# Council Planning Committee - June 16, 2009 > Auto-transcribed civic record · Council · June 16, 2009 - **Permalink**: https://meetings.lexingtonky.news/meeting/951 - **Source video**: https://lfucg.granicus.com/player/clip/951?view_id=14&redirect=true - **Date**: 2009-06-16 - **Body**: Council - **Last revised**: June 17, 2026 - **Length**: 15,597 words > ⚠️ **Auto-generated content.** Audio from the official Granicus video was auto-transcribed by OpenAI Whisper-1. Structured facts were extracted with GPT-4o; the narrative summary was written by Anthropic Claude Sonnet. Speaker labels and verbatim wording may contain errors. See [methodology](https://meetings.lexingtonky.news/about/methodology) or [report a correction](mailto:editor@lexingtonky.news). --- ## Meeting Overview The Lexington-Fayette Urban County Council Planning Committee convened on June 16, 2009, at 1:00 PM, with CM Gorton presiding over the session. The committee addressed three agenda items during the meeting, covering a range of planning and development matters. The agenda included an informational presentation on the Loudon Ave Widening Project, as well as action items related to the Downtown Master Plan and Items Referred to Committee, both of which were approved. A total of three votes were taken during the meeting, and no public comments were heard. ## Attendance All ten council members were present at the June 16, 2009 Council meeting. No members were recorded as absent or late. **Members Present:** - Gorton - Blues - Gray - Ellinger - James - Lawless - Beard - Feigel - Stinnett - McChord ## Votes and Decisions Three votes were taken during the June 16, 2009 Council meeting. - **Downtown Master Plan – Forward to Full Council** [timestamp: 1:34:29]: Lawless moved, and Blues seconded, a motion to forward to the full council a request to adopt the downtown master plan. The motion passed on a roll call vote of 8–1. Voting in favor were Gorton, Blues, Gray, Ellinger, Lawless, Beard, Feigel, and Stinnett. James cast the sole dissenting vote. - **Extended Stay Zoning Ordinance Text Amendment – Removal** [timestamp: 1:38:09]: A motion to remove the Extended Stay Zoning Ordinance Text Amendment was seconded by James and passed by voice vote. No individual vote counts were recorded. - **Adjournment** [timestamp: 1:40:49]: A motion to adjourn passed by voice vote. No individual vote counts were recorded. ## Contested Items - **Adoption of the Downtown Master Plan** — The council voted on a motion to adopt the Downtown Master Plan, which generated debate among members regarding the respective authority of the Downtown Development Authority (DDA) and the role of the council in the plan's adoption. The specific points of contention centered on how decision-making power was distributed between these two bodies in relation to the plan. The motion ultimately passed by a vote of 8 in favor and 1 against. ## Loudon Ave Widening Project [timestamp: 02:42] CM James provided a brief update to the Council on the status of the Loudon Avenue Widening Project. According to James, the project is nearly complete, with two remaining items outstanding before it can be considered fully finished: the Warfield Place entrance walls and a final punch list. Key speakers on this item included CM James and Gorton. The discussion was informational in nature, with no formal action taken or vote recorded. The update served to keep the Council apprised of the project's progress as it moves toward completion. ## Downtown Master Plan [timestamp: 06:05] The committee took up the Downtown Master Plan as the second agenda item, focusing on the status of 16 recommendations contained within the plan and the question of whether the council should move forward with formally adopting it. Key speakers in the discussion included Gorton, Lawless, James, Blues, Beard, and McChord. The conversation centered on the current standing of the plan's 16 recommendations and what steps would be required to bring the plan to adoption. Specific details of individual recommendations and any concerns raised by speakers are not reflected in the available record, but the discussion addressed the path forward for the plan as a whole. Following the discussion, a motion was made to move forward with adopting the Downtown Master Plan. The motion was approved by the committee. ## Items Referred to Committee [timestamp: 1:37:39] The Council took up Agenda Item 3, covering various items referred to committee. The primary matter discussed during this portion of the meeting was the removal of the Extended Stay Zoning Ordinance Text Amendment from the agenda. Key speakers during this item included Gorton and James, who participated in the discussion surrounding the referred items. The Council addressed the handling of the Extended Stay Zoning Ordinance Text Amendment, which was pulled from consideration at this time. The item was ultimately approved by the Council. --- ## Decisions - **Motion** — passed (8-1): Motion to move forward to the full council a request to adopt the downtown master plan - **Motion** — passed (0-0): Motion to remove Extended Stay Zoning Ordinance Text Amendment - **Motion** — passed (0-0): Motion to adjourn --- ## Full transcript Items in committee, and some of those are, uh, council members have asked for some of the items to be taken out, so, um, the first item which we have a written update on the Louden Avenue widening project. And I'm looking at Council Member James because, um, uh, I know this is a written update and, um, t-, uh, correct me if I'm a little off base on this, but I think this project is almost finished except for working out the wall, the Warfield Place wall issue and the punch list. Yeah. N- pretty standard as far as the punch list is concerned. That's, you know, normal process. The only kind of just a tiny hurdle, um, has to do with the walls and they are working it out through the neighborhood association, but there was an initial design and plan for the walls or an idea at least of where the walls would be. Um, these are historic walls that the neighborhood wanted to be sure remained and then when the actual work was done, there was no place for the walls, so they've really been working with the community, the neighborhood there, the neighborhood association, the residents along Warfield Place to make sure that what they do is respectful and in consideration with what the neighbors wanted. So it is being worked on. I feel like that there will be a near completion very soon or that we're near completion. I think it's all gonna work out fine. We'll just continue to work together with engineering to make it happen. Very good. Are, are you comfortable then with this being the final written report to our committee? Um, I would prefer that we see, that we see a final, hear a final decision on when the Warfield Place entrance wall is complete. I don't wanna leave it out there dangling without a place to report to. Do we know if that'll be a month or a year or? I don't know. Okay. Well, w- I'll probably ask them. Our next meeting won't be until after, after break, I think, August, so we'll ask them to come back and give us a progress report. How's that sound? Hopefully, yeah, hopefully, the next meeting after break will be the final report. All right. Very good. Thank you. Thank you so much. Um, and there is, just to let everyone know, the, uh, we've, uh, not been able to get the agenda loaded onto the electronic screen, so, um, if you, uh, wish to speak, just raise your hand and I'll put you on the list and get to everyone. Um, the next item is the downtown master plan. And what I thought we would do is, um, we're going to get a status report. There's 16 recommendations in the master plan. And we wanted to get a quick status report. Some of them have been implemented, some are in the works. Um, and we'll also get kind of a brief, um, overview of the form-based building guidelines because this issue is one of the issues that the joint planning commission j- uh, planning committee will, um, address in its joint meeting on June the 30th. So this will kinda be a prequel to that. And, um, we'll get into depth. I know that Chris King has some good things planned for June the 30th for, uh, at 9:00. It's June 30th, uh, joint planning meeting or workshop is at 9:00 AM. And so with that, Chris, if you want to give us whichever order you'd like to do these. Um, form-based building guidelines first, or maybe status on the 16 recommendations first. It, it's up to you. What would be- It- Oh, Paul, you're, Paul- Well. You have a comment? Yeah. Under B, under the status recommendations, as you're aware, Harold can't be here today. Yes. I have distributed status, and I'm not sure as of what date, but, uh, uh, this is a 18 or so page document. The first page is, is this, is the, um, recommendation right from the plan, and then following that is a status of each of the recommendations. So there has been some, some work on, on all of the recommendations. In fact, one has been completely implemented, the creation of the parking authority. Yes. That being said, I, I think either myself or Chris or, or Barb, somebody could probably address your questions. But rather than giving you a full presentation, I would suggest that, uh, you, if you have any questions, we can try to address them today. But the more appropriate thing may be for Harold to give a presentation at the August meeting. He's prepared after, after today's meeting to, to make himself available for each of the planning committee meetings for the rest of the year. Um, Council Member James and then Council Member Lawless, do you have a question about the agenda? I do. I, um, I was not aware that Harold Tate was not gonna be here today. And I don't ... Was this unexpected or did I miss an email or something? He had conflicting meetings. Yeah, he had, he had a conflict. Mm-hmm. Okay. Thanks. That's all I have. We found that, I found that out last week when we had this on the agenda. So, um, did you have a question about the agenda? Um, well, I'm not sure if it's about the agenda or about my thoughts on the downtown master plan since I was the one that brought this forward. Um, and it was placed on the agenda a month ago. So- Mm-hmm. ... I'd like that clarified. Um- Why don't you give us your thoughts on the master plan and then we'll hear from Chris on- Okay. ... form-based. Um, the downtown master plan was adopted by the planning commission. Yes. But as a whole, it was never adopted by the council. So I did a lot of work on how we could make some of these things, rather than suggestions or whatever, what kind of ordinances would need to be put in place to m- make sure that they moved forward. Um, I then came to the conclusion that it might be a better approach to pass a resolution to adopt the downtown master plan in its entirety and move that forward to the full council for a vote and then take the time to look at what kind of ordinances would also give it some teeth. Does that make sense? It does make sense. Okie dokie. I think this committee- I love to make sense. Yeah, it