you reviewed those? Yes. Are you in agreement with them? Yes. Okay. Any questions from the board members? I do have a couple of questions, and they're picky questions, but they're drawing questions to make sure that I understand. It's on A1 and A2, and on A1, the east elevation, the front. Right. On the north side, so on the right-hand side of that, the east elevation front, on the right-hand side of that drawing, which is the north elevation, right? If I look over on the north elevation, it shows two rows of those. Yeah, I noticed that after I printed that. Okay, so it's not just one. It's a lower one that happens also. Okay, and then a very similar. Let me make sure. Are we going to correct the drawing soon? Yes, she's referring to this side right here. There should be also another screening device there. I had made that correction after I noticed that. It's kind of about clearance and hit room is the reason I mentioned it. Besides, when you provide detailed drawings, we get to see what's happening. Right, exactly. I just want to make sure the corrected drawings are in the record. On A2, there's a similar kind of a thing. and it's related to the west elevation, the rear, on the left-hand side of that drawing, that same lower level bump out should be occurring and show up. And if you could get those corrected points. Thank you. Okay, I'm going to suggest for any motion that we add into our conditions that you resubmit corrected plans. Okay, any other questions? board members anything from the audience then i think the chair is ready for a motion okay mr chair relative to case number zero five five five zero three four two dash b i move to approve the certificate of appropriateness um at three as requested at 367 transylvania park with the two... I'm sorry, I think we're at 137. Oh, I'm sorry. Woodland. We're at Woodland. And what did I say? Okay, 137 Woodland Avenue. Right. Yes, sorry. That really, really is where this building stands, so we're good with 137 Woodland. All right. Thank you. No, we moved it to my street on Translating Park. All right. With the two standard recommendations, would you like for me to read those into the record? You don't have to. I'm sorry. You don't need to. Okay. And with the request that revised updated drawings with the two items previously discussed be provided to the staff. Absolutely. Okay, just to make sure we're all on the same page, this is case number 05550342-B at 137 Woodland Avenue. Do I have a second? I second. Any further discussion of the motion? I'd ask for any questions from the audience. There being none, the Chair calls the question. All those in favor say aye. Aye. Opposed, nay. Motion passes and your COA is approved as conditioned. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Dodson. Okay, turning now to attachment number three at 317 South Mill Street. Scope of work is replaced in Wyden driveway. and I see the applicant coming up Hello, Mary Venese and if you state your name, I didn't hear you Mary Venese Ms. Venese, okay Ms. Venese, the staff has recommended approval of your application subject to the final details of the BRIC be provided prior to the issues of the COA along with the two standard conditions have you reviewed those? Yes, sir Are you in agreement? Yes, sir All right, do we have any questions from the board members? No. Anything from the audience? There being, then I think we're ready for a motion. Mr. Chairman, relative to case number 13150317 slash D, at 317 South Mill Street in the Ashland Park Historic District. I move that we approve this application, including the staff recommendations that we have final details of BRIC as provided prior to the issuance of the COA. And then the other two are standard. All right. Any further discussion on the motion? If not, the Chair calls the question. All those in favor say aye. Aye. Opposed, nay. Motion passes. Thank you. And thank you so much. Okay. All right, turning to attachment number four, 621 Sarah Avenue. Scope of work is to replace lattice with new windows and doors. Is the applicant here? Mr. Fugate, come on up. And if you state your name for the record, please. Yes, sir. Jeff Fugate. All right. Mr. Fugate, I believe the staff has reviewed your application and as revised, they have recommended approval subject to the standard conditions of 1 and 2. That's fine with me. All right. Is there any questions about this application, then? No. We had a fairly extensive review last time. Yeah, just the observation much better. But I think this is where we show how the process really works. And Mr. Fugate, I really appreciate you working with us. Absolutely. Great. Any questions or comments from the audience? If not, then I think the Chair is ready for a motion. Mr. Chair, relative to case number 16780621-F at 621 Sear Avenue in the Belcourt Historic District, I move to approve this application for a COA with the two standard conditions as noted by the staff. Is there a second? I second. Any discussion on the motion? Nope. Hearing none, the chair calls the question. All those in favor say aye. Aye. Opposed, nay. Motion passes and the COA is approved as conditioned. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thank you. All right, turning now to, uh-oh, here it is. Turning now to attachment number five at 141 Forest Avenue, Scobal Workers Construct Garage Shed Roof Edition. Is the applicant here? Come on up. Scott Book. Mr. Book, how are you today? Good, sir. How are you? Doing well. We're just really moving along today. Let's keep it rolling. Your application has been submitted and the staff has recommended approval subject to the standard two conditions. Are you in agreement with those? Yes, sir. All right. Is there any questions or comments from the board members? No. Any questions or comments from the audience? If not, then the chair will ask for a motion. Mr. Chairman. relative to case number 072801-41-U at 141 Forest Avenue, Belcourt Historic District. I recommend that we approve this application pursuant to the standard changes that we will need. All right. Any further discussion on the motion? Do I have a second? I'm sorry. Second. Okay. Any further discussion? If not, then the Chair calls the question. All those in favor say aye. Aye. Opposed, nay. The COA is approved as conditioned. Thank you, sir. Appreciate it. All right, turning now to 210 Bell Place in the Bell Court Historic District. Scope of work is Construct Garage. What? Are you back again? Scott Book. You're a busy man. Trying to be. All right. Okay, the staff has recommended approval, subject to what I call substantive conditions. I want to read these into the record. The one, excuse me, it's allergy season. The first one being the windows and doors