Music ¶¶ Thank you. ¶¶ Good afternoon. I would like to welcome you to the February 21, 2024 meeting of the Board of Architecture Review. We appreciate those of you who are in attendance today. The board was established by zoning ordinance in 1958. Our first historic district was Grants Park, and we now have a total of 15 historic districts. The board, which is appointed by the mayor and confirmed by the Urban County Council, is a part of the Division of Historic Preservation. The Historic Preservation Office maintains a full-time staff to assist you with any of your projects. The board encourages and recommends that the applicants use them as a resource, and the Historic Reservation Office is located at 101 East Vine Street, Room 220. It is our procedure to consider applications in the order in which they are listed on our agenda. In each case, we'll have a presentation by the staff, and we'll hear any additional comments from the applicant. The board will then ask questions and then hear comments from any other interested parties. The chair will then ask the board members to enter a motion. If you wish to address the board, please come to the microphone and state your name and address for the public record. We also let you write your name on the sign-in sheet by the door so that we can record information correctly. I would like to note the following staff approvals before we begin our review of the applications. There are certain items that the staff can approve, eliminating the necessity for all applicants to appear before the board. There are a total of five staff approvals, and they are as follows. In the Bell Court Historic District at 215 Bell Place, remove Dying Tree. In 236 Clay Avenue, renovate structure. In the western suburbs historic district at 574 West Main Street, refurbish the windows. In the Fayette Park historic district at 434 Fayette Park, replace the fencing. And at Woodward Heights historic district at 852 West High Street, repair and replace the fencing. We will now turn to our first application at 246 South Avenue. Over Avenue, excuse me. Instruct covered deck. Chair, before we get into the applications, could I just have one moment to introduce the board to you? I'm sorry, I didn't hear you. Testing, can you hear me now? My apologies. Before we got into the applications, I wanted a chance to introduce the board to Tiffany Holsky, who is sitting here with me. Okay. You can see her over the monitor. She'll be taking over the board. And I'm sorry, the sound system is really poor today. What is your colleague's name? Tiffany Holsky. She's right. Welcome. She'll be taking over. Stand up. There we go. There we go. All right, thank you. She's shadowing with me for the next couple of months, and she'll be taking over the board soon, so I wanted to make sure you all were introduced. Tiffany? Welcome aboard. I assure you that we only snarl, we never bite. All right. I'm also known for making bad jokes, and I apologize. Okay, so turning now to 246 South Hanover Avenue. Scope of work is construct covered rear deck and change the openings. Is the applicant here? Come on up. Which one of you? Or all of you? It doesn't matter. Okay. My name's Steve Albert. I'm the architect at 118 Constitution Street. Okay. Mr. Albert, welcome. I believe the staff has recommended approval of the application. There are a couple of substantive recommendations and then what I call the standard ones. The first one is they want the staff wants you to provide the final door details and specifications to staff for review and approval prior to the issuance of the COA. Are you in agreement with that? Yes. All right number two, provide the final railing details and specifications to staff for review and approval prior to the issuance of a COA yes all right the other two are what I call the standard conditions that we typically add to all our recommendations that is once reviewed by the other city divisions resubmitting changes to staff or board for review and approval prior to the start of work or any agreement and finally if any changes are made that alter the information submitted resubmit those changes to the staff for review approval prior to start of work or in agreement thank you all very much any questions or comments from the board members any questions or comments from the audience if not I'm ready for a motion chair with regard to case number 08-760246-A, 246 South Hanover Avenue. I move that a certificate of appropriateness be granted with the provision of the two standard requirements and the two special requirements as you have already read into the record. do i have a second second any further discussion on the motion chair will call the question all those in favor of the motion say hi aye opposed nay motion passes and the certificate of appropriateness is as amended and conditioned is approved thank you very much uh turning now to our next application at 732 east high street uh the scope of work is construct a front yard patio So if the applicant's here. Kevin Patsy. All right. Just so you know, though, oh, sorry. I think we'll just go ahead and hear this one. Are you wanting to be heard, I assume? Pardon me? The staff has recommended disapproval of your application, I believe. Well, what you're looking at has been modified since that application was made. We've modified our plans. And I have some pictures kind of showing. Well, I think what we need to do then is open the case for a hearing. But I tell