makes good sense. Um, this committee hasn't reali- it, we've looked at it, uh, once and I thought the update would be good because some of these are implemented. Yes, they- And I thought it might be good for the committee to know the status of, um, different, uh, recommendations. Yes, and I think an update on what- Mm-hmm. But still, we can still pass a resolution to adopt the downtown master plan in its entirety as the planning commission did as a council. So that would be a resolution. And then we can work toward any ordinances that may need to be put in place to, uh, assure and ensure that those things happen if, if they- Any other comments? ... if they're needed. On the agenda or the- On the subject. ... idea? Just on the subject. Now, now, okay. Just on the subject. Yes, on the subject. I'm wondering during the package, shouldn't that be part of the item itself? And then- Excuse me, what? Shouldn't that be part of the 16 items ourselves as a committee at some level before we send it to the council? Well, we could, but the downtown master plan, just like the, uh, bike and pedestrian master plan and other master plans that have been put together, um, have been adopted in their entirety. So- By doing such, um, all we're saying is, we're following the planning commission and as a council, adopting the downtown master plan that, you know, hundreds of thousands of hours and dollars were spent putting together. And that the planning commission itself has adopted in its entirety. I still have to have all those meetings. I did not agree with the decisions made at the, the Ram Rock situation ******. Speak. Is there a mic on ******? Can you use your microphone, Ju- Your microphone. Thank you. I was doing eye to eye and I, I said I was at all the council, all, all of the master plan meetings. And Harris N. Gross was the, uh, the consultants and they, they had an agenda which they pretty much rammed down everybody's throats and nobody seemed to want to stand up to them, whatsoever. And, um, so there are many, many issues in, embedded in that master plan which just won't work in Lexington. For a lot, for a lot of reasons. And I think we need to determine what those are before we give our stamp of approval to them. Uh, Council member Beard, one of the reasons I asked Chris King to give an overview of the form-based building guidelines, which is one of the- Right. ... recommendations was because I thought what might help us get to where council member Lawless wants to go, is if we could see the update, know what we've done, and then have a brief overview of each recommendation. We might be ready to adopt- That may be the case, but I- Mm-hmm. That was the part I wasn't getting- Mm-hmm. ... was the brief overview part. Yeah. That, uh, for instance, we've come to an agreement on one way streets as to how we might phase that in and as we go along, step by step, and at some point we may decide that that's enough or- Mm-hmm. ... we're going to the next step. But if we go back and do this, it says, "Convert all one way streets to, uh, two way." And all is the operative word in there that, that bothers me. Well, that was within the, the boundary that was defined as the down, that covered- Right. ... the downtown master plan. I understand. Okay. Council member James, you had your hand up. Yeah, this, e- as I've been, since I've been on council, done a lot of looking at the role of DDA and established by article 40 of our court, code of ordinances, the DDA is an authority. So I'm really concerned about, you know, we talk a lot about micromanaging and, and I think we had a similar conversation when Gary Means presented about the parking authority, and what role do we have as council when we've given, um, an authority to an entity to do something and I don't... I wanna make sure that if something's been passed through planning commission, um, i- is it really our role as a council to vet each one of these items or does that authority then have the power to move forward with blue sheet processes and everything that's been set forth in our charter, um, that in our code of ordinances that allow us to just allow that entity to move forward. I just, I, I feel like everybody's saying they're waiting on one or the other, but I think that the article 40 is very clear and establishes DDA as an authority and I don't know, I don't know what people are waiting on. I can't, I can't really figure it out and I don't know if we're having a conversation about something that is not really within our authority at this juncture to, to converse about. Well, it's sure more- Well, one is the- ... in our authority than it is, um, the DDAs I think, at this point. We don't know exactly what level they're a development authority or not. I'm not sure exactly what development means, as relates to the creation of the, of the Downtown Development, uh, Authority. Have you read the article 40 of the code of ordinances? It's- At- ... it lays it out very clear. ... some point I have, yes. Uh-huh. It lays it out pretty clear and it's everything that's established within the master plan. Mm-hmm. So they've... I feel as if my interpretation and maybe we need a legal interpretation, but I feel as if the processes they're going through, same as parking authority, they are given that responsibility, then their process is then to bring items individually, um, through a blue sheet process, the administrative process which is declared by our council rules, to bring that item forward. And at that time, then we vet each one of those items, but to micromanage an issue because we feel like we have the right to do that, I think this is one of the cases where we clearly, by the establishment of that article, um, I think it's section 2-4-22 or something, we don't really have that. I don't think we have that authority. So it's pretty clear and we can bring that forward and review that, but I'm concerned first of all that we are, we're here without the person that's the executive director of that authority talking about the situation and we're gonna have to talk about this again, and, and we have a lot of s- things, other items in planning committee that we could be discussing if, is this gonna take up another meeting in August or September when we could be using that time for something else? Well, I think it's certainly up to any item that a council member moves into committee. This committee can decide what it wants to do with it. That's why this is on the agenda today, is that Council Member Lawless moved it into committee. I guess my first question would be to ask if the committee wants to do anything with the update. Um, do you wanna know, I mean, this is the report of the update. And some of these things are done without us, uh, adopting the master plan, because they are moving forward on their own. And, um, so I guess that, that is an important question. And I saw Council Member Feigl, and then ... We've got Feigl, McCord, Stennet, Ellinger, may be Council Member Feigl. Um, obviously, this, I'm coming in on the tail end of this process. I guess it's been going on for quite some time. But it would just seem logical to me that the committee would take, uh, a more detailed look at it, particularly if it was going to impact, uh, ordinance changes. And I mean, if in fact, we're going to create ordinances to make this, um, enforceable, then I would think that would be the job of this committee, is to kinda consider those ordinances before it went to council to pass as a total package. Thank you. Council Member McCord? I'm gonna let Council Member Stennet speak first, a- and then I, I'll follow up to what he has to say. Council Member Stennet. Thank you, Chair. I guess my main concern is, looking down this list, i- is how we're gonna implement this list. Because for instance, the, you know, the fourth one, increase residential housing units in downtown, well, what's that mean? I mean, a- is it a thou- we need a thousand more units? And once we get 1000, is our goal met? And we need to have measurable goals on each one of these, um, in, in order to feel some sense of accomplishment as we go along. So, I mean, I, I kinda am leaning like what Julian said, maybe we need to go through each one of these and vet out what our goal is for each one of these. I mean, just to say, you know, change land use, well, what properties really need to be changed downtown? Do we have a running inventory? Do we have a list? I mean, there's a lot of these issues, um, that, that we definitely need to vet. And I mean, create a community center museum for the history of the East End neighborhood. Is that the Lyric? Have we already done that one? I mean, we need to be able to check off the list and go down 'em, and I, I don't think we've really done that ever as a group, a- a- as a body, to go through the list like that. So I mean, that would be my preference, but, um, I'll be open to those ideas and suggestions. Council Member McCord, are you ready? Well, I, I just wanna e- echo that, but I also wanna, uh, compliment, uh, Council Member Lawless, because, you know, a- as we've seen, this, this is sort of the trap that we fall into, is that we, when we get into situations, uh, like Centre Point, where a lot of people reference the Downtown Master Plan as, "Well, it goes against that." Well, it's not really been adopted. And so, it's not that it goes against it. And, and I think that what we said the other day, about, from the outside agencies when we reported out, that with our, with the DDA, one of the problems that we've got is, is that they, in some ways, they're not really an authority, they're more of an advisory. And this document is really evidence of that, because it's, uh, it's ... These are advisory measures, but there's no real authority to this. And so, uh, I think there's, there's some sort of compromise, but in, in where we're going, I think Council Member Lawless and, and Council Member Beard are both right. You know, a- and as I look down at this list, um, number 10, develop Vine Street, well, I've been on that for, that committee for, for quite a while, and the moment you float one picture of what, what that might look like, all of a sudden, people say, "Oh, well, that can't work." Or, "Why would you do this, that and the other?" So I think there, what needs to happen is, uh, Madam Chair, is, i- in some way, we as, as a planning committee, need to, uh, press the full council, uh, to, to recognize that we have a fatal flaw. We have a Downtown Development Advisory Document that really does not have a lot of teeth to it, uh, that we want some sort of guiding document. And to Council Man Beard and Council Man Stennet's point, um, we need someone, whether it be us or, or a combination of us and, and folks, uh, inside and outside of government, helping to define these 16 and when we know that we've done a good job with this. So, m- my point is, is, um, I understand and appreciate what we're trying to do here. We just need to find a way to bring it to the full council and then push for us to, to dig in this a little deeper. Um, because just recommending it and saying, "We're gonna adopt it," I, I think that kind of falls short and it sets us up for a lot of problems, but getting into the minutiae of each one of these, um, may also cause a lot of problems, and then, and put us out into the weeds. But I do think that it's, uh, it's extremely important to recognize, through the budget discussion, that this is why we had a problem with DDA, was, there's no real authority to do any of this. And, and so we have to, I think, create a policy that, that defines that authority. Thank you, Madam Chair. Mm-hmm. Council Member Ellinger? Thank you, Chair. I guess I just wanna know, um, was Harold supposed to come in today and give us an update on each one of these? 