in the garage be 101 in lieu of multi-pane and final specifications sheets be submitted to staff prior to the issuance of the COA. The other being, number two, the reveal size be six inches in lieu of eight inches. And then three and four are the standard conditions. Are you in agreement with those recommendations? Yes, sir. All right. Any questions? Could we have your name for the record? I'm sorry. It's okay. I'm Ryan Hilliard, the owner of the property. Mr. Hilliard, how are you today? Good to be here with you. Glad to have you here. All right. Any questions from the board members? No. Any questions or comments from the audience? If not, then the chair is ready for a motion. All those in favor. Excuse me. All those. May I have a motion, please? Mr. Chair. I'm on a roll here. Relative to case number 32930210-F at 210 Bell Place, Bell Court Historic District, I move to approve, per the staff recommendations, the certificate of occupant of appropriateness with the two staff conditions that you have read into the meeting record and to the two standard conditions. Okay. All right. Any further? Do you have a second, please? I second. Any further comments or questions? Nothing. I'll call the motion. All those in favor say aye. Aye. Aye. Those nay? Motion passes, and the COA as conditioned is approved. Thank you. Thank you very much. Thank you. All right. Let's turn now to 342-344 Deshaies Road. Scope of work is remove chimney. And the applicant is present. Will you state your name for the record? Jenny Brown. Okay, Ms. Brown, I assume you'd like to be heard on this one? I would. Okay. I'll note for the record the staff has recommended disapproval of the application, and so we need to have a brief hearing on this. Okay. So who is the staff person? Dennis? It's all yours. Okay. I'll run you through the photographs real quickly. 342, 344, Deshay. Are these current photos? Yes, sir. Okay. You can see the one chimney in the front there. Barry, would you mind grabbing the mic? I thought I was speaking loud enough. Much better. Thank you. This chimney is still remaining. There was an additional chimney in about this location that is obviously gone. That's towards the back of the house? Yes, sir. All right. This is from Google Earth, and I think you can see it better in your package, but the chimney is located there. And this is the remaining chimney and then the one that has been removed. One further question. Go ahead. The scope of work is to remove the chimney. In the background, the applicant is requesting a certificate of appropriateness to remove the rear chimney from the south roof plate of the structure. During a neighborhood visit, staff noticed that the chimney in question had been removed above the roof line, and the roof was resheathed and shingled. and that the chimney was not reconstructed. Staff notified the owner by mail, advising that a COA was required for removal of chimneys. The owner quickly responded by telephone and submitted a COA application and explained that the roof had been leaking around the chimney and that roofing contractors were unable to stop water infiltration. The guidelines are included for your use. Findings. The staff finds the proposal to remove the chimney does not meet guidelines. Guideline 13A states brick materials original to the building should be preserved and maintained. Guidelines 15A and 15C additionally state, respectively, Chimneys should not be removed or altered if original or architecturally significant and should not be removed or altered if original. Well, I guess I've doubled that one. The staff recommends denial of the Certificate of Appropriateness, and the deadline for board action is June 8, 2019. And I'm assuming, although you didn't state it expressly, that this chimney is original to the house and historically significant to the house. Is that correct? Yes, sir. All right. Is the chimney capable of being replaced? I know the original brick's gone, so what is the means of abatement? Reconstruction. Right. Reconstruction, you would have to try to find brick that matched or closely matched the historic brick on the structure. Which can be done. Yes. Okay. All right. For the record, that was Ms. Kirk speaking into the record. All right. Ms. Brown? Yeah, do you have those pictures that I gave you? Yes. Okay, so just as far as kind of a little history on it, I've owned the property for 25 years. You'll need to speak directly into that mic. This one? There we go. I've owned the property for 25 years, and it has leaked for 25 years. We have, probably 10 years ago, a new roof was put on. The chimney has been flashed. It has been sealed. It was capped. it was flashed it was sealed it was I mean it has gone on for 25 years these are pictures of what the inside looks like the problem this chimney is on the back of the house and it's towards the it's it's right in between it runs up I guess at one point it vented maybe it vented something from the kitchen that's the kitchen side so this mold and plaster and whatever else that falls into the kitchen falls into the other side which is the breakfast room I had just fixed this back in January so it was all smoothed and painted and redone this is what it does and so just in a just kind of a moment of desperation but you know if I revent the two gas water heaters that vent up through here I got two electric ones take the chimney down maybe this would be a way to solve this problem and so honestly it was not which i should have been but i was not even thinking about that this chimney was something that i should request you know i just was like okay that's it i can't take it anymore so i spent a lot of money electrical you know everything um water heaters all that and took it down and then i got your all's letter and you know i'm i really am very sorry i just i don't know what else to do with this this is um i have tenants and i've lived in in this building as well and it's a great place. I mean, obviously, if you can see from the outside pictures, it's a very nice home. But it is – there's mold and plaster and things that fall into people's food in the kitchen. And it's just – it's been a nightmare for 25 years. So I – the thought of having to rebuild a chimney and start this problem up again, it's not – I mean, as far as for people to live there, it's not safe. And I just am very concerned about that. So I don't know as far as what I can do at this point to appease you all. I'll do whatever you need me to do, but I just... Well, let me ask a couple of questions. First of all, you've taken the fireplace out, haven't you? The chimney is there up to the roof line. Right. But the fireplace is gone. There was never a fireplace. This is just a venting chimney. This is