you what, there's another case that probably I can take care of more quickly. If I don't ask you to sit down, we'll come back to you in just a moment. All right, thank you. The next application is at 425-427 North Limestone. Scope of work is change openings, construct rear porches and stairs. Is the applicant here? Come on up. Hello, I'm Dudley Burke, the contractor. All right, Mr. Burke, how are you today? Fine, thank you. All right, so the staff has recommended approval of your application, subject to what I refer to as the standard two conditions, which I just previously read. Are you in agreement with those? Yes, I am. All right, do you have a question? Do I have any questions or comments from the board members? Any questions or comments from the audience? I believe then I'm ready for a motion. Chair, per case number 1160425-E at 425-427 North Limestone, I move that we approve this certificate of appropriateness as recommended by the staff with the two standard conditions all right do I have a second any discussion on the motion hearing none the chair will call the question all those in favor say aye aye opposed nay the motion passes and the COA as has conditioned is approved thank you all all right uh turning now to 601 arcadia park in the seven parks historic district is the applicant here yes i'm mike mckay i'm the owner at 601 mckay how are you today good how are you all good uh the staff has reviewed your application and his recommended approval subject to the standard two conditions that i have previously read into the record are you in agreement with those conditions yes okay any questions or comments from the board members uh any questions or comments from the audience all right hearing none uh the chair is ready for a motion chair with regard to case number zero zero five one zero six zero one g at 601 arcadia park i move that a certificate of appropriateness be approved with the standard two conditions all right do i have a second second any discussion on the motion hearing none the The chair will call the question. All those in favor say aye. Aye. Opposed, nay. Motion passes, and the COA is conditions approved. Good luck with your project. Thank you. Thank you. All right, we'll come back now to 732 East High Street. The show of work is construct a front yard patio. Let me briefly describe our procedure. We're going to have what we call a hearing on your request. Okay. and so i'm going to have the uh miss armstrong who's the staff member do her presentation first so that we ask questions of her then we can ask questions of you and hear discussion so this is the property at 732 east high street and um as um mr patsy has explained there was This is after the March 3rd ice storm, or windstorm of last year. There was some issues with KU having to do some work, which ended up using his front yard as sort of a demolition derby and putting some big trucks in there. So he decided this was his idea to landscape and to find some outdoor seating, which is what you see here. So when staff first encountered this, we noticed the circular pad that you see that's in brick in this location. And there was a sidewalk leading to the front entryway of the structure in this dirt area. in this particular location. Many, many years ago, this front porch was filled in, and also the whole backyard was paved, and it backs up to an alley. And it is, and you'll sort of, I can span out a little bit further. there's some going back here to that patty so there's essentially no backyard and this is a cut through to the alley that leads to sort of this area where Athenian Grill is the IBS bank next door is located and also connects back to Chase Bank back there there's sort of a rabbit warren of a little alley that this driveway goes to. And then the first proposal just sort of put the circular drive in and then after sort of rethinking they decided also wanting to connect. This front yard didn't have a walkway leading to the East High Street and so they've now proposed to put a walkway leading to East High that connects the circular patio area and then leads to the front of the structure. Guidelines are included for your reference. Stand finds a proposal to construct a brick patio does not meet the design principle which states decks and patios and verandas are non-original additions to historic buildings. Should be designed as they are compatible as possible. When building a new deck or patio it should be placed at the rear or the side elevation. Deck and patios are not appropriate for placement of primary elevations. Additionally, the proposal does not meet addition 2-1-A which says patios should be located at the rear buildings. Staff recommends denial and of course Mr. Patsy is present. One thing I'm not clear on, is there going to be a sidewalk now to the front door? There will be from East High Street. Before it led just to the driveway. It's coming off East High Street now. Right, so the proposal now, so this location here was leading to the driveway. So now his proposal would be to install a new sidewalk that incorporates the patio space and then lead to the front door. Okay, so have you dealt specifically with the issue of sort of having an oval in the middle of the sidewalk? Well, again, I think our guidelines are sort of clear about patio spaces. So we- It's not exactly a patio, is it? Well, I think that's for the board to determine. All right. I just want to make sure that your application and your