'Cause I would like to find out where we stand on each one. Are we gonna wait 'til the 30th then on that? Or, is it, we're trying to figure out today? We, we asked Harold to come, and he said he could not come. And the 30th is not a day when we will be going through all of these. The 30th, at our joint workshop, if those of you who were there recall, we are going, we wanted to ask UK to come present their master plan and be in on the conversation about, um, the town gown planning issues, and then the, uh, form-based, um, code, form-based guidelines. Those are the two issues on our joint, uh, workshop. So, um, and I guess really, um, d- does that answer your question? It does. I'm just, I think it's important that we just kind of figure out where we stand on each one of these to know- Yes. ... where we're headed with 'em, and what's been done and what needs to be done. Yes. And I'm not quite sure on each one where we do stand on 'em. Mm-hmm. And I think at some point, it will be helpful for Chris to, uh- ... um, talk to us about the significance of the planning commission accepting the master plan and what that means or doesn't mean. Um, so- Madam Chair, I wanted to respond to Council Member Ehlinger's comment. It, just, uh, I, I think that you need to know that when we had, uh, one of the breakout pieces of, of the outside agency, I, we asked that direct question, "Where do we stand on each one of these?" And we didn't get any kind of real hard and fast answer. It was, "Well, we're working on number one, we're working on number two." And so, I agree with you 100%. It, it, there really needs to be, uh, from the DDA, a defined, here's where we are on this particular one. But we didn't get a very satisfactory answer and that's part of the reason why we had the discussion the other day during the budget link. But I just wanted to let you know, that question was asked directly to them. Council Member Lawless, and then Martin, and then James. Um, I think from my perspective, and what I hear and have heard for the last three years is, um, and part of it was sparked with the Center Point, uh, controversy, is that like many other master plans, they aren't hard and fast, we'll have X number of this by this date, but they are overall, um, it's an overall, overarching plan for our downtown, which we do not have and have not adopted as a council. So my thoughts on it, and like I say, I was... I did a lot of digging about how we can make ordinances that will have teeth, that will help implement some of these things. And some of them won't need no ordinances nor... and are vague. You know, you're right. Uh, increase residential development. You know, what's that mean? Two houses, 20 houses, 50 condos? So there, there, they are vague, um, suggestions, but if you read the entire downtown master plan, it has a lot of, uh, really good recommendations about what we want our city to look like. What do we want and how are we gonna get to that point where we have an overarching plan and vision for the future of our community, and how do we get there? And for some of those, there, there would be ordinances. So by ex- moving a resolution to adopt the downtown master plan, um, as a council, I think it will, first of all, send a message to the community that has been crying out for the council to do something to guide us in some way. And two, it's not a law. Um, it won't mean, you know, 640 people have to live downtown by 2010. Um, but it is a, uh, simply a guidepost for us about the vision for how we move forward and have some kind of plan that we can refer to as we look at, are there ordinances that need to be changed? What do we need to look at with the form-based guidelines? Who needs to be doing those? Because they're really not getting... A lot of these things aren't getting done or they're getting done by this person or that person. There's not a... So I think it would speak volumes to our community that we, as a council, are paying attention, that we do want an overarching plan, and that maybe each of us won't agree with each and every one of them. That doesn't mean that they become law. It's a resolution to adopt the, the downtown master plan that many, many developers, architects, planners, uh, private citizens, engineers, um, property owners, were all at the table working on this for a very, very, very long time and now it's been sitting on a shelf. Um, the 16 recommendations are just a, a small part of this, but it would give us an opportunity to send a message to the community that, yes, we as a council do have the political will and the vision to adopt something like this. We can always change pieces and parts, and there may be parts that ordinances will then come forward out of this committee. So I still would like to make a motion that we adopt the downtown master plan that e- everybody has been talking a lot about for three or four years. Two years? I think so. Yep. Okay. But it was worked on for quite a bit before that, so that was when it was finalized. Um, we're never gonna have an overall master plan for, uh, pedestrian and bike paths, as we've recently noticed. Uh, we're never gonna have, uh, 100% buy-in to anything, but this is something that a lot of citizens, a lot of government people, and a lot of council people spent a great deal of time and money putting forth and was adopted by our planning commission. And I, I feel like it's important that we adopt it as a resolution. And again, that's just sending a message forward. And then we can look at maybe some committees to look at ordinances that would need to be adopted to make it come to fruition. We can possibly also look at getting somebody, DDA or planning or somebody, to come up with measurable goals and objectives, which we do not have on most of these recommendations. And so that's my motion. Do I hear a second? Will you repeat your motion? My motion is that we, um, a- adopt a resolu- we move forward to the council a resolution to adopt the downtown master plan in its entirety as a resolution, not as an ordinance. Now I still have Council Member Martin and Council Member James and Council Member Beard on the list, and I still, we still need to hear from Chris about the planning commission's action on this. So, Council Member Martin. Thank you, Madam Chair. It being my first meeting of the council's planning committee, uh, uh, I- I'm- I don't wanna get- Let's see. ... into too much, because I'm, I mainly wanna listen to find out where we are. Um, but I, I have some experience in, in long-range planning. And, uh, I worked on, uh, Kentucky's first economic development long-range plan and I wrote the Philharmonic long-range plan last year. And the, um, the, the downtown master plan is a concept piece. It is not a strategic plan and it's not a, an action plan. It is a visionary tool to help us understand what the things are and, and why the DDA thinks that these are good things that are good for Lexington. Uh, and so I ... My, my personal thought is that, uh, the, the council needs to first decide if it wants to adopt the master plan, and if so, to do so, so that the DDA has marching orders that this is what the council, uh, wants and it expects the DDA to go do. But beyond that, um, I thi- I think the, um, a, a, a more strategic document could be developed which uses these 16, uh, recommendations as the, the goals and, and various strategies and tactics can be, uh, developed which would, would be designed to achieve those goals. What, what do we have to do to change land use? I think there, there are ... Th- this is just the, the bare skeleton on a, a larger framework, a very large piece of work, and there are many other components that go under each of these. And, uh, but I think in order to, to give them, um, uh, the direction that this is the direction that the council wants to go, we need to first adopt the framework, and then maybe work to, to, uh, put some more, um, more information in here. Uh, what you'd see in a str- strategic plan is, well, to change land use, what will we have to do? There might be five big things that we would do, and then four or five things under those things, each of those things, that, that you'd wanna try to accomplish in order to really put that into effect. Once you adopt a downtown master plan, you could co- uh, and, and, and work beyond this sort of visionary, um, uh, instrument into a more practical, hands-on, on, uh, strategic document. You could put timelines and, uh, and action items and assign staff and, and to do all kinds of things in order to, uh, um, to direct resources and to accomplish various things. So I think that, I think that's what folks want is they wanna know, uh, when folks ... We're saying, "Well, where's the teeth?" Really it's, "Where's, where's the rest of it?" And so this is a skeletal document and if this in fact is w- was what the, the planning committee, uh, wants to do, commission, planning committee wants to do, um, then, then, uh, you know, that would certainly start, uh, be the starting point to a larger effort to, um, uh, to put some meat on the bones and to, to decide how these things get done, because each of these items are a huge task, and so, um, uh, those are just my comments and, uh, thank you, Madam Chair. You're welcome, and welcome. You're welcome to visit anytime. Um, Council Member James- Thank you. ... and then Council Member Blues, Beard- Thank you. ... excuse me. Thank you, Madam Chair. Um, Sarah passed out, um, to everyone that Article 40 I mentioned, which goes back to, um, this is I guess 2001 is when the DDA was created, and this is the sections related to the DDA. And I think if you take a moment to look through this, you'll see that they are an authority. Uh, I think Council Member McCord was on point when he said they're acting as an advisory, especially where we're considering each one of these items and feel like that we can vote on each one of these items. I'm not saying that I would not like the ability to do that. I'm just saying by their authority it is ni- nowhere in here does it say, "Take all these ideas to council and see if they pass before you start bringing them forth through an administrative process." Um, so I think we just need to be clear. Um, Council Member Stennet mentioned something about the... one of the recommendations had to do with an African American museum or