a flue chimney. Exactly. Yes, a flue. And so I'm saying this, but I can't imagine it ever had an interior presence of a firebox. No. What you're seeing is the chimney stack right there in her image. Yes. That is the masonry chimney stack. Yes, it is. That continued on through her attic and punched on out through the roof and rose on up on that side elevation. If we have venting appropriate for the gas heaters, I take it, can we just simply reconstruct without creating another hole in the roof? Just reconstruct the... Well, no, you would have to build it to cut it out in the roof to have the masonry rise, to be built up to rise back up vertically through that roof system. I want to turn this over to the architects. I think they have ideas. It's a nightmare. I mean, I can't begin to. It's not complicated in a, I'm not disputing you. No, no, I, yeah. In a construction methodology, it's actually pretty clear-cut and simple how to put one back up through. Well, what I'm trying to get at is to correct her problem of not having any further leaking. Any ideas on that? Yeah. Cool. So someone who has dealt with a similar problem, where I've actually found the leak problem to be has been on the back side, kind of the upper side of the roof, has been the cricket side. Okay. And in looking at the photograph, that looks like that may well be a condition that existed for you. I mean, you have to build it right back where it was because it has to be supported by something. The roof can't support it, but it seems like to me that the cricket on the backside where the roof comes down and slopes into it, that's the zone that most likely is creating the opportunity for water to infill to round the rest of the flashing. And that may be. We addressed it. I mean, I can't tell you how many times I flashed and sealed and reflashed and resealed, and a new guy would come out and he'd try his hand. I mean, it went on for 25 years. It's just, you're right, I'm sure that's probably where the water, but we could not get it to stop. Unfortunately, once water figures out how to get in, it's kind of like a squirrel getting in an attic. It just knows how to go. Right, right. And so I'm extremely sympathetic with what you're dealing with. Well, and it's on the back of the house, and the front chimney is, And the picture that you have of the front of the house, the chimneys are not, I guess my other thinking on this now is, I mean, if you look at the front chimney, it's not an architecturally significant, I mean, the house next door on the corner has beautiful chimneys that, you know, on each side of the house, and they're beautiful. But this is probably a two-foot-tall chimney that was taken down, and that's a two-foot-tall chimney on the front. I don't know. It's hard to imagine that it is somehow detracting from the architectural design. It's part of the historic architectural history of the building as a flue, as a chimney flue. and so it's not that it's a high style huge fireplace chimney, but it does tell the story of the history of the building, and as those pieces disappear, it's harder to kind of put them back together and understand what that history was. Go ahead. I have a question. Yes. When you built it back, was there a cricket on the upper side of the – For the layperson here, what is a cricket? A cricket is – It's a – Oh, you know what a cricket is. And it goes all the way – So why don't you go on the same page? Okay. Did the cricket go all the way to the outside to outside? When they worked on it, you mean? Yeah. There's nothing there now. Yeah, I understand that. And the whole time you've been dealing with this, did anybody – Did they build a cricket? Well, that's just – that's simple carpentry, really, and flashing. And anybody who's up there working on that project for you would know that they should. And otherwise the water is going to sit against those edges where the cricket doesn't go all the way out. And then once it's gotten in there, it can travel. The pitch of the roof that's there, it's not a steep pitch at that point. The roof is pretty subtle. And there's not, I mean, as far as like a lot of water hitting it and flowing that way, I would think. I mean, I don't know. Well, given the 100-year rains we've been having the last five years or three years or whatever, rain events are changing the way that water flows that our buildings have to deal with it. So even if it's relatively simple and straightforward, it doesn't take much water to do a lot of damage. I'm wondering if the irony of all of this is that by taking off the chimney and restoring it back to a flat roof, that now when you do the restoration, you may have fixed your leak problem. I may have to fix what? That you may be able to fix the problem of the leak because you'll put in a proper cricket, if I understand the term properly, and that should eliminate the leaking. Well, you would only be... The problem we have here, ma'am, is there's no exception for this particular situation that you're dealing with. That chimney is part of the historic fabric of the original house, but more importantly, it's part of the rhythm of that neighborhood in terms of the chimneys that are on the other houses in that area. And your neighborhood overall, not just your street, but the overall look of you're in the, which district are you in? Ashland. Ashland. Ashland, that's right. Any further suggestions or comments? Any comments or observations from what's left of my audience? I think I'm ready for a motion. I want to predate the motion and tell you, I know this is really frustrating, But none of us were on the committee that established the guidelines. And it's, regardless of how we feel about it, it's our duty sitting up here to. And I will also point out as a preface to the motion, you do have a right to appeal whatever determination we make. Let me ask you this. would as versus rebuilding a full chimney a masonry chimney 16 inches tall whatever is was there do i have the option of putting a box like you did on 266 clay avenue a box with the stick-on brick that you all approved for clay avenue is that an option that's this is news to me News to me too. 266 Clay Avenue. Okay. And it's apparently a chimney on the back of the house was removed, and so it was decided that a box could be put back, a wooden box with stick-on brick, I guess. Sadly, that doesn't meet building code, much less this process. That sounds like a much worse potential. I don't know, but I'm wondering if that was allowed for that, is that not? I don't think it was allowed is what I'm saying. I'm not disputing you're seeing something up there. This process did not approve it, the historic district. And I'd be surprised if they got appropriate