recommendations specifically pertain to this drawing. Well, this is a 15-foot circular area. Okay. All right. Okay. One piece of clarification, perhaps, that I need to ask Ms. Armstrong back on your point about, so now is there going to be another walk built back to arrive at the front door? Because the picture we're seeing, there's nothing going toward the front door currently. Right. All right, so the proposal now would be to create a walkway that leads to the front, to the East High Street. And so as you see your orientation, so this is East High. The pencil is where the driveway is. And this is where that is. So right now this is closed off with landscaping. He proposes to open that out and brick this back so it has a proper walkway to East High Street leading to the structure. So there have been some adjustments physically on site since you were out there at the start? He's not actually done anything more. This is his proposal to make this patio space work. But took up the paving that went from the driveway to the front door. Which was right. Well, no, there was never, yes, from the driveway to the front door. That's correct. So that was removed at the time you encountered the circular patio having been built. Correct. He had already removed from the front door out to the driveway, had been opened up as we see it here. Right. And Mr. Patsy can speak to this more because I think his intent first was to put that back connecting to the front door. I think if I may suggest your design is evolved in your proposal since the first site visit the staff made to your property we just stopped when I when I found out go ahead to the mic we needed a certificate we just stopped where we were yeah and and this is all dry laid I didn't want to do anything you know permanent but I have some pictures I don't know if you'd show that one picture of the front yard showing where we started with because they were the front was it was just I don't know if you can see there's just pavers right can you point at that you can see sort of the the shadow of oh but but the papers there were just papers they're parallel to the front foundation they entered just oh there there you are you can and they were just pavers and they had kind of just grown into the yard right they're like stepping stones right and our original plan was to have that kind of give it gives me a little spot because i have some other pictures that shows my backyard and well that was the only thing the staff wanted to kind of try to help get clarified and all we We would have to say if you're ready for his, Mr. Chair, or if you're ready for him to do his presentation. Why don't you go ahead, Sarah, why don't you go ahead and make your presentation off. I think we've heard part of it, but go ahead. You've heard most of it. I mean, I have a couple more pictures to show. That's looking from the back door to, you know, that's my view. And there's the back of the house. This, you know, if you know where Athenian Grill is, comes off of, I can't remember the name of that alley. Vanderpool alley and then of course there's a bank parking lot and you just kind of weave through to High Street and that's sort of cut off but that's that's so in terms of where the boundary of your backyard is do you have it is in that hardscape part of your backyard all it's all pavement it's all payment but do you own that pavement? Correct. Okay. Correct. And is yours a, is this an apartment or a single family? Um, I live upstairs and I rent the downstairs. Okay, so your driveway has to stay open. It's a shared driveway. The house next door also. Gotcha. Believe it or not, the garage in the back, they own half of that building. It just shares a roof. So you have more than one owner utilizing what we're seeing in your house? Yeah, if you see the doors, I mean, you know, like the walk-in doors, those are mine. And then where that siding is and the garage door, that's the next-door neighbor's. So your driveway and your rear yard, you have your use of it yourself, but so do others. Correct. I just am looking for understanding. Yeah, I was too. Okay. and this was a commercial office at one time in the back before me and that's why those parking it had been just serve I'll know it had been changed to that commercial use years before this became an h1 overlay so I grew up in the vicinity and I I do remember that property is a commercial first floor with a resident with an apartment above yeah but just wanted to get a for myself but particularly for the board members little to hear from you more what of what you just said to help clarify the challenges so anyway that's those are my thinking you know we were going to put the pad in and then we were going to integrate a sidewalk to the front door because that that say it's and it's been painted that looks kind of bad right there so the problem of course is that conventionally if you're going to have a sidewalk leading from the street it It should be just a straight sidewalk. Well, I was just going to replace what I had. You know, those pavers, I was just going to put the sidewalk from the driveway. Okay. I'm sorry. I'm confused. Are you going to have a sidewalk coming from the driveway or are you going to have it from the street? The original plan was not to come to the street. What is your plan now? The plan now is to have the sidewalk come to the street and pass through to the front door. okay as shown on your plan correct okay and like I say she