center or something like that. Um, I will state DDA has not assisted as far as... since I've been on council, has not assisted with the Lyric Theater at all. So if that's one of their projects, um, if they're considering that, there's been no communication as such that that was a project of DDA. So I don't know where they're planning, um, a African American center or museum or whatever it takes, you know, because they've not been involved, um, in the Lyric process at all, um, and at a time when we really need them. It'd be great to have them on our side, but they're, they haven't participated at all. Um, but I wanted to get some clarity, um, ask Chris Keen to step forward because, Chris, you're one of the folks I know that have been in planning for quite a while, and, um, you... Tell me what went on back in 2001, um, when this was established and the, and the relevancy, and I'm only saying this, it's rel- it's relevant. Let me bring the relevancy to the motion, um, to everyone, because I think, um, I may have to vote no on the master plan, um- ... if it goes against giving someone authority to do something. So, I may have to vote no on that. So, I'm trying to get clarity on whether we need to do this. I know there are processes that go through planning commission that don't ever come to council and don't need to come to council, except for when it's a blue sheet process related to that specific item. So, tell me a little bit about the establishment of the authority and whether, through this establishment, it's appropriate for us as a committee to be voting on something of which they have the authority to do. With all due respect, Council Member James, I don't know that I can answer that question. Um, but let me... Um, at the time the DDA was created, I was, uh, almost an interested bystander, spectator from, uh, my position of employment, uh, division planning. I was working on the rural land management plan and PDR program primarily in my job duties at that time. Um, but my recollection is that there was a decision that in order to finally move forward a lot of the things that, um, needed to be done for downtown... Downtown has always been a focus. And there had been numerous studies, there had been numerous task force processes, all those kinds of things, but no agency directly tasked to work downtown. And my understanding was that, um, uh, that the DDA was created to be that agency, much like we've talked about a CDC for, uh, the East End and central sector, a group that's dedicated to that area, the problems of that area, the opportunities of that area, and given authority to work within that area. And that is my understanding of why the DDA was created and given the charter that it was. Okay, so very similar to the parking authority as well. Do you... Are you familiar with how that functions? Only vaguely, but- but generally. Generally the same? But again, the- the appropriateness of how the council may interact with that, um, or adopt plans, I- I really... Maybe someone from law could better answer that. Okay. But I can certainly clarify to anyone's, uh, interest the DDA plan process and how that related to the update of the comprehensive plan and how those things happened. Okay. I'd be glad to do that, if that's of interest to the committee. Someone may want to ask that later. At this point, I'd prefer t- to not. Thank you, though. Thank you. I will sit down. Thank you. Um, and maybe I just need help in figuring out, what do we plan to accomplish by passing this? Like, what- what is our intention and what do we expect to happen if we do adopt this? And if we don't adopt it, what do we expect to happen? 'Cause I think if we don't adopt it, we still expect, because it's been through the planning commission process, that those things will still be pursued. There's already committees working on that. I don't know what a vote from us does in this case. If it's a make it, break it, let me know that that's what it is. If it's gonna go on forward without our vote, I don't know that it's within our authority to do that at this time. Thank you. Thank you. Um, Council Member Beard, then Council Member Blues. Thank you, Madam Chairman, Chairperson. I do that all the time. Uh, just blind habit, I guess. Um, most of those meetings involving the- the downtown master plan were attended by anywhere from 75 to 125 people. Um, maybe on a couple of occasions, as many as 200. One problem I had with it was that we did not go outside of the developer, architect, uh, downtown planning folks, that realm, and- and go to Andover, go to, uh, other areas of- of down- of rural Lexington or the suburban- suburban Lexington, and attempt to involve those people. Um, you know, our desire is for those people to embrace our downtown also for it to be successful. And, um, they've had no voice in any of this. And, um, you know, my take is, uh, as they did with the 2040, where they- they had focus group- groups and- and they had a much broader, uh, exposure to the whole community, uh, of what they were trying to do and everybody had a voice, uh, this was not the case with, uh, with the development of this plan. I'll give you one example. One of the... One whole evening, uh, was taken up by Eric St. Gross's, um, recommendation that every single spare piece of land in the downtown area, master plan area, should be built upon. And they then showed slides where they did photographically build upon every one of those spots and I remember specifically, because the chairperson was Tim Kelly, at Lexington Herald-Leader, uh, his ears jumped right off his head when he saw they had put a building right in the middle of his parking lot. And his employees, of course, had no - . ... no place at all to park at that point. And there was buildings, again, over in the, uh, uh, the Thoroughbred Park. And, um, the bank I was involved with, and one of the reasons why we purchased that building, uh, that parking lot, was, uh, was taken up by a building. Went through... The whole ci-- downtown s-- uh, area within the master plan scope and, um, it... The idea of presenting something like that to us flawed the whole process for me. Um, and maybe I shouldn't have, uh, r- reacted like that, but I thought now, here's some folks that, that s- that sit up in Washington DC and th- are deciding our fate, so to speak, and they come down here and spend an hour and a half with us wi- with some slideshows and then go back to Washington DC and thank you very much, send money now and we'll, then we'll come back another time. Um, so I was not real impressed with, with, with the whole process to begin with and that's why I think that we need to dig into these various and sundry recommendations and find out just what they mean. Uh, again, as I mentioned a little earlier, convert all one-way streets to two-way. All is a pretty, uh, finite, uh, word that, uh, means exactly what it sounds like and, um, while I'm not sure that I agree with, um, all, I, um, I do agree with some and we have to find out where that some may end. Some may end up as all, but, um, because I'm not the only decider, but at the same time, I think we have to go through the process. Thank you, Madam Chairman. Thank you. Council Member Blues. Thank you, Madam Chair. Uh, I seconded this motion because I, uh, am sym- sympathetic to, to the, uh, to the idea that, uh, Council Member Martin, I think stated very well, that the downtown, uh, master plan ... Excuse me. Provides a coherent vision, that it is a concept piece. Uh, it, it, it, it does provide us with a, uh, you know, a many, uh, many faceted, uh, uh, concept or vision for, uh, for downtown, which is what we need. I ... I agree with Council Member Beard that we need to dig in and see what each one means, uh, working on particular, uh, particular projects, particular details, uh, measuring, uh, what we want in relation to what we can, we can do. What I think a vote to, you know, to move this forward and adopt the plan by the council, I think what it accomplishes and I think, uh, as, as Council Member James', uh, good question, uh, asked, what does it accomplish? I think it accomplishes, uh, uh... I think what it accomplishes is to provide us with a, a set of, of, of goals and objectives, many of which are already in, in progress, some of which we need to be working on. None, uh, you know, none, uh, uh, less important than form-based codes. So I'm in favor of moving it forward because it, it, it provides us with, as I say, a coherent, uh, a coherent set of, of goals and objectives to work for and work toward, uh, many of which we've already, uh, we've already started on. So I, I, I think this does provide us with, uh, uh, with, with a, with a manageable vision for working on, on downtown. Uh, we should have done this a lot sooner, should have been to work on this a lot sooner. Thank you, Madam Chair. Council Member Lawless? Um, thank you and by adopting this overall guide and vision, we are not putting anything into law. We're not saying, all one-way streets have to be. These are recommendations. It's part of an overarching vision and guide. And, and I know I'm repeating myself. Um, I would like to ask, uh, Council Member James, I'm not quite sure, I'm kind of lost on what your concern is with DDA and this, and I guess DDA certainly, um, they are the ones that kind of spearheaded my understanding and coordinated this study being done, but certainly, um, there probably are ordinances that need to happen and clearly they have not and could not probably have the ability to carry out all of these. And certainly, like you say, they haven't been involved in the lyric or any part of that, and my hope is that by adopting this, we can also see some other entities being brought into the implementation of, of some of these things that are important and also digging into each and every one and see which one, I mean, this is something that is, uh, should be a living document that is revisited every couple of years at least, as we grow and as we... ... um, move forward, so I guess I- I'd like... So that's my understanding. Certainly, a lot of these things have been accomplished, were not accomplished by the DDA or accomplished by the DDA in a silo without a lot of other people working on it. So... Yeah. I'd be happy to respond to that. I am not... I'm not against necessarily the recommendations in the Downtown Master Plan. Um, again, I love to talk about issues, so I mean, I'm not anti-discussion of issues, but what I am against is the establishment of an authority to do such things and then... It's like telling your... You know, bragging that your child can ride a bike all by themselves and you're holding the seat the whole time. If we're gonna give authority and power to an entity, then they need to be able to ride without us holding the seat and then come to us as needed. I agree with you that DD day... DDA does not have the authority to pass ordinances. That's our legislative pow... That's what we do. That's our responsibility. But if you read thoroughly, the DDA document, it does say, number one, "Facilitate