other permits from the city because a construction method like that would not be legal in terms of outcomes. But wouldn't that be less weight on a roof than? Well, you don't have a weight problem. You have the chimney below your roof line, and you have that chimney ready to have the masonry come right back up. after you cut your hole in your roof. So there's no way you're going to rectify this situation without having it punch through your roof. Nothing is going to be able to perch on your existing roof cover. Because in a construction sense, that's not a legitimate way to have anything stand up. Right. Well, and that's why I was curious if that was something that. I'm intrigued by what you're saying about this other situation. I have a feeling staff's going out there tomorrow. I think we're all going to have a field trip to see what this deal is. Approved, apparently. Well, that's where I think we are not in agreement. It wasn't approved. I mean, I don't think it's there yet, but it was approved. So I'm just wondering if this would be approved. Let's put it this way. We'll check into that. Sure. But I cannot fathom anything in that concept is, A, a solution to your situation, and, B, may not be a proper solution to any situation. So we'll have to work on that. The staff will be glad to get with you on site and talk to you about how to rectify what's gone on, depending on the board's actions. So a brick chimney is what would be required to be built back. Well, the board needs to take its action. And if that is the outcome of that, it is the... Right now, what we have before us is your application to take out the chimney. That's all we have for us right now. So we can't really get into a discussion about the specifications of what your chimney should look like when replaced? How am I going to find out about that? You're going to submit an application. Well, you're going to work with staff on that. You'll have to submit an application. And you can actually, you will provide us the details for that, and probably we can do that at staff to return that which is missing. because it's so recently removed. I mean, you'd really, had this been a construction project that you had not roofed it over, you would have already just talked to us about tuck pointing it and leaving it in place. So we can work with you to get that resolved. I think the details of it, if the board's going to deny the removal, it could also be that she would come back to get approval. for her coa no i think if you all can do it staff approval that'd be much simpler and easier for miss brown as well we don't need to review this again right that's what i'm saying allow her to move forward if she if you all decide or discover something bizarre about the 266 clay avenue then that may have to come back to us and be oh now that's that's another whole topic we're not talking about that one okay well that was what's why i was asking because it seemed like a different alternative you know but if that's not we're intrigued okay about 266 we don't know what to tell you it's not something that this process could approve hmm okay am I ready for a motion you're probably not ready for me to have a motion but I am may I have a motion please last one okay I'll take it thank you Michelle Any further discussion? I think you're ready. Mr. Chair, relative to case number 05550342-B at 342344 Deshay Road, Ashland Park Historic District, I move to disapprove the application for removal of the chimney, denial of the COA. Okay, second. Do I have a second? I second. Any further discussion? Ms. Brown, I am sorry. I mean, sometimes we get caught into rough situations. You do have a right to take this up on appeal to the Planning Commission. You do have an opportunity to discuss this with the staff and perhaps work out, hopefully, a solution. And you can look at that 266 play, but I don't think that's going to work for you. But even if that's not, what would be another solution? I'm afraid there is more. Actually, I don't think there is, other than reconstructing. Build a masonry chimney back. Gotcha. Okay. All right. Chair, we'll call for the question. all those in favor of the motion to disapprove say aye aye opposed nay the motion passes the coa is denied all right thank you okay uh problem with paperwork is here i'm ready for the next application if i can find it hang on he's here somewhere bear with me aha i got it all right this is at 591 west short street uh this is attachment number eight the scope of work is to construct shed is the applicant here Yes, ma'am, come on up. And let me ask, Mr. Dennis, is this your application? Okay, if you'll state your name for the record, ma'am. Kelly Bailey Harris. Harris, how are you today? I'm doing good I want to say good evening to the chair and the board on tonight I think this here's what we need I assume that you won't be heard on this and what a normal procedure is to have the staff to presentation first so mr. Dennis needs to go first and then you can I know you've got your speech already and it's up there somewhere okay all right okay mr. Dennis 591 West Short Street, the application was to construct a shed. The applicant is requesting a certificate of appropriateness to construct a shed on the southwest corner of the site adjacent to Short Street. Staff had preliminary discussions with the applicant about plans for the use of this site that is to include a rollaway bar, exterior seating, and some type of structure. Staff suggested that the site design and especially loss of parking would be a concern. No final plan details or a COA application were filed with the office. At a later point in time, while in the area, staff discovered that a prefabricated shed had been installed on the site and contacted the applicant who submitted a CO application to retain the shed. So this is Short Street running in this direction, and it's the corner of Jefferson. this is the wagon bones barbecue restaurant this is the shed in question what was before a filling station gasoline station a long time ago a long time ago okay all right i'll ask you a question later okay here's just some other views from the site this is uh looking from the north back towards the south. And this is from the east looking to the west. There are some trees along the property line and the shed behind it. The guidelines are included for your use. The findings, the staff finds that the proposal to construct the structure does not meet guidelines and may not comply with LFUCG zoning regulations for the B1 neighborhood business zone in regard to parking and setbacks. The proposal does not comply with guideline 2B2A, which states that outbuildings should be located in character with other secondary buildings