didn't have that originally until I don't know well I have the of course that made no difference with the respect to the recommendation being made about staff they still disapprove all right do I have any questions or comments from the board members okay I do have just this is actually to the staff other buildings along this part of high street it turns to residential on the other side of this and do they have a similar pattern of sidewalks from street to front door? So the neighboring structure actually has parking in their front yard. They use that shared drive, and they have a little parking space there, just I think one spot, the neighboring, yeah, two small cars. And then the neighboring structures actually have access off the alley. so this is the only one that in that doesn't actually have a green backyard in some ways right but I'm asking the front yard pattern as you the front yard patterns all have front sidewalks leading from their front doors to East High Street okay is it they say knowing that street is a traditional residential street with sidewalks leading from the main sidewalk next to high street to the house there are no patios on any of them it's the traditional rhythm of just a pedestrian sidewalk from the public sidewalk up to their front doors the other houses on the block except for the house immediately next door which has a parking area in the front. Petite car parking spot. They do actually have a front lock. But much larger than a 15-foot round patio. But that predates. Keep in mind it predates the H-10. I understand. Just noting it for the record, because that kind of issue of people having arrived at paving for parking in the front prior to the districts, any of these districts being designated obviously has to be accepted as an existing condition but has consistently the idea of introducing parking under the H-1 process not been approved in any of the historic districts for parking or otherwise. So if a rectangular, or let's say if pavers were put in a non-round configuration and were laid so that there were 90 degree angles, whether or not they went to the driveway, to the side, or to the street in front, what would be the maximum width of that paved path allowed? Just broadly, as far as basic math on it, it would be held to be what is a traditional pedestrian sidewalk width, which in the old days were slightly more narrow than they are now because now they're done to allow handicap accessibility, So sidewalks now are currently somewhat wider, although on the private property, that's people's choice. So I'd say anything wider than 42 inches that would be greater than a traditional sidewalk. Yes, Ms. Hill. So my struggles here are that the guidelines talk about side and rear elevations, and that's not an option. and for me this feels more like a sidewalk design than a an isolated patio like one would have from the inside of a house just stepping out onto the patio and then back into the house so this is kind of a hybrid in some ways and then on top of the fact that the policies don't address the issue if you have no place to put such an expansion of sidewalk definition, which isn't actually defined specifically in the guidelines in terms of width and pattern, then this seems to me a hybrid that doesn't violate the policy. It just doesn't fit with the policy. It's, that's where my struggle is. I'd also like to make the comment that a lot of the patterns that are appropriate and beneficial to historic areas allows for semi-public space to be in the front of a building, as in a porch. and that that contributes greatly to the interaction between the street and a residential area because semi-private, semi-public areas allows for a lot of interaction and community interaction in a neighborhood area, and that's very well documented in historic neighborhoods. and I think that this would provide that as an option as far as the way this space is utilized. And in that light, I feel that it would be contributory to the historic pattern and nature of this area and not detrimental to it. so i see it as an acceptable and not it does not meet the letter of this guideline but because of the other as miss hill has stated there is not an option for a patio in the back or a private outdoor space in the back um i think that this is an acceptable design. I have some concern about making sure that we don't set up some kind of a precedent that will come back later and bite us, because there are, I know, other applications, one which was withdrawn, that was actually proposing the same thing. unless we're beginning to set up an exception that if there is backspace available for a patio that we would not approve a patio in the front yard i just don't i don't necessarily see it as a patio either i mean we keep calling it a patio patios are a little bit well okay i'll call it a bump out it's an extension of the sidewalk but i'm assuming there are going to be chairs and some kind of a I'm assuming you actually use it for sitting purposes. The idea was a place for me to sit out in the front yard when the weather's nice. Right. Which is the similar purposes of a front porch. I know. And of course this is the problem, you know, sometimes you have houses that have been modified. You lost your front porch when they turned it into the commercial. Exactly. Correct. So it's not a use that is at odds to the overall larger pattern. Let me give you another example just to make sure that we're not going to have a