development and redevelopment projects in Fayette County." Th... It gives specific instructions, "Develop and coordinate implementation of downtown neighborhood plans." Develop and coordinate. So where it might not be... I mean, we can do it, but what does it mean? What does it mean? And, and Council Member Blues talked about what it accomplishes. I think it accomplishes that by which the authority exists. So we give faith. We have faith and trust in an entity and an authority to do something. Because that authority exists, we leave it to them to do what they're supposed to do to get to the point where we then engage in the process where we should be, which is the passage of the ordinances and resolutions, um, transfers of property, um, um, acceptance of grants related to certain projects. I think we do have a role, but I don't think our role is to take plans and micromanage those plans or adopt those plans, because Council Member Lawless said, "This doesn't put into law anything." Well, if it doesn't put into law anything, why do it? This does not say that... mandate we... that we have all one-ways converted two-w... Then why do it? Why pass something if what we're doing doesn't mean anything? And I think we need to give the authority... If we don't want to give the authority to DDA, we want to do that, then we need to rescind this. We need to look at our Article 40 and say, "They're just advisory, they're not authority, we don't want them to do anything on their own." So that's, that's my only concern is that we make sure that we are giving them their authority and placing our role where it should be, 'cause I don't ever want it to be twisted that an authority can't do something waiting on council to do something. We should be brought information, at which time we then do what we are obligated to do, which is to pass laws and ordinances. Um, okay. Uh, I will call on Council Member Feigl, and then I would like to turn the chair over to vice-chair of the committee, Tom Blues, if that is all right with you, Council Member Lawless. Well, I haven't had an opportunity to speak yet, so... Council Member Feigl? Um, I was just, uh, reading this document that, uh, that we just had passed out to us. And this is new information to me and apparently the powers and duties of this authority are given by the state statute. So, I think before we start questioning what we can do and, and what powers they have, we may need a legal interpretation of exactly what the state sat- statute empowers them to do. Um, and I don't see an attorney here to answer that question. Uh, Council Member Blues, will you take the chair? Be happy to do so. Thank you. Council Member Gordon? Um, yes. Uh, Chris and Paul, I guess these first questions are for you. Is September 21st, 2006 when the Planning Commission adopted the master plan, Downtown Master Plan? September 21st, 2006? I don't believe so. I'd have to check the records. But it was the principles, the 16 points, with some caveats were what were adopted by the Planning Commission and enfolded into the comprehensive plan. Why, at the bottom... I don't know if you got a copy of this, Chris. Um, maybe, Paul, would you give... At the bottom of the first page of this information, it says, "It was the consensus of the Planning Commission that the core principles in the DDA's Downtown Master Plan, subject to further review and discussion, are principles that the commission will support as part of the comprehensive plan." So, if I understand that correctly, the, um, Planning Commission accepted the core principles, assuming that individual recommendations would be further reviewed and discussed. Is that... Certain ones, that's correct. Is that a correct understanding of this? Yes, and I have the dates wrong, I apologize, but we did not... Commission did not adopt the plan, uh, until spring of 2007. Okay. It could have been as, as part of the process, they made a decision, an incremental decision- Okay. ... to fold those in the plan. So they adopted it spring of 2007. Council received it June 5th, 20- 2007. And, um, as I look through these 16 recommendations, probably at least half of them are already being worked on without us adopting the master plan. Um, number three, converting streets to two-way, we've already discussed that, and some of that is underway. We've created the parking authority. Number nine, UK and the Lexington Center Corporation are working on that, the integrating Rupp Arena. Um, number 11, creating an amphitheater, that's in the hands of Lexington Center Corporation, from what I understand. Um, number 15, um, this council has taken action on the cheap side location for the farmer's market. And number 16, the down, the Town Branch Trail, as I recall, uh, we included that in the TIF. That's in the TIF application. So, it, it is a little confusing, because, um, and, and I guess, um, historically, I think the parking authority came before the master plan. If I recall, it was presented by a former mayor before the master plan was even on the table. Um, so these are kind of... Are they kind of working their way to council through the DDA or what, what's your sense of that? Certainly. Um, if you don't mind, if I may back up and just- Back up, that's fine. ... briefly say that the downtown master plan process was designed and carried out by the DDA. Yes. And primarily through, I think, private funding, if I recall correctly, that they solicited, um, and, and had that processed. Yes. We talked at the very beginning, did we want this DDA process to be something that would end up being in the community's official adopted comprehensive plan? Because of the many downtown studies and initiatives run through the years, none of the others had, except for back to the 1960-something downtown master plan. So we decided we would do that. We then, as a division planning working through the CAO and the mayor's office, provided assistance to the process. We did not run it. We did not manage it. We provided assistance to Harold. We reviewed and engaged in some very spirited conversations with ASG over many of the recommendations and approach that they brought. And in the end, as the product came out, I think the, the s- the... As a planner who has prepared many different types of plan, to categorize this as a vision plan rather than a strategic plan is dead on, and really tells you where this process ended up. So it gave us a lot of things to think about, a lot of things to try to do as a way to make our downtown the place we need and want it to be. After the DDA had finished their work, I know we had a ma- a meeting between Harold and the chairman of the planning commission as we were moving through the process of the comprehensive plan, and agreed together that given comments both from Harold's board, Harold, um, that everyone was comfortable with the adoption of these major 16 visionary principles be included in the comprehensive plan. A couple of them with some caveats that they needed additional study before they could be implemented. Um, and the ones that were pretty much dealt with there would be establishing the form-based building guidelines and converting all the one-way streets to two-way. Uh, item number one, changing the land use recommendations of the comprehensive plan, we accomplished virtually that through the adoption of the comprehensive plan, the way we changed how we viewed the downtown and deferred in the comprehensive plan to the recommendations of the DDA master plan. So we feel that that, number one, is by and large- Is finished. ... been accomplished, yes. Mm-hmm. And we have been using those recommendations of the DD plan in support of specific zone change and development applications. The form-based building guidelines, again, I can, I can talk about. That's another item on the a- the agenda, and we can talk about where we are and what we've been talking about and what is involved in changing our, uh, regulatory process to a form base. We're adding it as a parallel or a hybrid. There's lots of different ways to do that. Mm-hmm. Well- Um, but, uh, that conversation and that research has been ongoing. Mm-hmm. And as you know, we've been discussing that to great degree in the last two meetings, a joint between the workshops between the council and the planning commission- Mm-hmm. ... which I think are excellent, and that's where that needs to be. Well, and I think that, um, if I recall, the... As to whether to adopt the motion or not that's on the table, w- when this came to planning committee before, the planning committee probably in 2008 decided that since it was, if... Now, I'm just sort of trying to remember this, that since it was already adopted by the planning commission, that the planning committee at that time chose not to do anything with it. And, um, so I guess I'm thinking that the motion that's on the table would be more of an, uh, affirmation of, like the planning commission said, the core principles, rather than the recommendations. And I think that's excellent, and I think the suggestions from the table, that you then take it to the next level. Mm-hmm. Look at each of these in detail. ... review what has been done so far, what needs to be done, what should be done, and then to set a more strategic action plan is an outstanding idea- Mm-hmm. ... and assign responsibility and accountability for that- Mm-hmm. ... I think would be a very beneficial and would show the commu- uh, community that, that, that you are moving forward. I think there's a lot more that's gone on than people know. And there's a lot of things in here that people think are in here that aren't in here, like many big visionary documents. And, and to have a full discussion of that, I think is excellent. Mm-hmm. And I notice, uh, that Harold Tate has arrived. I appreciate, I know you had conflicts today. The motion on the table, Harold, is to, um, accept the... adopt the downtown master plan in a resolution form and my question to you, uh, would be, um, whether you feel, I mean, as the Downtown Development Authority, um, do you feel you have the authority to go ahead with the master plan a- anyway? Yes. And, and we- That's- ... have been. And I think that's one of the things Chris- That's what I thought. ... was indicating, is that we've been moving ahead with these recommendations because some things don't require, you know- Council. ... something from the council. Right. Some we do need help on and just like last fall, no, last spring, just not too long ago, we worked on a one-way versus two-way. So that was another thing that we could, you know, say we got worked out through the, the council process. Uh, working with Chris, we have. We've been able to create many new zones and categories and there's gonna be more. I mean, that, that's gonna be an ongoing process. Mm-hmm. Um, so I think the documentation, I believe that was handed out to you all, did you all get a copy of this? Okay. Yeah. Yes. That's kinda like a summary of where we are at this point on each of these recommendations. And you'll see that when we did the streetscape