for the street, near an alley, or at the rear of the property, not close to or attached to the primary building. Nor does it follow design guidelines established for new construction of primary buildings per 2B2G. Additionally, if reviewed as a commercial building based on its location and design, the proposal does not meet 2B3G and 2B3H, which state respectively, commercial buildings be compatible in design, shape, proportion, and scale to other commercial buildings along the street and within the historic district, and follow design guidelines established for new construction of primary buildings. The staff recommends denial of the certificate of appropriateness. Staff did meet with planning concerning the parking, and there is some question, since they or I did not have the actual seating numbers within the restaurant, how many parking places would be required. so that issue would still be up in the air. Okay. Ms. Kerr? I'm sorry. I have an anonymous letter, I believe. Yes, it seems to be anonymous. I don't know what the policy is. Our attorney has a copy of that, I believe. And it's anonymous. We do not know the source. Well, typically, from a hearing officer attorney perspective, when I'm acting as a hearing officer in other cases, we normally do not accept anonymous statements. It's not signed. It's not verified. It doesn't have to be verified, but it certainly doesn't have an author to it. I'm just inclined to read it into the record. Use your mic. Or have I once again gotten crossways with legal staff? I would just say that if everybody has read it and you're taking it into consideration for the denial that it should be read into the record, but if nobody else has seen it and you're not taking it into consideration. I don't think it deserves to be taken into consideration. Well, I think, though, her point is that other members of the board have seen it and it is known. And you're saying I can't unring the bell because you put it on the table? Essentially, it then became part of the meeting. Okay, we may have a further conversation. All right, with that noted, and since it has been looked at by, I assume, the other board members, let me know there's a letter. It's unsigned, objecting to the shed, basically pointing out it's not in conformity with the site. It's not level. It also says it's in bad taste for a restaurant entrance. It blocks the bay window of the building also. I hope this will not get approved. it takes away from the character of the property and the neighborhood and the handwriting is exquisite but we don't have a signature to it all right so i think what we need to do miss harris if you'll come up did the staff uh board members have any questions of the staff before we start no okay miss harris okay well thank you for the opportunity i appreciate it um well first of all i would like to state what has been going on i have been out of town for a while i had the passing of a few of my family members in chicago so wagon bone has been open for a while but then i had to close it down 2017 because i had to go to chicago handle my family take care of their business my aunt never had children i basically was her child my uncle never had children i was basically his as well so i've been taking care of their business in chicago so when i came back to back here i've been working working with my board. I'm so sorry. I do have some paperwork as well that I brought to show you guys. Wagon Bones Grill is a non-profit organization. It's underneath the Ruby Bailey Family Service Center. I designed this to be able to raise up money because we're not government funded. I'm pretty much self-funded. I have to raise up every penny in order to do what we do for our community center. I do have some papers if you guys would like me to approach you. I can show you some of the things that I do in the community. Okay, Ms. Harris, if you step back, let me ask a couple questions before you give us the paperwork. When you say you're a community center, is this a commercial restaurant or is this a nonprofit? This is a nonprofit organization that we do there at Wagon Bones Grill. And you're running, but you're running a restaurant out of that building, correct? Yeah, it's a nonprofit. It's right here. It reads it's a nonprofit charity food service. Okay, all right. So I can show it to you, and then I would like to address a lot of things. because a lot of things they don't know that I was doing I didn't give them enough time because I was running in and out of Chicago so I'm gonna give you this part and then I'll continue telling you what's going on what I did do and here I'll let you go. This is all I had on me because I just found out today that I had to be here. And that's all I had, like, on me, just a few things. Okay, just a moment. Okay, go ahead. She has handed to me some documents. I think I'll just note them for the record. They appear to be business-related documents, the first being a conditional certificate of occupancy at the Wagon Bones Grill at 591 West Short Street. It's a building inspection approval. In 2011. 11. We also have a permit to operate issued by the Division of the Health Department. Yep, Health Department. Also your non-profit letter. We also have a letter from Cameron Lutz. I'm not sure if it's relevancy. The letters have worked with the Ruby Bailey Foundation. Is this the construction of the shed? No, no, no, that's That's not that. That's just Home Depot works with us doing stuff in the community. I'm just giving you different letters. I have some other ones, but I didn't have them with me. Those are more of my older ones. But I just want you to see that I do work in the community and it's money from this shop goes to do things in the community. Okay, and that's all well and good. Well, I just want to let you set the stage, part of the stage. Now, one thing I did do before I moved and marched out, I did call and I tried to get information to know exactly what I can do. Now, I did speak to somebody and they told me when I was constructing a shed, can you guys hear me? When I was putting up a shed they said, well when you're putting up things, for one, it cannot be attached to your building. It can't be like a permanent thing. So I told them, I said, well I'm not making it permanent until we purchase the thing because I'm only renting it right now, rent to own. So it's not nailed down on purpose because it had to be movable. They told me that if it's something that is solid and anchored in or attached to something, attached to my building, that requires a permit and you have to go through all these other things. So that's what I was informed of. Can I ask what part of the government you were talking to? Actually, I called, I