real problem. In Arcadia Park, there are a number of houses that do not have the traditional porches at all, that have very small, frankly unusable backyards. If patios were proposed for the front of those houses, are we setting up a standard which would allow patios to be used or created off a sidewalk? For example, you have the traditional sidewalk, and then you have off of it a seating area. Is that where we're going to be authorizing? Well, I know that landscape elements are all taken into consideration, but dry stacked patio pavers are not as impactful to the landscape as a built-up deck or a it has no vertical structure to it at all i also think that it is important that we take into consideration the livability of buildings that are within historic neighborhoods and And especially to promote the use of densely built out areas in our city, we want to advocate and promote the use of those spaces for residential use. And I see allowing something like this as a larger picture promotion of utilizing historic spaces and neighborhoods for residential, which is something we do want to promote. so I see that it is important to advocate things like that and that allows for the bigger picture of more people wanting to live in denser areas and and allowing well it also takes into account the rather unique characteristics of this house that's what I'm getting it yes it's very particular in that there is the entirety of the back and side space is shared space. Right. I think under those circumstances, I think if there is a motion to disapprove the staff's disapproval of the recommendation, we'll need to make some findings to that effect. And also, I now see what Brad's driving at. do we want an oval or do we want a rectangular space that's building off of the sidewalk that's going into the to the house I don't I do not see that that is important it's important okay and and I was I was not advocating a change I was just trying to determine if it was angular would that make a difference to the recommendation well it's kind of like in a way we're building off the sidewalk if you will it's a little bit easier to make this work within the guidelines if your sidewalk is going smack dab through the middle if you will of your rectangle oval whatever you want to call it but so that you have some sitting area but it still reads in a way like sidewalk does that make sense miss kerf i think i'm following that concept have you all thought about landscaping uh conditions that would include some landscaping if you are inclined to support approving this to something that would soften the presence of it. One thing that I think needs to be assured is that the next party who comes along and owns this property will not be able to park their Volkswagen on it. Right. And I can tell you that will happen. Well, but it's not even connected to the driveway. They won't mind. They'll just cut right on over and park on it. Well, there is landscaping indicated on your drawing. It's in existence. The photograph shows that there's landscaping. I'm just offering it as a topic for your consideration. And our original plan was to basically hide the hardscape from the street. That was the original plan. And I think that maybe another option is the landscaping along the edge of the driveway between the lawn and the driveway would also provide more privacy for you and from a shared the driveway that is a shared driveway and screen it from that side as well so that was the original plan we were just trying to work with the preservation society to find something that was acceptable to everybody. Have you all thought about fire pits tied to? They're just sitting there. They'll be moved. Well, I'm thinking about, I think you're heading into a territory that has the potential to affect a number of issues, and I know you know that. But I think that the historic neighborhoods in general, are not at a point that they're thinking that everybody should roast their hot dogs out in their front yard in a fire pit and i'm not so sure that the introduction of something like this will not open up some unintended issues they have every right to put a fire pit on their property anywhere they want as long as they don't construct it with materials that permanently give it a foundation and all that in which case they would need to come to the board not questioning whether or not you could tote over a metal fire pit box and you know set it out on your sidewalk tomorrow college kids have been cooking steaks on their porches and burning their porch cornices up with some regularity for decades but I just am not unaware and nobody else is either and weighing these matters that when you introduce an element that is intended to be a gathering spot as an outdoor patio in the front yard that is different from what has characteristically been the the design aspects of these historic properties in the years before I'm not saying vote yes vote no I'm just thinking out loud. Well I think it's complicated because as we pointed out there literally is no other place for the occupants of the south to entertain and to enjoy the outdoors if you will but at the same time I'm well aware of the fact that there are instances in Arcadia Park where we could have a a problem if we start authorizing this kind of a front yard gathering spot that's not a traditional porch so i'm i have reservations about approving this well i think that if a if a if a property has a traditional porch then that