plan, that took care of a... many additional items in the, uh, recommendations as well. Um, thank you very much. Thank you, Mr. Vice-Chair. Most welcome, uh... Uh, well, we have Council Member Lawless again, right? And c- or not? No, okay. Council Member Blues on the motion. Thank you, Madam Chair. I, I would just add here that I think another im- very important thing that we accomplished by, by moving this forward is that we, we put this master plan, uh, within the council's, uh, uh, area of responsibility. So that we can go, go back to, uh, th- the Division of Planning, other divisions. We can go back to the Downtown, uh, Development Authority, so that we can say, uh, "We wanna move forward on this. We wanna work on this particular, uh, recommendation. Uh, we'd like an update on this particular recommendation." And, and, and so on. Uh, it, it, it affirms the, uh, the importance of this, uh, of this body of, of, of goals and objectives. And it, and it does speak, I think, to, i- it sends the message to the, to the community that we are indeed, uh, serious as a council about moving forward with our, uh, you know, with, with, with the downtown which is, you know, all, all of the citizens', uh, uh, main concern. So, thank you, Madam Chair. Council Member Beard. Thank you, Madam Chair. See, that's much easier. Uh, I guess this document here is what gives me a s- somewhat of a problem. And, um, the bold down at the bottom of that document, there is a qualifier in there, so I'm not sure that the Planning Commission, if that, if this is exactly what the Planning Commission did, um, actually, uh, approve the downtown master plan and adopted it, because it says, "Subject to further review and discussion." Uh, which means that they weren't totally sure on all the, a- at least all or some of these items, if not all, and thought further discussion was needed at their level. I just wanted to bring that to everybody's attention so that, uh... And, and Harold, you may know, or for that matter, Chris may know exactly what, um, what that means and, and whether that was, uh, something that was, uh, added as an afterthought, or wha- was there some qualifying comments made by the, the Planning Commission? 'Cause, I, I mean, you can't have it both ways. You either adopt it or you don't adopt it. You, it's not, you can't have a definite maybe. Right. This isn't the exact language that was adopted by the commission. This is a summary that was prepared by Harold for you all of, of what was done and I can get the actual language. But let me give you an example. Um, when we talked to the Planning Commission, l- let's, let's use form-based codes. It's that one. Everybody said, "You know, there's a lot of buzz around that around the country. There's a lot of interest in doing that. Um, there has to be a long-term commitment to that. Um, first thing, you have to decide you're gonna do it, you're gonna fund it, you're gonna fund the studies, you're gonna fund the staff, you follow it all the way through. You have to, to go into it." And also, if you see, the consultant made specific recommendations on six character elements. Well, that barely scratches the surface of what a true form-based code usually does. And even within that, there were questions. If you took these principles and applied them to certain existing downtown buildings, for instance, you might find that some you didn't like complied and some you did like, didn't. When we did those kinds of reviews. So, our feeling was, we weren't going to take his recommendations of his firm as gospel and turn it into law immediately. Planning Commission said, "We need more study, we need more buy-in from the community." Um, and, and therefore, we liked the idea. We think it has merit, but we, we've got to take an ordered step process in order to get there. I think the same thing was true about, uh, the one to two-lane streets. There was a lot of interest. There was a lot of support among the Planning Commission for that, but there were no cost figures. The Planning Commission had no control over any budgetary aspect of that, and therefore, that's the council's decision primarily on the cost that would be associated with it. We did fund a transportation study that showed that there would be more congestion and whether the community would agree that in order to go two-way, having more congestion downtown was a good thing or a bad thing. So again, that's where we were in 2007. They liked the ideas, they liked the vision. They weren't necessarily sure about some of the details that the consultant had recommended and felt they needed further study. Well- Well, and that- ... I think that's been going on. ... that, that really is, is kind of what I've been saying all along in, in vetting all these i- issues. Uh, if they, in fact, weren't 100% on board with it, they did not adopt. I mean, the, it's, it's contradictory to say that they adopted something if in fact they've got, uh, f- fourteen, uh, weasel holes that they can slide through to, uh - Well, I, I wouldn't call them that. I would just call them as, on anything, it's, it's like supporting the idea. How can I, how can I explain it? I, I, I guess I did. That they like the idea, they like the direction, but they didn't necessarily buy into the details that were expressed in the plan on how you get there. It's kind of like I might decide a vision I'd like to be healthy, wealthy, and wise. Okay. That means then from there- Two out of three isn't bad. Well, I'm neither healthy or wealthy . In fact, so I probably oh, for three, but we'll, we'll go with that. But, and that's a vision. And strategically I might say, "Okay, you've got to stop having lunch at Sam's Hot Dog stand or, you know, I need to bring a salad." I mean, I need to exercise more. Measurable, identifiable things. So, you know, I might choose to exercise more and still eat at Sam's. You know, that's an option. And I think that's the kind of approach that, um, that folks on the Planning Commission were thinking about. They were very supportive of the process. They were very supportive of the vision for downtown and very supportive of most of the specific principles. But on a couple of them, they felt, and I think also the DDA board, because we did consult with Harold, um, that they felt that some of these needed more study as well. Thank you, Chris. I, I, again, this just reinforces what I'm saying about, uh, us having to do some front end work, uh, before we put a rubber stamp on, on something that, uh, uh, actually is somewhat, uh, contradictory in, in the way it's worded anyway. Thank you. Uh, Council Member James. Thank you, Madam Chair. A- again, this is great conversation. I, I think typically I would love it to be able to have this kind of, um, feedback and, and interest on all issues in Lexington. I'm, I'm very involved, very engaged, love it, um, think it's very important. The, the role in which we're acting today is assuming that DDA is an advisory and not an authority. And I think we, we need to be cautious and very careful in what we're doing. I, you know, what we, what we've accomplished, what we accomplished by doing that. I mean, I, we can all be cheerleaders for certain issues. I don't think it takes it off my radar if it doesn't pass through committee. It's been on my radar since we got on council, um, looking for this and we've talked about it in many different facets. So a- again, my, if I vote no today, it doesn't mean that I don't support the things moving forward, I just want the authority to be... I mean, think about the way it's set up. They have an advisory board. Why would we give an advisory board an advisory board? So an advisory board has an advisory board to advise them, and then they advise us and they come back and we go to committee and then we advise council to move forward. That just, it doesn't, it, they're supposed to be an authority. They should be work for- working forward, bringing ordinances forward just as they did with Streetscape. As a recommendation, we heard a lot of complaints that we didn't hear a lot about what was going on with Streetscape. It's very controversial. And one of the intentions of authorities is to take the political, um, aspect out of it and to do what's right for our city as a whole. Um, and I think it happens with parking and I think it should happen with downtown development as per this statute, if that's what we want. If we don't want that, as set forth by... ... Chapter 58 of the statutes, then we need to resend, um, anything that we have that establishes our authority, um, establishes ours. We can resend that and tr- and create an advisory board of folks that talk to us about downtown development. So again, let's just be clear on what we're doing. And it's not that I'm anti any of these projects, I just think they either have the authority or they don't, and we just need to clarify that. Thank you. Council member Martin? Thank you, m- Madam Chair. Uh, as I understand it, the, the Downtown Development Authority is a quasi-governmental agency. It's a, what we would call a de jure public corporation. I think similar to the airport, uh, similar to my experience in Frankfurt, uh, the, the, something like the Bluegrass State Skills Corporation. These types of agencies are, are important because you need to give them certain vested corporate authority, uh, to take actions. Uh, but in the end of the day, they still have to, they are still agencies, uh, of the, the city of Lexington, uh, the Fayette Urban County government. Uh, they are, uh, an instrumentality, eh, but they are a corporation that pursues a public purpose, uh, for the, uh, public and government, um, benefit. Um, these are set up this way for particular legal benefits, so they can take particular actions that are more difficult for a ci- just a city agency to take, like the, you know, uh, like Mr. King's department. They have a little bit more flexibility than a governmental planning department. And so, they are set up for ... in, in many of these ways for that purpose. Why does the council input needed? I think is because the council spends the money. We, you know, we have funds and we, uh, uh, approve, uh, ordinances. And I th- think that this is a, uh, a way for the council to s- uh, basically give direction to the DDA. Just because they're set up as this quasi-public agency do- doesn't mean that we don't have some stake in it. It's, we have a very large stake in it. Uh, we, uh, it's our downtown, it's our city, and, and I think we partner with them 'cause they're an agency of us, to, to set the agenda and to, and to, uh, reach a consensus about the direction of downtown Lexington. Because at the end of the day, they have to come to us for funds in order to pursue that. Um, the, the downtown deve- um, master plan is a vision document, and it's not intended to be v- specific. It's supposed to be very general. The specifics come later, I think, and it is a, a vision document that, uh, uh, in, in which, um, a, a consensuses is built. And so, it's not intended to give specifics about how do you