believe, your office. I think I called and talked to your office and I talked to probably building inspectors and stuff like that. So it's building inspection. I talked to a few different places because I wanted to know. Historic preservation would not be advising you of those details that you just outlined. So I believe you might have been talking to building inspection. Well, I know I called around. I did, but I don't have all my notes with me or who I spoke with because sometimes I will write down names and sometimes I don't. But then I also called the 2-5-8-3000 and talked to, who is that thing you guys have, like an answering service that answers Lex Call or something like that? Well, I don't dial 3-1, I dialed 2-5-8-3000. And so I talked to them as well, and in the process I did call and talk to them, and they did come out and see what I was trying to do. But they don't have the total details exactly what I'm trying to do. The part of we got the building, the shed, I got it to match the building. Because it has a rustic look and doing a barbecue, I want to stay in a rustic. I even have a picture of the first state of that, which was a Texco gas station. And before that, after that was a boot store. After that was the IOU. No, I think she was next. And then it was like a, I can't think of it, cup of tea, cup of tea and then me. So I've been there since 2011. And our goal was to just do something outside like we did for like the Jefferson Street Soiree. I did like jazz on Jefferson. I go get a permit. Well, I really don't have to get a permit. I call the mayor's office, the special event people, and let them know what I'm doing. They said they don't really care, you know. So as long as you're not bothering the neighbors and they call in on you, then you're going to have some problems. But other than that, because I get the liquor license and I go forth and we host things on the lot. I've done this several times. Only thing I'm trying to do is to be able to host things, be able to put my furniture in somewhere. Because our building is pretty small and I don't have any room to put patio furniture in it. So I'm using that for patio furniture. And then I also work pretty good for the one spot because I have to deal with the people behind me. We don't own that land behind us. That's not my land. So the people behind us always have my garbage cans, and they use them. They put all kinds of stuff in it. And I'm like, I don't want that stuff in my garbage can. So we have a garbage can war going on. So that helps me put my garbage cans up out of their way, put my patio furniture up out of the way, because we also have a homeless problem where if my patio furniture outside, it becomes their home. They're living on it. And I come back and they're sleeping on my patio furniture. And I'm like, hey, it's time to get up. I've got to get to work and you're going to have to move. So that kept me from having to fight with the homeless people telling them to get off my patio furniture so I can put it in there. And our part for the bar, when we want to do our different events, this is what I didn't explain to them fully. This is only now and then. This is not like every day, like Monday through Saturday, I'm going to host some big event. This is now and then. And then I talked to Main Street Baptist Church because I understand about parking because I'm fighting with all the other restaurants down the street, and, you know, parking's really tight there. So Main Street Baptist allow us to use some of their parking if we need to. And I do have a letter, but I didn't bring the letter, but I need to get an updated letter because it's an old letter. And I think that you probably would want an updated one, but I can provide you one. I can get one from there. Do you want to cut me off now? Well, I think I need to steer the conversation just a little bit if you'll let me. Go ahead. What we're dealing with today, Ms. Harris, is whether or not this shed, I recognize your organization is doing great things. The problem is whether or not the shed that you have placed on the property conforms to the guidelines of the Historic Preservation Board. That's the only issue we're dealing with today. And I would like to try to adjust to fit your guidelines is what I would do. And what I'm trying to suggest to you is right now this particular prefabricated shed does not conform to the guidelines. I think you're going to have to work with the staff and come up with a different plan. Okay. But part of that process is you're going to have to go to another division, which is the building inspection division, and get a sign-off from them that you're not taking up too many parking places. Okay. And that's where your letter will be relevant. Okay. Okay? Okay. So what we can do, I think we can do one or two things. We can either, to be honest with you, either disapprove this one or let you have a continuance until you can get with the staff. I know you've been really busy. Well, actually on the 20th, I'll be back on my way to Chicago for probation. What's that? I can't think of it. Probate court on the 20th. So are you now back in Lexington for a while? I'm only here for a little while, but I'm going back, but I'll be right back again. And I just got back in town. I happened to call to see what's going on. I explained to them that my daughter has a new key to the mailbox, and I'm not getting my mail. it's in her car so I didn't get in my mail all right in the deadline for action on this case is June 15th do we have another meeting between now and then yeah June 15th let me suggest this so denial is probably if indeed you're inclined to deny the cleanest okay if we deny can she submit another application to construct a shed? Yes, as long as it's not a twin to this one. Okay. I think what we're going to have to do, ma'am, because clearly your shed doesn't fit into the guidelines, you're not going to be forbidden to have a shed, but we just need to work with you. So I would suggest that we go ahead, let me have a motion to deny your application for this particular shed, get with the staff, talk to them about what you need to do and construct one that will be in conformity with the guidelines well uh before she constructs anything i know get a permit get a permit first from the division of planning right no and from us yes well yeah i'm understanding that that she needs to submit an application being very literal before you do anything you need to submit an application to bore and you also need to have permission to have it on that site with parking you follow me yes sir may i ask a question sure i'm so sorry i don't i'm trying not to have to because that shed i already put money on that shed