negates the argument that i had okay was that you have that that semi-public, semi-private space that is traditional to historic properties. It's your porch. That's precisely my problem in Arcadia. They do not have traditional porches at all, but there's very little backyard as well. And so there would be a desire, if you will, to convert the front yard into an outdoor living space with a pergola and a patio and you know that's my concern well but pergolas that's an entirely different thing because that has a vertical element to it this has no vertical element to it it is completely horizontal it is completely at grounds ground level that's completely different and and there is no proposal to install any type of permanent seating or features that make this rise up out of the ground so it becomes two-dimensional not three-dimensional and and I applaud the the social piece of it so many of our historic neighborhoods folks have retreated to their backyards and folks coming out more to be part of their neighborhood in public realm make our neighborhoods vibrant they make them safer I think they added dimension to them so this is the simplest kind of form using an expanded notion of sidewalk to be able put a chair on without any kind of three-dimensional impact on the yard at all but I do agree that a landscaping feature seems entirely appropriate and probably would be a preference of the owner also and what would that landscaping feature be I would think what is sketched on the sketch that we have okay would be entirely appropriate and beneficial to both us and even at a foot in height it would obscure the right and i think to make it abundantly clear there needs to be a separation between the driveway and this pet in this uh circular area you'll see along that as i see in in your drawing and that's what yes I think that needs to be incorporated into any specifically into our recommendations that there be that separation on the landscaping is there any need to think about if that's a year round green versus something that sheds its leaves does anybody feel strongly about that I wanted to screen it year-round I'm with you but then I'm not the one getting to vote. But I think that those sorts of things matter in terms of, you know, a year, around the year experience of it does make a difference to neighbors than it does just seasonally. We can incorporate the recommendations of non-dissidious shrubs, such as taxes, bushes, or the like. Right. Is that all right with you, sir? Yes. All right. That's absolutely. I'm surprised how strongly people feel about the front appearance of the properties in the historic districts. And I think we'll have some interesting comments, pro and con, on this along the way. Well, front yards are changing. I mean, there has been an evolution over the past 20 years with people now routinely and regularly converting their whole front yard into gardens. Yes. And also sitting areas. We get calls about that periodically. for and against. Oh, I know. It's a controversial issue. We're the center for what's in vogue at the moment. Well, I know 30 years ago, we have flat out said you could not do that. And I know now that, you know, things have evolved. And so that, you know, I've seen people actually sit on their front sidewall in their little garden area that's in the front yard. So I think it's an evolving standard, if you will. So the concern that we have to make sure and address it properly, Ms. Kerr, is that we don't let this turn into a parking spot. That would be, that really would be detrimental to the character of the neighborhood. So I think so long as we have an evergreen buffer that's going to be quasi-permany, not going to be easy to dig up or run over, that I think we're avoiding that issue. And of course, then you're going to sign a pledge and live there for the next 45 years. Right, yeah. So- Well, I would like for us also to be mindful of what is on the border of this property. Across the street, you've got more concrete than grass in some cases. One house is practically on the sidewalk. Oh, yes. That's a small one there. And you've got a side yard. Yes. So if you were proposing this in the middle of Ashland Avenue, I think there would be more of an issue in terms of its neighbors. In this particular case, the immediate neighbor on one side already has a paved area much larger than this, regardless of when it was put in. And across the street, what you're doing will not detract from anything that's across the street, nor can it be duplicated. Correct. And I think that given the should someone else come along and ask for the same thing, for them to fit into this shoe that you have is highly unlikely because of the side and their rear situation. So in that regard, I agree that you should be allowed to do this. Looking at your proposal, I'm noticing that you've got some buffering that's on the immediate to the right and left. It looks like you've got a code like 1, 2. What are those going to be? What kind of landscaping? Next to the pencil or the other side? At the top, towards the street. I think that's the street. What specifically are those? No, I'm saying next to your porch. oh that's actually uh the ubc bank it's just a that's that's our an established hedge okay all right okay he was wondering what this is gonna that's what i'm talking about what's what are those you want to pull up that photograph of amelia it's real it shows the land there it is Oh, I forgot. Yeah, like