achieve those things or whe- whether there might be exceptions or whether the, there might be a, a zig or a zag that might mean, might be needed. So, uh, I guess I would en- encourage us to, th- th- the committee to do this, I'm afraid that a vote of no would, might be a no, vote of no confidence, uh, in the, in the, the downtown plan. And I think that, uh, uh, given that they've already made some progress, they may ... I, I, I think it would give them clear direction and the city clear direction to, to sort of move ahead, c- get their work done, then come back to the council when they need approvals. Thank you, Madam Chair. Thank you. Council member Blue. Thank you, Madam Chair. I ... Uh, I'm concerned, um, that, that, that there's an impression here that the council should, should just wait for things to come forward to us based on, on this plan, uh, from the DDA. The ultimate authority is the council, and the council needs to be the, uh, the leader in this. As, as, as Council member Martin says that this is our downtown. This is all citizens downtown. We need to be centrally and aggressively involved in this development. And we wanna work with Harold, with the DDA on this. Uh, and we want, I think, I, and I hope, we want to uh, send a clear signal that we are crucially involved in our downtown that we have here a coherent uh, vision statement. It's not, uh, uh, it's not something that is, uh, uh, uh, you know, that is a detailed pattern that we're just stamping out step by step. But that, but that we've set up here some, some serious goals and objectives with which we work with the authority, we work with other entities, we work with the private sector, we work to bring about this, this vision. So I think we ... it's, it's, it's absolutely crucial that we, uh, that we pass this motion. Thank you, Madam Chair. Council member James? Thank you. Um, Council member Martin said that his thought is that a vote of no is a vote of no confidence, and I think, um, to each person, um, their vote of no, if they feel such, could qualify that. And for me, a vote of no would not be, and I've already stated, would not be a lack of confidence. Um, it actually is a vote of confidence because what it's saying is that I'm giving the authority to the entity to take care of that, an actual vote of feeling that we need to, to babify an issue to the point of where we're parenting it is a vote of no confidence. We need to have confidence in authorities or, or disestablish those authorities. If they do not -- we don't want to give the power to them and we would like to micromanage, we could take those back. Dictionary.com defines authority, "The power to determine, adjudicate, or otherwise settle issues or disputes. Jurisdiction: the right to control, command, or determine." The DDA, as established by KRS 58 and by our Article 40, establishes them as authority. We need to allow them to do so. In no way does this is a vote of lack of confidence. It's a vote of confidence. We need to establish the authority, allow them to do... Well, it's already established we need to give power to them. Allow them to have that power and vote on things as it comes forward to council, not a blanket overall vote of whatever they might choose to do, but what they actually do complete, and then start tracking those things. Thank you. Uh, Harold, could you answer a question? Um, and then I have a clarification for Council Member Lawless- Sure. ... and her motion. In the Downtown Development Authority piece- Mm-hmm. ... um, which Council Member James distributed, uh, section 2-429, item 4 says that, "The duties of the development authority shall include, but not be limited to, the following," and number four says, "Develop and coordinate the implementation of downtown neighborhood area wide and corridor plans and policies of the urban county government." Um, do you see the Downtown Master Plan without council, um, uh, backing as a policy of the urban county government- I- ... if it hasn't received official, um, support of some sort? I think on that what I'd have to say is it... as I said before, although the council hasn't, quote, "approved" it or endorsed it, we are moving ahead with the implementation of those... of the entire plan as, as we move forward, as a means to... as a way to develop our downtown. So, if you have a corridor plan that's not a... I'm just pulling this- Sure. ... out of the air because it's in the KRS. Mm-hmm. If you have a corridor plan that's not adopted by the council, do you think you have the authority to move forward on it- Probably no. ... since, since it's not an urban county government plan? So, would you see it as some sort of a... I mean, if the, if the council were to adopt the basic vision of the Downtown Master Plan, would you see that as interfering with your authority? No. I would not see it as interfering. Yeah. Or maybe interfering isn't a good word, but it, it looks like you're supposed to be working on plans that have been adopted by the urban county government- Right. ... not plans that are your plans. Right. And that's why we have such a close relationship with planning, with engineering, with traffic, uh, and hopefully with you all so that these plans that are developed, that they are implemented. I mean, it looks like you can go forward with projects. Projects is your, a big responsibility of yours, but according to this, uh, KRS, it looks like plans, you know, downtown plans, neighborhood plans, corridor plans, should first be policies of the urban county government. Just like the streetscape plan was. Yes. Okay. Um, and then, so Council Member Lawless, is the intent of your motion... Uh, your motion was, is to adopt the Downtown Master Plan in resolution form. Is your motion to do this in detail, or is it to, um, do what the planning commission did, which was adopt the core principles for future implementation brought forward by the DDA? I'm trying to understand the intent of your motion. Is it to adopt 16 recommendations or is it to adopt- No. It- ... an overall vision? It is to adopt the overall vision. Okay. Thank you for that clarification. And, and the- Vice Mayor? Yep. Uh, thank you, Madam Chair. Um, actually my... I'm, uh, trying to get my arms around where we really are on this myself and, and yep, there is a motion and, um, you know, let me kind of put it in the context that I feel like, and I've got a couple of questions I'd like to ask Harold. Um, to me, this action by this council would be enormously important and symbolic and, um, and largely that is what it represents. Um, Harold, the concern that I've got is it... and from the comments that I hear from you, it's sort of like, well, we can take it or leave it. It really doesn't matter and I don't really think that's what you're saying. I would hope that's not what you're saying, because you've... I've heard you say that you've been before the council five times and, and, and that was used when there were conflicts, actions that had occurred that appeared to be or perceived to be in conflict with the principles of this Downtown Master Plan. So I don't... I mean, I think we should equip you as much as possible with all the tools that you need to get the job done. So I, I'm hoping that you are an advocate for our action- Yes, I am. ... and support of the plan, right? Right. You are? Yes, I am. Okay, so- Can I answer it? Can I, can I say? Yeah, sure. Sure. Because okay, back on, on recommendation number two, it says, "Establish form-based building guideline." It says establish. I'm assuming if you all go ahead today and say, "We wanna adopt this." Then we, we go back and we start looking at those guidelines for you all to come back- Well- ... to the planning commission and to you. Well, l- l- l- l- let, let's instead of, instead of dropping down on the ground, if we can stay up to 10,000- Okay. ... feet for a second because I'm, I'm still thinking context here. When did we f- When was the work for the mas- master plan started? When was that initiated? 2006? Five? Six. 2006. So, you know, lotta energy, lotta calories went into it. I've heard you say more than 1,500 people were engaged in it. Uh, you know, you had a steering committee. Um, so and, and that represented then, uh, together that effort, together with the effort of the consultants, all together represented the f- the plan. Right. All right? So I often think when we think, when we use the word plan, sometimes we use that language and we think of it as static rather than a living document or a living vision. You know, Eisenhower had a good language. He said, "Plans are made so they can be intelligently changed." And our, you know, your challenge, our challenge is to acknowledge that that's really what this is. As Council Member Stennet was saying earlier, it's a framework. Right. Within these, within these principles, there will continue to be debate and dialog and difference of opinion, dissent. We'll move forward on some. Right. You know, we won't get as far on some. We'll drop back on some. Uh, so my sense is, even though I don't agree with all of these principles- Mm-hmm. ... I don't necessarily agree with, you know, all two-way traffic- Right. ... right now, I still have a belief that symbolically and on balance, this represents a really, really important document that we n- we should embrace. And, and so I just wanna make sure that, that we were on the same plane. Yeah. That you're not take it or leave it. Nope. That you really believe that all this work that's been put into this and the fact that you've been using it as a template and a guide, that you would be even better equipped, we would be, to achieve the pillars that we have said, imaginative and innovative urban planning- Right. ... through the council's active support and endorsement of it. And I would also hope just as the comprehensive plan, we review it every five years? Oh, I- We would do the same thing on this. So a- and we're all, we're, we're, part of our motion could be that it's time up for a, for a, for reset, for a reevaluation, right? I mean, you're in the fifth year already. We're, that's w- that's why I mentioned that. I mean, I would, I would certainly en- en- endorse that it's as much as, as much as we all have said the, the value and importance of, of the urban fabric is, is to downtown is to our economy, you know, to going forward that it's, uh, that part of this plan means, uh, renewing it. Taking a fresh look at it. Council Member Ehlinger? Thank you, Chair. I guess just to sum up, I would be voting for this if I'm for the concept and the vision, but I wouldn't have to necessarily be for, as the vice mayor said, all one-way streets or two-way streets in. So there, I still might not have agreed with everything, but I agree with the vision and the concept. Thank you. Anyone else? Council Member Feigl? Um, thank you, um, Madam Chair. To follow up on, uh, Councilman Ehlinger's comment, while we may not agree with every one of the concepts in this, uh, document, how will future council members interpret this if we pass it as a master plan? Will