and then another thing is i did submit an application in and i did talk to her people before this i understand and they even came out and we kind of adjust and let them know and they showed me how big i can have have of a shed and how i can place it and um it's placed exactly where they told me it could be i placed it exactly there this is pre before the shed even got on the grounds i did meet with two of your people did come out and i did explain to them and they did say what one of them stated if at first we thought that i probably wouldn't have to go through this board because nothing's going to be nailed down and nothing's attached so i thought legally that that was by nothing being attached and nothing's nailed down i thought that i would not be in trouble period so is that not true sheds are never put in without a permit from this board okay and barry do you want to address some of this. Here, do I need to step back? You can just step over, you don't have to step all the way back. Yes Mr. Dennis. Mr. Armstrong and I did go and meet on site. We had no documents to review. We were just kind of discussing what her plans were which I intimated in the staff report. it was just kind of like you know pointing and talking and possibly this parts believe that we did bring up that parking could be an issue she did tell us that she thought she could rework the parking we did say that there would have to be an application and a certificate of appropriateness for some type of building she didn't know what it was going to look like she thought that She had an idea that I think she calls it whiskey shack. So, I mean, all of this was just preliminary discussion. No direction was given. Okay. And where are we with respect to a prefabricated shed being placed on the property? well without seeing what it looks like where it's located um but i take it this one doesn't fit the bill no well it doesn't fit with the character of the neighborhood and it's not located uh primarily because it looks too much like keeping with other outbuildings in the historic district so i cannot answer a question without having the information at this point all right All right, Ms. Harris. And if I may, the other thing, amongst many other issues, but where it's placed relative to the structure that is the existing structure is obviously an issue to be taken into consideration. And we would need to know that building inspection has indeed found that her parking situation would still meet the zoning ordinance before we could really accept an application for one that can occur. All right, Ms. Harris. Thank you. Okay, I almost forgot what I was going to say. Well, for parking part, also, like I said, I can get the letter from them. And also, I plan on doing, if we do an event like we've done before, I'm going to use the valet parkers is what I was going to do if we have a big event. The majority of them is not going to be like an everyday thing. And the parking, I lost two parking spaces. And when I talked to Amelia and when they were there, I told myself, I'll put it right over here. And the parking fit right behind there. I took pictures of it on my phone, but it's not going to really help you here. But I replaced the two parkings. That event for this is only now and then. This is not even set in motion for all the people that they're thinking I'm going to bring in. i'm bringing in no more people than normal this shed has not i have not started to i don't even have my liquor license this shed right now is strictly operating as a shed with storage for my palliative furniture that i've already had and the issue we're dealing here with is the problem is you've got a bunch of oranges and i have a couple apples i have to deal with the oranges i can't fix my apple is your shed and your shed doesn't conform to the guidelines now down the street there is a shed as well to the side of their building as well but i'm not bringing no names up but there's a shed down the street as well and their shed is no prettier than i think my shed is prettier okay my shed least match my building is going with a rustic theme basically and i'm painting my building to match my shed because i'm at a dark chocolate and i'm going to go to a lighter chocolate so we're going to process the paint in the building to match the shed so and i think it matches it perfect but that's just me and my taste nobody probably like my outfit but i like my outfit but same old thing so but my thing is i'm trying to work with you guys please work with me because i work very hard and i understand that some things will happen oh yeah i did send an application out and i talked to amelia and i sent it to the wrong address i only sent it to the address of the people who gave me the information and i informed her that i sent it to wrong address So I quickly, once I found out that she did not have it, I emailed it to her. I got her all the information she needed right away, and she should be able to inform me of that. Once I found out that they didn't have it, I sent it to them again. But I did originally send it out, but that's just another part. But my thing is, I'm trying hard guys, if you please have mercy on me. I know this is not the court where I could throw myself on the mercy of the court, But I would like to throw myself on the mercy of the board. Please work with me. Well, I think what we need to do initially. Please work with me. I'm sorry. Can I ask one question about. Sure. You have signed this as the owner. But I've heard you say that you don't own this property. Well, I do not. I call myself the owner of the business. I'm sorry. But the property. So you lease this property. I have worked a deal out with Mr. John Pittman. And he knows he had to sign with also the people for the shed, and he signed and approved it as well. He also will need to sign your application for a COA. They have a thing that I have sent them to that shows that he knows about that and he agrees to it. Because we have like an owner finance thing coming up and we're working on that. Because I don't have no bank financing, so he went and financed me because he knows how I'm struggling. So he works with me. whatever you need me to do i'll get it but you will need his signature i'll get it for you i'll get it all right i think a couple let me let me suggest this as a compromise we have a couple meetings between now and this one that we can still work this out i want you to we're not i think at this point i would like to continue this proceeding thank you let you have a further conversation with the staff and see whether there's a way you can make this building work the way it is perhaps by painting it by changing how it looks i'm not promising me anything i