I say, the original plan, that we were going to reestablish a sidewalk, because the postman always comes down the driveway and goes. And so what do you have there, Buckswoods? That's what we have in there right now. But I say the idea was to get a hedge that would be high enough. Probably larger Texas bushes would work better. So the taller hedge belongs to the property to your east, to the commercial office. Yes, yes, that's UPSP. that was my perception but i just wanted to be sure and they have a break area out front which i'm sure you all have seen that on the corner but used to be one of the best restaurants in town which is gone but yeah also used to have a fabulous victorian house on it oh yeah i remember ages ago true well don't go too ages over that's because i remember it all right so i think we may have worked our way to a concession or a consistence Chair, if you have reached a consensus, I've already prepared some alternative findings from what the staff has prepared if somebody wants them for a motion. Yeah, I think we're going to have to work on that too. Okay. Well, I have that prepared whenever I can get that. For some reason, your microphone, I just cannot hear you. I'll just hold on to it like this. How about that? I have the findings prepared for somebody who would like to make the motion. I can happily bring that up to you. Thank you. Not used to this much help. Suzanne I think it's gonna be your emotion okay okay give her a moment let's give Suzanne a moment just to look at the handwriting and make sure that you're in agreement or is that going to be your your legal verbiage as to why the alternative finding I'll take care of it all right thank you Thank you. All right. I think we're ready for a motion. Can I ask one question? Absolutely. Counsel? Is there any need to make the statement or that all side and back property area for this particular property is fully shared and they have no private space in the back or the side of their property as a specific condition to this property. You can certainly add that as a basis for your findings. I thought I had said something about the shared driveway, but you can add that as well. That's perfectly fine. Okay. And frankly, that tightens it up even more. Good idea. Okay. Okay. All right. Go for it. All right. Chair, with respect to case number 09290732-D at 732 East High Street, I move for approval of the request for Certificate of Appropriateness. Because the request fits design guideline 111.4, which states that sidewalks should be compatible with the surrounding historic properties, The sidewalk is compatible because a neighboring property already includes paving in the front yard from the public street to the front door. and this particular property has the unique situation of a shared driveway and a rear area that is essentially a shared driveway and alleyway. The sidewalk is also dry laid and flushed to grade. the approval is conditioned upon the following condition one provide final details and specifications to staff for review and approval prior to the issuance of a coa and to resubmit any changes to staff or board for review and approval prior to the start of the work and three no parking shall be allowed along the sidewalk or the extended hardscape area or in the front yard I mean that it's not just being we don't want anybody just parking on unpaved pavement either and can it's essentially a no parking in the front yard I have a quick question did I hear actually that's against the ordinance anyway well it is it's until you look next door did I hear a reference in there and I can't remember in your draft to the square of parking next door as a the reference is for that the surrounding historic properties have a sidewalk compatible to this pattern of having a sidewalk from the public street to the front door. Meaning the sidewalks only? You're not saying that because of the paved parking next door? I am not saying that the paved parking next door influences this decision in any way. Thank you. And if you have one additional condition about landscaping and the final condition being that there be landscaping placed between the driveway and the lawn and between the lawn and the front public sidewalk all right do I have a second can I oh you're please second I did have a question about construction method when you're ready Go ahead. Is the sidewalk itself to be dry laid in addition to the patio? Yeah. And I think that's already been stated in the motion. Be clear of that. Okay. Yeah. I thought I heard it says it is, and I just wanted to be sure that's his intent. Okay. I have a motion and a second. Any further discussion on the motion? Hearing none, the chair will call the question. All those in favor of the motion say aye. Aye. Aye. Opposed, nay. The motion passes and the COA as conditioned is approved. Very nice presentation, sir. Thank you. Good luck with your project. Thank you. Take care. All right. I believe we have reached the end of all our applications. Do we have any minutes to approve? I don't think we have any minutes, so I believe we're... We should, but we might not. I don't think we do. We did not receive any. In that case, you don't. Okay. All right, then. Are we ready for a motion for adjournment? So moved. Do I have a second? Second. Without objection, we stand adjourned. Thank you. Thank you so much. Thank you. The End Because there's no nicer witch than you Because it's a witchcraft That wicked witchcraft