they not look back on this and, and, um, assume assume that we all were in favor of everything in here? Council Member James? Thank you. I, I know I've probably gone over my allotted time, but just real quick. Um, I've heard some words of, of folks that are supporting this vision, concept and symbolism and, um, I, I just wanna be sure that we understand, I mean, votes sh- um, really should be, well, they don't have to be consistent, but it would be great to be consistent and at other times we've, we've talked about other projects and other things and vision, concept and symbolism have kinda taken a backseat to other things. So it's, it's kind of, um, it's kind of a, a, I don't know, it's an awakening moment for me to see that at times when we, um, have an ability to, to really do what, um, is by our law, um, and the authority given to an entity, um, we decide to support based on symbolism, vision and concept, and I would just look for consistency in those council members that are doing so. Thank you. Are there any other council member... Council Member Baird? Let, let me reiterate how I feel about this and I think... I- I'm not negative about the idea of adopting this plan. All I wanna do is work with it a little bit. It was just handed to us when we walked in the door. And, um, you know, obviously have not had a, had a chance to really dig into this thing and, and see what, what it entails. It also, um, just looking at the agenda, and I see nothing in there about adopting a master, Downtown Master Plan. I see, talking about recommendation number two, and status recommendations on the rest. And I don't see anything about dow- uh, uh, the adopting of the d- the, uh, Downtown Master Plan, so it's probably, we're out of order anyway. Well, I think the number two issue is Downtown Master Plan, so... And since the recommendations are all in the packet, I think any motion on the Downtown Master Plan is legitimate, is my, what I would say. Um, and then council member, uh, I mean, Vice Mayor Gray. Thank... Although, I don't necessarily, um... Well, I'll, I'll, I'll say I think what... I'll change what I was gonna say. I think what Council Member Beard I was gonna say I didn't agree with him necessarily, but then I decided it'd be better to say it in a different way. I, what Julie, what Council Member Beard said, um, about maybe being more informed is, could be useful. I'm gonna vote for the motion, and I would suggest that we also create a, uh, or a, maybe set a workshop especially dedicated to update on the, on the plan. Maybe not just an update, but a review. You know, let's go back through this thing and let's spend, you know, several hours. Let's go ahead and commit to it, if we can, and, um, and bring- Thank you. ... bring folks who are maybe perhaps newer to the council. Um, it was new to me three years ago, so might be a useful exercise for us to do that through a workshop. So I'll make a motion to that effect after, if, when, if that's appropriate, Madam Chair. Second. Okay. Other comments from council members on the motion on the floor? And the motion on the floor is to adopt the Downtown Master Plan, core principles and vision as a resolution. Is that correct, Council Member Lawless? Yes. With no detail of any recommendations. Is that correct? All right. So the motion is on the floor. Um, will all those in favor, please raise your hand, right hand? Four, five, six, seven, eight. Eight. And those opposed? Two. Well, we have two, with a a third rogue vote. So, um, that motion is adopted. And then, were there other motions to come forward? Uh, I, I'd like to make a motion to, um, uh, create a workshop or to, um, establish a workshop. What's the language I'm looking for? I'm looking for a verb here. To schedule a workshop? Schedule a workshop, yes. Uh, ask the DDA to, uh, develop it and schedule a workshop, uh, with council members to review the, um, the history of the Downtown Master Plan. Um- Is your motion... Is there second? Um, yeah, that's it. I would second that. Okay. And does your, does your motion, it, it, uh, it's with the full council? Uh, yeah. Okay. Yes, ma'am. And, um, try to s- get that, maybe get that, um, soon as we can after the break. Are there questions on the motion? Break. If not, those in favor, please say, "Aye." Any opposed? All right, so the workshop will need to be scheduled after council summer break, uh, maybe toward the end of August or beginning of September. Um, thank you very much. Now, um, Chris, I think that the... Let me ask the committee. I think the issue of number 2A might be a moot point. Uh, can- committee, do you want to hear anything today on the form base guidelines, or do you wanna wait until the workshop on the 30th, the joint workshop? Okay. If, um... I do thank you, uh, very much Chris and, um, Harold. Now, uh, if you will turn, council members, to the last page, uh, to look at our items in committee. Um, the, uh, Council Member Lane asked me to go ahead and remove the third item from the bottom, which is the extended stay zoning, and he put that into committee. So could I hear a motion to that effect? So moved. I'm sorry. Did somebody move? Council Member James moved. Do I hear a second? Second. Thank you. The third item from the bottom, extended stay zoning. This is on the last page of your packet. Um, Council Member Lane felt that the issues had been resolved. So we have a motion and a second to remove that item from committee. Any discussion? All those in favor, say aye. Aye. Anyone opposed? Okay. Um, are there other items to be removed? We'll keep the Loudoun Avenue phase one on and have a report in August. Um, is there any other issue that council members would like to remove? Madam Chair. Yes, Council Member James. I don't have one to remove, but I do have, um, a request that we hear as soon as possible, the tree ordin- protection ordinance. Um, there are few, you may, I don't read the paper very much, but I've heard that there's been some articles going on regarding some private developers removing street trees along major corridors, and I think that there may be, um, a need to hear this as soon as possible. So I was gonna request- Is, is there a specific, um, ordinance change that'll come forward or what is the- Yes. ... what do we specifically... There will be- Um, article seven, it's article 17, and it would just have to do with, um, planting requirements and... I think- Okay. Planting requirements, tree protection, and maybe tree canopy or something. I don't know specific words. Are, are you working with law to bring that ordinance change? We could hear it in August. Um, I can work with law. I think we, we do have someone from law on our tree board, um, but I can make sure that law is engaged in that conversation before that time. So they'll bring forth an ordinance change? Yeah. Okay. Very good. We'll hear that in August then if it suits, and I believe the student housing task force will be ready in September, but I wouldn't wanna be held to that 100%. But that's probably gonna be a September item. Uh, any other information about any of the items on our outstanding issues? I think at the end of the year, if, uh, both Paul and I try to check with council members who have an issue in committee, and, uh, at the end of the year, we need to think seriously about the issues that were put in in 2007, whether they can be heard this year, and if not, whether they should drop off or what the future holds. So thank you very much, and I have a motion to adjourn. Second. Second. All those in favor, say aye. Aye. Anybody opposed? Motion is adjourned. Bags for the cleanup. To volunteer yourself, your vote, or both, or if you need more information, call 425-2255 or 311. ... whole thing. But I was never gonna be the same. What a lady, what a night. Oh, I, I got a funny feeling when she walked in the room. As I recall, it ended far too soon. Oh, what a night. Hypnotizing, mesmerizing me. She was everything I dreamed she'd be. Sweet surrender, what a night. Oh. I don't... Every Saturday now through August the 29th, come downtown for the 2009 Artist Market, brought to you by the Downtown Lexington Corporation. Located in the plaza of the Lexington Financial Center, across Main Street from the new farmer's market location at Cheifside Park, the Artist Market is a small, informal arts and crafts showcase featuring local, well-known, and emerging artists and their works. The Artist Market is open from 8:00 AM to 2:00 PM. Artist registration varies weekly, so plan to stop in each week to see exciting, new, and different artists and their unique works of art. For more information, go to the Downtown Lexington Corporation's website, www.downtownlex.com. Seemed so long, but now it seems so right. What a lady, what a night. They oughta run your picture in a magazine. 'Cause you're the hardest working woman I've ever seen. If you weren't sinkin' in a river of debt. I'd say quit that job and let him do it himself. I know we're dependant on every dime. But I'm tired of you working that all the time. I'm gonna tell somebody. There oughta be a law against working that way. Tell him. You're taking off this Friday for the national working woman's holiday. Honey, I can tell you're feeling the strain. You deserve a break from that ball and chain. If you won't say it, then it's up to me. Do you enjoy great music, food, and fun? Then bring the whole family down to Cheapside Park and Central Bank Thursday Night Live. Thursday Night Live features the best in live local entertainment, great food from local restaurants, and a lively, family-friendly atmosphere. The fun runs from 4:30 to 8:00 PM every Thursday through October 15th, and admission is free. Food and drink are available for cash purchase. So, if you are looking for a great place to relax and enjoy live music, come down to Central Bank Thursday Night Live at Cheapside beside the Lexington History Museum. I'm calling in sick and I'll be telling the truth. 'Cause I'm sick and tired of how they're treating you. I'm gonna tell somebody. There oughta be a law against working that way. Tell him. You're taking off this Friday for the national working woman's holiday. I'm gonna tell somebody. There oughta be a law against working that way. Tell him. You're taking off this Friday for the national working woman's holiday. 'Cause I can do anything. Giving you everything. I'm the master of my fate. I can face the future because I'm giving you everything. There is only one place in Lexington where you can enjoy a newly released kid-friendly movie, children's games, special entertainment, and a petting zoo, all for free. It's Free Friday Flicks at Jacobson Park. Coming back for its 14th year, this family event offers a great evening of entertainment for everyone of all ages. Pre-show activities begin at 7:00 PM, and the movie will start at dark. Bring your lawn chairs, blankets, and pack a picnic dinner or purchase concessions from one of the many vendors on site. Please note that neither pets nor open flames are allowed in the event area for the safety of the patrons. Free Friday F-