understand but at this point i think what we really need to do is just continue this hearing uh probably to the june we have to june 15 and i think our june meeting would be when come on calendar work with me it is june 12th all right we're going to give you a continuance to june 12th now i'm not promising anything but you you have to do several things one of which is i think if you have an attorney you probably need to talk to him or her okay that would be your first best step i'm assuming you have an attorney advising your non-profit well i have lots of them who represent help me in different areas i think i think you can find an attorney that can do some pro bono work for you he'll do it for free is what i'm saying i have a few of them who do do stuff like that because i know what i do okay great yes there is someone here to speak about the project uh even though go ahead sir come on thank you you're welcome so my name is david crawl and i'm a property owner on west short street and i don't think i have an architectural issue when i got the letter and the if you're speaking to the microphone sure so sir thank you yeah so My name is David Kroll and I'm a property owner on West Short Street and I don't think I have an architectural issue. I think whenever, Jim, whenever you begin describing the broader project, I think I heard you say that the establishment that may eventually be put in where Wagon Bones currently is, there are still open issues with that that have not yet been decided. I think that's what I heard you say. My hearing is not so good. what was that i don't think uh all the scope of work is basically just constructing the shed and nothing else so so um i'm not familiar with the the owner of whiskey shack is there any future construction associated with wagon bones as far as there being a same people so but there is a broader a a different venue the only application i have before me right now is this application for the shed we have nothing else so i we can't address any hypothetical projects that may be coming down the line that's what i'm trying to tell you okay okay because are you asking specific to the bigger building on this property uh indeed yeah so yeah that's let me take a step back for the board i don't have an architectural issue i potentially have a traffic issue that's not my issue yeah i have a traffic issue too that's that's a building issue that's not a bore issue okay fair enough so if i wanted to learn about future constructions at this site is there any way i can i think talk to miss harris would be a good place to start and any future construction at the site would go through this process and property owners within 200 feet receive notice in their mail and then if you monitor the herald leader classifieds for the dockets for these meetings everything on our docket every two weeks is in the paper thank you so you're welcome to come and participate or come see people's proposals before the hearing once those proposals are filed we have nothing on file at this time thank you and miss harris i think you fully understand if you want to do a construction project you have to file something with us yes sir i'm not doing anything i think what he's talking about is because if we have um come up to the mic please we have people out there working on the streets and i allow them to use my lot for parking but they're irritating everybody in the neighborhood because they're blocking off the streets and they're making a mess and i told them stop making a mess on my lot i'm allowing you to use it to park there is this the sewer project that's going on or i don't know what it is it's a project where they're building all down the street and they're doing the gas lines yes everybody's upset you know but i'm just trying to help out i told them i don't mind them sitting there you know because i'm if i'm closed i don't mind sitting there it's fine and i'm not sure if you're upset with that that's not me that's the that's the the contractors in the neighborhood okay so this is probably my misunderstanding um probably my misunderstanding but we are i know the neighborhood that we've we are in the process of building with a lot of the residences down there we're very very sensitive to new uh new construction so when i get something in the mail it says we have a building permit i don't care about the architecture but i do care about the parking and the traffic in that area so when i hear that and with any kind of application that has to go through the board process that will be discussed as well and you'll have notice you will have notice of any construction project on this property thank you all right thank you and whatever homework you guys give me i will do it so i promise and i am very sorry board and i'm very sorry everybody for causing a big stink i'm sorry you're you're not doing anything this is your you're entitled to have this hearing and what i'm trying to do is hopefully we can work out a resolution so our first step i think at this point is i would like to have a motion to continue the proceeding to june 12th is that correct so So moved. Okay. So do I have a motion to that effect? So moved. Do I have a second? Second. Any further discussion? Okay. What we're doing is we're postponing this to June 12th in the interim. You're going to get an attorney. You and your attorney are going to talk to the staff. You're going to review that building. You may have to wind up selling that building and getting something else put on the site. Or you might be able to reconfigure this building so it will conform to the guidelines. Okay. All right. No further discussion on the motion. I call the question. All those in favor of the motion say aye. Aye. Opposed nay. The motion to continue to June 12th is approved. Thank you so much. Thank you, Ms. Harris. Thank you, Ms. Harris. Appreciate it, everybody. You're welcome, ma'am. And I will get with your bill, with your people, and I'm sorry. Ms. Curry, if you could send her a name for her to talk to, that might help. All right. Thank you. Okay. We have – that's the end of our applications. We have minutes before us from March 27 and what's the other set of minutes? February 13th. Okay, February 13th. I have gone through the March 27 minutes and just saw minor corrections that I've already given to the staff. Do I have a motion to approve the minutes? So move. Do I have a second? Second. Okay, the February 13 and March 27 minutes are approved. Is there anything further? If not, the Chair is ready for a motion to adjourn. I move that we adjourn. Okay, second, please. Do you have a second? Sarah. Second. We stand adjourned. Thank you so much. We'll be right back. Oh, it's time for good conversation.